FED UP with fuel prices?

[Sled Dog]

George Carlin RIP Language

YouTube - AMERICA IS TYRANNY - George Carlin R. I. P.

 

[Sled Dog]

I frequently read posts by other members who refer to the "economy tanking" or the bad economy. That is simply not true. The economy is certainly not great. It has slowed due to high fuel costs and the problem of so many people who were living grand on adjustable rate mortgages and are now surrendering or losing their homes to foreclosure but the economy is not in a recession nationwide.



The truth is we are not and have not been in a recession and the economy has actually grown a tiny bit most if not all recent months. A "recession" is defined as "three consecutive months of negative economic growth. " We have not had that situation, yet at least.



The economy is bad in certain regions of the country but that is related to certain industries, labor issues, or political issues.

Store Closings: Symptoms of A Depressed Economy by Donald H. — usa, stores, retail | Gather

 

[HBarlow]

sled dog,



Declining stores and even declining industries closing and new stores and industries opening has always been a part of our economy. It results from competition, both within the US and from external sources, and from changing tastes in fashions. It is generally a good thing for the overall economy and for consumers.



Some furniture stores are dying as a result of Communist Chinese furniture entering the market and because younger generation furniture buyers prefer cheaper ChiComm furniture over quality American-made furniture.



Some clothing stores are probably failing for the same reason. That is bad for the people who once made the furniture or clothing in US factories but good for the US consumer who can buy the same goods for lower prices.



Remember, the marketplace is driven by individual choices made by each and every buyer in a free market economy.



Certainly sales are slower than normal right now because of the highest motor fuel costs we've seen but the fact remains, the US economy is not in a recession. A slowdown, yes, but not a recession. If it were, we'd hear and see it in every sentence uttered by the lib media. Our economy is not growing at a desired or normal rate but it is growing a tiny amount.



If you look beyond the headlines, even those in the link you posted, you can see a somewhat clearer picture. For example, the bad sounding news that Home Depot is closing stores contains this line buried in the text:



"The Atlanta-based company said the underperforming U. S. stores being closed represent less than 1 percent of its existing stores. "



If you accept and believe the distorted, slanted, exaggerated news thrown at us every day by the dishonest or poorly informed lib news media you will begin to think about jumping off a bridge. They promote bad news. Our economy and our nation are not bad.



Free market economies operate in cycles. The economy is the collective result of every single buying decision made every single day by every single American. When we are nervous or feeling pinched (by fuel prices) we retreat. We postpone or avoid certain purchases. Our decisions are reflected in the overall economic numbers.



Our economy will survive and prosper without any intervention by blow-dried empty suits in Washington. As a matter of fact, our economy will prosper faster and better if they get out of the way and quit placing restrictions on it.

 

[HBarlow]

It is possible, in this day and age, to find an article that represents anyone's chosen attitude or point of view. If I hated the current administration or the political culture of America I could easily find articles written every day that would support my own negative point of view.



I love my country, recognize and appreciate its greatness, and remain positive and optimistic about our future. When others post links to inaccurate, exaggerated, biased or negative reporting I ignore it. I simply don't care to read such drivel. I have adequate educatioin and understanding of the issues to recognize dishonest reporting and am not easily influenced by the lies and distortions.



There are some very slick political hacks out there who pretend to be part of the "media. " They write convincing and innocent sounding articles that purport to be simply "news. " Their "news" fools people and that is their purpose.



The so-called news media stopped reporting news 20 or 30 years ago. The news media is made up of a group of people who entered their profession for the stated reason of "making a difference. " They are generally people with limited ability and talent. Most are not smart enough to become successful business leaders, bankers, lawyers, doctors, scientists, professors, or skilled tradesmen so they go into journalism where all that is required to be successful is a pretty face, a nice smile, and the ability to glibly deceive to succeed.



Their purpose is to influence and persuade people to think and vote the way they do.



I don't listen to their reporting or read their drivel. I remain confident about the future of our nation unless the voters elect socialists. That scares me. A downturn in our economy does not.

 

[HBarlow]

My friend bought her house 4yrs ago and paid 30k down from her last house when she moved. Now the market has tanked around here and she needs to replace her roof so she had her house appraised and it is now almost 50k LESS than when she bought it!! If she had to sell ALL her equity is GONE!! How do you prudently plan for that?

DCreed,



I do not seek to make light of your friend's situation. It is always sad to see a normally responsible person in financial distress but let's analyze her situation.



If she bought the house only four years ago and now needs an expensive roof did she fail to have a qualified inspector examine the house before she bought it? If the roof was marginal did she plan and save for the inevitable expensive replacement? Did she pay fair market value for the house or did she possibly overpay for it when she purchased it?



Before making a major decision such as the purchase of a home a prudent person must consider their own personal risk situation as well as the broader community and region economic situation and there are always and will always be unanticipated events that will occur. That is why most of us buy less house than we can afford rather than the absolute most we can possibly swing.



