FASS or ???

[steved]

the banjo I got for my FP gauge is suposed to go on the CP3...

why pay extra $$$ for the FASS pump (~$500) when you can use the Walbro he references for less than $200?

Primarily because I have had very BAD luck with any pump with Walbro on it. I ran them... well, attempted to run them, for about 5 years... I was replacing them about once every couple weeks... after 50 or so pumps (don't ask), they decided that they might not be a quality piece. They were on small diesel powered lawn equipment... hooked up correctly, free flowing fuel to them (filtered), wired correctly... they were just junk.



From that point on, I'll never touch another pump will Walbro on it... I cringed when I saw he was running one in that thread. I am not sure the one he is running is even rated for diesel fuel... but I'm sure that if I ran one, it'd die within a week! They might be an awesome pump now, but after my experience... never again!!!!



I decided that I probably don't need the extra filtering of the FASS, so I am going to get just the pump kit they offer... run it like lift pump using the stock filter housing... no filters hanging down, no fuel heater issues... and I alway can revert back to the stock LP in a pinch. So unless someone comes up with a really good reason not to run the "FASS" pump kit, that's what I'm going to do... I'll order it near the end of next week... got some $$$ coming in that should easily cover it.



I looked at the BD-power kit and it uses, of all things, another Carter pump... which is the factory lift pump for the 2nd gens... no thank you!



steved

 

[rbattelle]

I decided that I probably don't need the extra filtering of the FASS,

How'd you come to that conclusion?



-Ryan

 

[steved]

How'd you come to that conclusion?



-Ryan

Considering I put 200k on my 2nd gen without a fancy filter kit... and I run stratopore filters... never had issues. Figured the factory filtering is "adequate" but works. Speaking of that... got to change my filter this week...



I really don't like the idea of the FASS hanging down. Too much of a chance to rip that thing right off... the pump is a little more compact.



So unless these new IPs are more suseptable to dirt than the VP44, I should be fine, unless someone can show me otherwise...



I did get a response back from scheid diesel, they are telling me that they have seen some trucks in for IP repair due to poor filtering... but who knows what was run through those trucks and how often the filter was changed, etc... and of course they will want to sell a FASS over a pump anyday.



steved

 

[steved]

Grrrrr... now you got me reconsidering.



Decisions, decisions, decisions..... $400 or $575 (plus $100 for a fuel gauge, so $500 or $700 plus a fuel heater)... . keep the stock system or trash it for a FASS... something that can be easily knocked off or just a pump...



I was planning on a pump, and replacing that wannabe gas filter (I assume it is a screen) with a true fuel filter from Napa. Napa sells the brackets and spin on filters... was just going to add one of those in-line... could even add a 3micron filter to the header if I wanted too... so it might not be as bad as I was thinking since I was going to add the additional filter (upstream) anyhow... does that make sense?? I would sorta be building my own system... two filters (the factory one and the Napa one), a good LP, and the factory fuel heater...



Anyone know how much an add-on fuel heater costs?



steved

 

[OHale]

Just to chime in, I don't want a retro- in tank pump system because I have an aux fuel tank in the bed that is gravity-fed. What I will probably do is just buy a spare lift pump. If MOPAR doesn't offer it anymore I believe I can get it from Cummins.



From what I have read on TDR it looks like people are getting 70k+ miles on their pumps. A spare should hold me for a while.



Just my two cents worth, adjusted for inflation.

 

[steved]

That too crossed my mind, however, when I talked with Cummins, they indicated that it was most likely a Dodge-only part... ?



I might call the Harrisburg Dealer and see what they say. . if I can simply (for now) get a replacement pump... that is probably the best route.



steved

 

[Fireman]

AirDog is a well designed and built unit. It comes with a bracket that mounts it inside and above the bottom of the frame rail (jsut behind and above the transfer case skid plate if you have a 4wd). I'm not very worried about dragging it off or having it damaged by road debris. Customer service was excellent before the co. changed hands. One other thing, if you have a Jacobs exhaust brake you will need to order the fitting that routes the fuel line through the stock filter (where the stock lift pump used to live), the vacuum pump precludes attaching the fuel line at the injector pump.



Fireman

 

[steved]

I can't find a lot on the AD, most of the older links don't work anymore... I assume because the company changed hands.



