Here I am

EZ as boost fooler only with DD2s-- interesting results

Attention: TDR Forum Junkies
To the point: Click this link and check out the Front Page News story(ies) where we are tracking the introduction of the 2025 Ram HD trucks.

Thanks, TDR Staff

Is my son being TAKEN ???? Help

Magna Flow 4in Exhaust System

Well, based on a tip (thanks RustyJC), I decided to try my EZ as a boost fooler only, and run just my DD2s. Results:



Way smoother. Engine is much quieter, more driveable, and just seems a LOT happier



Better Cruise Control operation



Way less bottom end torque



Turbo spools slower



Peak boost is THE SAME (29-30psi)



Clutch is definitely happier



I am expecting a MPG increase for a couple reasons. First, the timing might be closer to optimum, instead of over-advanced with the injectors AND the EZ. Second, I can't get the truck to smoke. Worst I have been able to do is a tiny little puff. This is over 6K elevation. I think that the EZ with the injectors gave me a little more aggressive timing and fueling than I want for putzing around town.



I am going to run a few tanks this way and see if I really DO get better mpg with the EZ's timing and fueling disabled.



The smoothness of just the injectors has to be experienced to be believed. Cruising at 70, the engine seems like it couldn't be happier. It feels like it's not having to work as hard. The engine is also quite a bit quieter when cold and when idling. The EZ gave it a little spunk.



For now, I am going to leave it disconnected. I can't believe how the smoke just disappeared, even up here in the hills. I would think I can run a bigger injector with no problems, even up here.



More later,



Justin
 
0 level on EZ

Well, KLocklier must be smiling now;) I think that the DDFM level 1 setting is as you describe.



After installing RV275s, and uninstalling my EZ and boost elbow, I still got a puff of smoke at launch even with mild acceleration. So I reinstalled the EZ and and elbow and played around with settings 1 and 2. Not much difference in smoke at light acceleration, but setting 2 felt smoothest and most powerfull given my moderate driving style.



I'm sure the DD2s put out at least twice as much power as the 275s, so the comparison is skewed. I had occasion last night to follow my truck up and down the street with my wife driving and was dissappointed in the amount of smoke (as in too much). Now she's not in tune with the vehicle and doesn't like stick shifting, so she probably just pushed down on the throttle and never looked back for clouds. As much as I enjoy the Greatest Smoke Stories thread, I'm pretty self-conscious about it.



My concern now is towing my new 10K-lbs. 5th wheel. I've only towed it once, EZ on 1, no injectors. So for towing with injectors, I'll probably switch back to level 1, but I'm interested in "level 0" mode. So Hohn, could you explain in dummy terms for me, which part of the EZ is plugged in and which isn't for boost fooler only mode?



Thanks,

Neil
 
Re: 0 level on EZ

Originally posted by Boondocker

Well, KLocklier must be smiling now;) I think that the DDFM level 1 setting is as you describe.

Neil,



Actually, the DD level 1 setting is timing but no fuel. With the data link cable unplugged, there's neither timing nor fuel. Insofar as configuration is concerned, just unplug the EZ's data link cable. Leave the MAP cabling hooked up - that's what will give you the boost fooler function.



Justin,



Thanks for the report. It sounds like my stock clutch might just survive this trip towing the 5th wheel. Even so, I'll be glad to get that Con OFE installed and broken in!



Rusty
 
Last edited:
NO prob, Rusty.



The thing that surprised me most (besides the incredible smoothness) was the boost variance, or the lack thereof at times.



Overall, boost seems to be down, given the same speed, incline, etc. This backs up the "feeling" that the engine isn't having to work as hard.



When you get on it, peak boost is about the same. That REALLY surprised me. Then I remembered that the EZ works within STOCK fueling parameters. Meaning, at WOT, you won't get any more fuel than maximum stock value. However, this may be different at different RPM. Say, for example that the ECM is setup to give MAX absolute fueling rate at 2700 rpm. The EZ can take this rate of fueling at put it anywhere (or everywhere) on the fueling map. So with the EZ, you can get 2700rpm worth of fueling at, say 1500 rpm if you have enough boost so activate the 100% part of the EZ (dependent upon jumper setting).

We can thus conclude that at peak HP (2700rpm), or peak fueling (same thing if you're burning it all) ALL of the power increase that the EZ is delivering is EXCLUSIVELY from timing-- not fueling. The EZ cannot increase fueling above the maximum allowable value programmed in the ECM.

This also explains why the EZ adds very little peak HP, but a LOT of off-peak hp. The EZ could theoretically change the fueling curve to a fueling plateau. I personally believe that's practically what it does on the most aggressive setting, since max fuel comes in at only 3 psi.