Is her own job and career solid? She is probably in education or healthcare so her own job is probably secure but what of the community and region? If others in the community depend on employment that is on shaky footing the value of her home is also threatened and ultimately, her job would be at risk also. Those factors have to be considered. Political leadership changes and the world economy changes and can effect our own.



You live in a beautiful and historic part of the country but the economy in your area has been soft for many years. The textile mills closed long ago and there is essentially no industry so most probably work in the service sector. I think the only new jobs are provided by the Indian gaming casino near Montville.



You'll probably be surprised to know I was once your neighbor although I was probably there before or when you were born. I lived in CT from 1964 through 1974 riding submarines and have visited there a number of times over the years since. I attended a submarine reunion there just five years ago and visited an old shipmate there twice last year. I love wandering through the CT countryside and the beautiful old historic towns but it is not a great place for jobs and careers.



I lived in Norwich, Gales Ferry, Voluntown, and Jewett City and owned homes in Lisbon and Plainfield. When I lived there many of the men commuted to work at Electric Boat in Groton or Sikorsky helicopter which was near Hartford, I think. EB is much smaller now than it was during the Cold War and I don't even know if Sikorsky is around any longer. I may not be up to date but I think the huge Indian casino is the only significant growth industry there in recent years.



Everybody must accept responsibility for their own decisions and pay the consequences of risky or less than great decisions ... ... including me. In 1993 I bought three rental houses in a very short time with a mortgage on each. A year or so later one of them was rented to an Air Force officer/pilot/instructor pilot at the local Reese AFB and I was showing a second one to another military officer reporting to Reese AFB. Everything was looking good and suddenly we received the news that the slickwillie administration was going to close Reese AFB. I felt like I'd been punched in the stomach. Here I sat with a mortgage on my own home because I had only retired from the Navy a few years earlier and we had recently moved and settled in a new city. I also had mortgages on three rental properties. I had been counting on Reese AFB to provide excellent tenants for my rentals. Who was responsible? Me. Who had to bail me out of that situation? Me. I reduced rents a little and leased to less desirable tenants and worked harder. I managed.



About five years ago mortgage interest rates were at historic lows and the economy was booming. Wealthy investors began building hundreds or thousands of new apartments in my town. At the time I had seven rental properties with six mortgages and I was retired. I began to feel threatened. Who was responsible? Me. Who had to bail me out? Me. I moved my fiver to Indiana and started pulling travel trailers from manufacturer to dealers all over the US and Canada. My wife managed the rentals and I lived on the road. I ran 400,000 miles in 2 years and 9 months and bailed myself out. My mortgages were all short term to begin with and nearing retirement anyway but I paid off all the mortgages as a transporter. Last year a buyer wanted to buy all my houses so I sold out.



I know nobody gives a hoot about my own personal trials and solutions but I offer the story just to illustrate the point. Normally a person has to accept a degree of risk to accomplish anything beyond working for someone else for wages but if he or she does, he or she is responsible and must pay the price if something goes wrong. I could have sat around whining for the government or someone else to solve my problem or accepted vacancies and possibly lost my houses. Instead I lowered rents, rented to a few people I wouldn't normally have rented to, and dealt with the consequences. I solved my own problems and can now be proud of my success.



If every other American taxpayer has to be responsible when others make bad decisions or risky decisions the net result will be a lower standard of living for everyone. When the government manages all problems and "takes care of everybody" it is called socialism. It stifles personal responsibility, individual incentive and effort and benefits only the least productive members of our society. I'm sure everyone remembers the former USSR. Misery spread equally was the hallmark of the USSR. I don't want to live like that.

 

[Sled Dog]

Utilities cut off more customers who are behind on their bills - USATODAY.com

 

[HBarlow]

SledDog,



Continue searching for the bad news if it makes you feel better about your own life. Personally, once I know a members political leanings or if I know the political bias of the sources he links, for example USAToday which is a liberal rag, I don't read them. I could predict the bad and exaggerated news they print and have no interest in reading such garbage.



I love my country, understand and appeciate its greatness, the wonderful freedom and opportunity it offers for everyone, and I pay no attention to liberal biased bad news reporting.



If USAToday would print their news on six inch wide rolls and distribute the rollls free of charge I'd take a few rolls and use them in my bathrooms.

 

[JesseJ]

It's all about perspective. It depends on whether you're a glass half full type of person or a glass half empty type of person. Both sides can find plenty of news articles to support their own opinion. I try to be more of a glass half full type of person, but I try to change peoples minds towards my thinking with some good discussion, rather than just beating them over the head with my book of facts.