No brake, so that's not an issue...



steved

 

[OHale]

That too crossed my mind, however, when I talked with Cummins, they indicated that it was most likely a Dodge-only part... ?



I might call the Harrisburg Dealer and see what they say. . if I can simply (for now) get a replacement pump... that is probably the best route.



steved

I had read a post earlier this year but can't find it... . If I remember it right someone had gotten a lift pump from a Cummins dealer and it was identical to the Chrysler factory. It was also much cheaper.

 

[steved]

Just to chime in, I don't want a retro- in tank pump system because I have an aux fuel tank in the bed that is gravity-fed. What I will probably do is just buy a spare lift pump. If MOPAR doesn't offer it anymore I believe I can get it from Cummins.



From what I have read on TDR it looks like people are getting 70k+ miles on their pumps. A spare should hold me for a while.



Just my two cents worth, adjusted for inflation.

Just to put out an FYI, the FACTORY lift pump for the 3rd gens is not stocked at Cummins dealers (need to be flown in from the factory... limited supply?) AND they cost $307... each. Gone are the days of the $150 pumps. So, a pump kit is a "better" way to go since they will most likely quit handling the "dodge specific" fuel pumps eventually by the sounds of it. The 2nd gen engines were used in a lot of stuff besides dodge so that pump should never go away... I believe this 3rd gen pump is more dodge specific.



I'm still up in the air... either a FASS or AD... most likely a FASS since I don't really see a "following" of the AD like I do the FASS... then just take a chance and build another truck for playing offroad! They also don't have the warranty a FASS does either (based on the single site that I found selling the AD).



As for the mileage of the LP, from what I'm seeing... 70k is about a normal time for death. everyone is going to vary depending on drive style, idle time, fuel contamination, etc, etc, etc. I'm at around 55k... leaves about 15k to go. . I'll burn that up before XMas.



steved

 

[abdiver]

Anyone have a link to the Airdog... none of the older links work.



Anyone have a "preferred" place to get either the FASS or AD???



steved

STEVE Here it is again I posted this on pg 1 post #10



Air Dog 749. 50

http://www.dieselinnovations.com/dodge_cummins/24v/dodge_24_fuel.htm





Here is where I got mine they ask for you to call for pricing because when Air Dog new owners (3 Lawyers) I understand They raised price way up and didn't tell some of the suppliers, suppliers got stuck with quoting customers a lower price and then got billed a highe price for the New units. They quoted me 749. 50 and there is free shipping when you order it online I mentioned the free shipping online when I called in and Dave said I will take order and give you the free shipping, so I didn't have to go back to my computer.



Good luck, Bill

 

[steved]

STEVE Here it is again I posted this on pg 1 post #10



Air Dog 749. 50

http://www.dieselinnovations.com/dodge_cummins/24v/dodge_24_fuel.htm





Here is where I got mine they ask for you to call for pricing because when Air Dog new owners (3 Lawyers) I understand They raised price way up and didn't tell some of the suppliers, suppliers got stuck with quoting customers a lower price and then got billed a highe price for the New units. They quoted me 749. 50 and there is free shipping when you order it online I mentioned the free shipping online when I called in and Dave said I will take order and give you the free shipping, so I didn't have to go back to my computer.



Good luck, Bill

I knew that... . Figures I should read my own post!



I think I'm going with a FASS system... seems to be more support for them (even though they have a "questionable" track record. I have been talking with Scheid Diesel... I will buy it from either them or XtremeDiesel... I like the kit... doesn't destroy anything. And if my factory LP is still good, I can alway use it as a backup system. And I can always take it off when I trade.



I put a email to them (diesel innovations) yesterday with NO response... guess I'll need to call.



steved

 

[rbattelle]

So unless these new IPs are more suseptable to dirt than the VP44, I should be fine, unless someone can show me otherwise...

That would be an understatement. The CP-3 is a common rail 3-chambered rotary style pump capable of pressures to 1600 bar. In my opinion, most of the damage to it is done by particles less than 5 micron.



Worse, common rail injectors are much more susceptible to wear at the needle and seat than jerk pump injectors are. Plus I think the hole diameter is smaller.