Injectors alone, however, just mirror the stock fueling curve, increasing it by the same amount across the board. End result is more area under the curve, but the same profile.



There's still a lot about the EZ that baffles me. For example, the meaning of the different settings. Take the most aggressive setting: 66% increase in fuel at 0psi, 100% fueling at 3psi. What exactly does this mean? Does it mean 100% of the max allowable ECM value? If so, how come I can add pedal after 3psi and accelerate faster? I guess what I am asking is how does the ECM determine fueling to deliver? APPS input? Boost? RPM? Any other inputs? How are the factors weighted?



Anyway, I am of the mind that the EZ in combination with injectors is just a little too much timing for my tastes. I don't think I will hurt anything besides the clutch, (though Keith at DD says it's possible to hurt something under the right circumstances). There's a lot of guys running this setup, and towing VERY heavy, who have NOT hurt anything. Part of me says if they didn't break it, it's not going to break...





Justin
 
I forgot to mention one thing: at WOT is where you notice the biggest difference. With the EZ, there's a THUMP THUMP THUMP as the engine works to crank out some power.



Without the EZ, there's not thump-- just smooth, effortless power.



Justin
 
EZ as boost fooler

Rusty,



Thanks for the correction. I hope I didn't offend Keith with my lack of understanding on how his product works. The very subtle point was that he has tuned the DD version of the box to work best with DD injectors.



Although I don't have some of the problems Justin reported in another thread about throttle touchiness and misbehaving cruise control with the EZ on level 2, I'm curious to try the EZ as boost fooler setup. That may be due to my "smaller" injectors having less effect on acceleration. They have had no affect on fuel mileage in a 1-tank evaluation, not that I'm complaining about 19. 5 MPG. I am hoping for enough of an improvement to break the 20-MPG barrier.



Perhaps my previous test with injectors only was too short to get a really good feel for it. I'll try this. If it's better, I'll have an expensive boost fooler. If not, I'm happy where I am and the clutch is holding.



Neil
 
BD: I don't think that 275s are really large enough to notice much of a difference over stock injectors. And, since the EZ was designed for stock injectors. any difference you might see would be subtle-- maybe too subtle to notice.



In my techie rant part above, I forgot to mention one other thing that baffles me. IF the EZ increases fueling at RPM other than peak hp, (which I beleive it does), then the boost numbers don't make sense. Let's take scenario A: injectors only, peak hp rpm (2700). This would be the maximum fueling the ECM would allow. Say at this point we have 31psi of boost.

Now take scenario B: EZ plus injectors. The EZ delivers the peak ECM fueling elsewhere in the curve, so we can get 2700rpm fueling at, say, 1500 rpm. Now, since we are taking the SAME fueling rate, but turning lower rpm, we should have 1) higher EGT and/or 2) MORE boost!



But this DOESN'T happen!!! Anyone know why? I am really curious about this. Perhaps this is evidence of over-advanced timing?



Justin
 
Justin,



In your technical analysis, bear the following in mind:



All else being equal, as timing is advanced, boost and EGT will decrease due to reduced drive energy available to the turbocharger. This is because less residual heat energy is available when the exhaust valve(s) opens since more degrees of crankshaft rotation have taken place since the beginning of ignition.



All else being equal, as fueling is increased (assuming air is available to burn the extra fuel), boost will increase due to increased drive energy (in the form of thermal energy and/or mass flow) available to the turbocharger. EGT's may or may not increase - the additional fuel would try to raise them, but the additional boost would try to cool them.



Rusty
 
Last edited:
I had a 200 mile run today and I turned the Comp off (no VP wire), unloaded. I did a all out wot and watched the egt and boost. I do not have a stock turbo. Max Egt were 1000* and boost was 28# full bore.



With DD2's and lots of air there was a good safety margin.



Definitely less hp / torque at the low end. I agree seemed to be less overall engine noise. Cruise boost at 75 was 4# flat ground.



Actually fun to drive it differently.



Bob Weis
 
Thanks, Rusty... I always learn something when you post. I forgot to account for what you are saying.



Rweis-- HOw did you end up with less boost than I have? I am running the stock 'charger, and I live over 6K' elevation. Plus, my truck is lighter than yours. Is the housing on the KSB-1B a little looser than the HX35? That would seem to make sense.



I still wish someone would tell me how the stock ECM determines fueling, and how the EZ manipulates that.



Moreover, I would really like to quantify in some way just how much of a timing effect there is to the installation of larger injectors. Logically, it would seem to advance the timing. But is this effect of any consequence? How MUCH is the change?



Maybe I should be hunting down Keith with my questions. After all, DD did the testing, and THEY'RE the ones that felt a need to reduce the timing when used with their injectors.



I think I am going to surf over to DTR and run this all past Don M.



Justin
 
Well, I unplugged the data port cable on the EZ this morning. Wow, what happened to the bottom end and midrange? The thing runs like a stocker again, only it pulls harder than stock with the DD2's. The immediate "snap" to the throttle response is gone - it just feels "softer". Noise is down - the hard edge to the combustion sound is lessened.



Oh, the things we go through to save the stock clutch. The Con OFE came in Friday and is sitting in the garage. I can't wait to finish this RVing trip and get the OFE installed so I can plug the EZ back in.



Rusty
 
tried EZ as boost fooler only

I gave it a fair shot, couple days, about 120 miles with the data link connection unplugged. On the plus side, the motor sounded a little smoother, the Edge timing makes it a little raspy, not to my liking. I was easier to launch with no puff of black smoke, but if I throttled it a bit, still puffed.



My final analysis is that I missed the extra low-end power of the EZ and the punch at the level/boost point. So as long as my clutch agrees, I'll run the level 2 unloaded and level 1 when trailering. I have read that the increased timing advance (I really wish I knew exactly what that means) helps reduce EGTs. So if that's the case, then level 1 while towing is ok for me and I can live with the harmonics.



I'm not adding any more power until I get an SB clutch and I'm hoping to hold off on that for a couple of years.



Thanks Rusty and Justin for posting some good info that encouraged me to do this little experiment.



Cheers,

Neil
 
Yeah, I gave into the dark side, too.



I run my EZ on 3 now! I always used to run it on 1, but the bottom end kick with it on 3 is huge, and I can still control the smoke.



The clutch is hanging in there, so why not?



I am getting the feeling I won't be able to run the EZ on 3 when I upgrade to the Mach 4s:eek: :eek:



Justin



***(horse)power corrupts, and absolute (horse)power corrupts absolutely**
 
confessions of a power user

Jeez Justin,



Now I feel like I twisted your arm and made you confess to using all your horse power potential. Foregive me father for I have grinned! :D



So you gonna skip right over the stage IIIs and go to the hard stuff?

Not me man, I can quit any time. :-laf



Neil
 
Re: confessions of a power user

Originally posted by Boondocker

Not me man, I can quit any time. :-laf

Neil,



Yep - me, too! :rolleyes: Once I get the Con OFE in so I can use the EZ and DD2's, I don't need any more power. ;) Hey, my truck is just a 5th wheel toter, after all. :D



I'm afraid I've succumbed to the Stroker McGurk (a character in Hot Rod magazine cartoons in the 50's) syndrome - If some is good, more is better and too much is just enough! :{



Rusty
 
Maybe if I were a little older and more mature, I would know when to quit. Who knows-- I may end up quitting at this point after all. But I would rather quit at a PMAX comp, MAch 4s, and a KSB1 turbo:D



I would like to pursue something you don't see much on here: high HP with no wire tap. The problem is that I am already running out of air. Off boost smoke is not a problem- even here in the thin air- instead, it's the fact that i am not burning all my fuel at WOT; there's still the slightest haze. In all seriousness, I think that a turbo upgrade should be next for me, which means exhaust upgrade as well. The turbo would really open up the top end as well, since the stocker chokes the exhaust flow.



Looks like I will have to pass the point of diminishing returns to burn my fuel cleanly! I feel that EZ and 2s is by far the most bang for the buck. You can get a lot more bang, but you won't find a better value, imho.



I might end up with a PDR40 (almost the official TDR turbo) even though I want a KSB-1. I can get the PDR40 AND a a whole exhaust system for just the cost of the B1. Then I would have to fab the downpipe and all that too.



Justin
 
Timing

Originally posted by Hohn





Moreover, I would really like to quantify in some way just how much of a timing effect there is to the installation of larger injectors. Logically, it would seem to advance the timing. But is this effect of any consequence? How MUCH is the change?



Maybe I should be hunting down Keith with my questions. After all, DD did the testing, and THEY'RE the ones that felt a need to reduce the timing when used with their injectors.



Don M.



Justin

You guys have got me wondering now.



If larger injectors advance timing with lighter pop off pressure??? (assumption)... . and a EZ advances timing electronically.



Is there a combination where you reach peak cylinder pressure to close to top dead center???



It seems to me the ideal situation would be to have peak cylinder pressure just after top dead center. I just don't know if injection starts before TDC or at TDC to reach a peak slightly after TDC??

Confused? I am!
 
Actually, the injection event usually begins before TDC. This is because the igntion of the fuel pulse takes time. If you waited until exactly TDC to inject the fuel, it will still be burning when you opened the exhaust valve. This occurence causes both a waste of power and high EGTs. .



At least, that's my understanding of the deal...



HOHN
 
Back
Top