Absolutely the common rail system requires much more filtration than a jerk pump system. No question. As far as I'm concerned, that's the number one reason to change the low pressure fuel system by augmenting it with additional filtration.



-Ryan

 

[steved]

But considering they use the same filter... what is the micron of a "quality" fuel filter (stock replacement)?? 10 micron?



If so, then the FASS's 3 micron filter is a significant upgrade. The one place I taked with told me to run a 30 micron filter in the winter (Scheid Diesel)??



So, guess it's a FASS with a 3 micron filter... assuming they are truely 3 micron, that would make me believe they would be catching more "stuff" and therefore plug quicker... how often do you change the filters on YOUR FASS? They are considerably larger than the factory and that is what, a 10k change service? I'm only going to run the LED low pressure light... no guage at this time.



steved

 

[bchesley]

Where is everyone buying there FASS or who has the best deals?????



Brad

 

[steved]

Scheid Diesel quoted me $570.



Extreme Diesel list it $599 w/free shipping.



$599 is the going price... I have looked a bunch of sites up... still waiting for emails/calls from some others, but these are what I found so far.



steved

 

[rbattelle]

But considering they use the same filter... what is the micron of a "quality" fuel filter (stock replacement)?? 10 micron?



If so, then the FASS's 3 micron filter is a significant upgrade. The one place I taked with told me to run a 30 micron filter in the winter (Scheid Diesel)??



So, guess it's a FASS with a 3 micron filter... assuming they are truely 3 micron, that would make me believe they would be catching more "stuff" and therefore plug quicker... how often do you change the filters on YOUR FASS? They are considerably larger than the factory and that is what, a 10k change service? I'm only going to run the LED low pressure light... no guage at this time.



steved

I asked Fleetguard about the stock filter. Here's their response:

Thank you for contacting Fleetguard.



The FS19579 is a 10 Micron at 98. 67% efficient.



If we can be of further assistance to you, please feel free to contact your Fleetguard Customer Assistance Center or send a message to FleetMaster.



Please visit our homepage often at http://www.fleetguard.com



Sincerely,



Fleetguard FleetMaster

Not sure if you were directing the FASS filter change interval question to me, but I don't have a FASS. I built my own system instead. Certainly 3-micron MUCH better than the stock 10. An excellent step up.



-Ryan

 

[steved]

Nope, just a general statement/question...



I was bummed... Purolator used Stratapore (Fleetguard) filters for a long time and they were made in the USA. How do I know this... because the filter had "Stratapore" molded into the plastic housing! Now they are using a filter made in Bulgaria... I bought my last Purolator.



Well, hopefully I can order the FASS in the next couple weeks.



Thanks,

steved

 

[nightowl]

Marine lift pump

I'm looking at adding a pusher pump by Walbro before I do upgrades. It's a marine unit, diesel rated 43gph, 12 volt with regulated 7psi out. It has a 420 micron filter (catches the big junk). The model # is 6802 and it's only $90 with replacement filters at $3. 00. Check it out at www.autoperformanceengineering.com/html/6000_pump.html

I like this unit because it would help the stock lift pump with 7psi but not over power it like the BD pusher at 28psi. It's only got 3 moving parts and is solid state and water proof too.

********************************************************

I also called Racor and they make a "P" series pump with the note "vacuum installations are recommended" . I like this one because it has 12 volt, 10psi, diesel rated, 50gph with choice of 2, 10, or 30 micron filters. It also has a 150w heater for bio diesel. Any questions call Racor 1-800-272-7537 The model "P5" is the one they recommend for my 2002 HO. $350 at diesel shops, $450 MSRP

Anyone that has either of these installed , please email "NIGHTOWL" at -- email address removed --



2002 HO 6SP Leer shell... . bone stock... but not for long

 

[steved]

I got in on a group buy for the FASS... $470 for the FASS kit, $50 for the LED, a couple bucks for the 3 micron filter and extra brushes... total $579 shipped to my door.



I guess we shall see what it does... they stated they have updated the motor several times recently to eliminate the hung brush problem... we shall see... I also have read about a NAPA 2 micron filter... might be another alternative. I also see that DPP recommends a 30k filter change for the FASS??? That seems a little high, but what do I know... I figure I'll change it on the 15k schedule (was changing the factory one every 10k).



Will let you know when I get it...



steved