 

[DCreed]

more "fake" news... :-laf Publisher's Statement - June

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

more "fake" news... :-laf Publisher's Statement - June

I especially like THIS quote:

For large investment banks and various funds desperate for profits following the collapse in earnings since August 2007 and the U. S. real estate "sub-prime" crisis, oil is one of the best ways to achieve huge speculative gains. While the Federal Reserve has released about $400 billion through the "repo" discount window to assist the investment banks to solve the real estate and credit crisis, perhaps it is bankrolling 20+ percent profits on 2 percent money to salvage insolvent bank balance sheets.





First, unregulated financial adventurism leads to a credit/derivative meltdown in the financial market, then the U. S. Treasury is used to bail out investment banks, and now we all pay the price of speculator-driven commodity prices, especially oil, so the culprits can gain 20 percent profits. What's next, a "pump-and-dump" commodity strategy similar to the dot-coms?

Jeeze, didn't someone here just recently point that out?



OH, yeah - that was ME! :-laf:-laf



But, never mind - the disbelievers will simply "disregard" the article, as the "slanted view from a liberal source" - and continue shuffling down their fog-bound path, as they puff out their chest, and loudly sing the "National Anthem"...

 

[HBarlow]

Gary,



While you pontificate about evil investment banks earning large returns by investing in oil futures have you considered what would happen if our financial markets and financial institutions are allowed to fail and the effect that could have on our entire economy and every citizen who is not a welfare recipient or a congressman (well, my two examples are probably only one)?



What do you propose as an alternative to our free market capitalist economic system?



Would you prefer that blow-dried empty suit congressmen, with little useful education, understanding, or skills acting as a committee of fools, run our major banks, financial markets, etc. ?



You rant and rave, one industry at a time, against every single individual, class of individuals, and industry that makes money.

 

[TFucili]

Gary,



While you pontificate about evil investment banks earning large returns by investing in oil futures have you considered what would happen if our financial markets and financial institutions are allowed to fail and the effect that could have on our entire economy and every citizen who is not a welfare recipient or a congressman (well, my two examples are probably only one)?



What do you propose as an alternative to our free market capitalist economic system?



Would you prefer that blow-dried empty suit congressmen, with little useful education, understanding, or skills acting as a committee of fools, run our major banks, financial markets, etc. ?



You rant and rave, one industry at a time, against every single individual, class of individuals, and industry that makes money.

Harvey, who brought the banking system to the brink of collapse for the second time in twenty years? The same breed of Armani suit wearing scammers who we bailed out last time! You should brand their foolishness of running financial institutions, formerly a very conservative lot, like a lotto-gambit as being as dimwitted, and shortsighted as the myopic dopes who didn't plan for the future and bought houses they couldn't even afford when things were flying high. For every boom there is a bust, and you should run your household, business, AND bank accordingly.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

SURPRISE - SURPRISE - SURPRISE!



Who woulda thunk it?



House panel told curbing speculation could cut prices - Jun. 23, 2008



One quote:

To underline his case, Stupak said speculators now control 71% of oil on the market. That means only 29% control the physical oil being traded, down from 61% eight years ago. He blamed loosely regulated trading markets with numerous loopholes for the ease that traders have to buy and sell crude.



"We can eliminate a major avenue that traders use to avoid oversight," Stupak said Friday. "It's time for Congress to close the Enron loophole and lower our gas and diesel prices by 50%. "

 

[HBarlow]

Harvey, who brought the banking system to the brink of collapse for the second time in twenty years? The same breed of Armani suit wearing scammers who we bailed out last time! You should brand their foolishness of running financial institutions, formerly a very conservative lot, like a lotto-gambit as being as dimwitted, and shortsighted as the myopic dopes who didn't plan for the future and bought houses they couldn't even afford when things were flying high. For every boom there is a bust, and you should run your household, business, AND bank accordingly.

As you wrote, it was largely scammers, owners of small S&Ls who created the banking crisis 20 years ago but I have heard or read no reports of banks and bankers being "scammers" this time as you call them. What they did was make risky loans to applicants who often were not credit worthy or were high risk. I have little sympathy for the bankers who were greedy for profits and made bad loans but the banks are important to our financial stability. Just like back in the '80s, when major financial institutions and major banks are in trouble the fed has no choice but to ease the controls on money flow to allow the banks to save themselves or our economy and financial stability will go down with them.



It should be remembered that a large part of the risky lending that failed was mandated by the fools in congress who forced them to lend to minority applicants with bad or no credit.

 

[HBarlow]

SURPRISE - SURPRISE - SURPRISE!



Who woulda thunk it?



House panel told curbing speculation could cut prices - Jun. 23, 2008



One quote:

Who is Stupak and what liberal democrat "thinktank" does he come from?

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Who is Stupak and what liberal democrat "thinktank" does he come from?

Too busy singing the "Star spangled Banner" to actually READ the piece you're eager to criticise, eh Harvey?



Here's a clue for you - and I can draw a picture too, if that will help: :-laf

The chair of the oversight and investigations subpanel hearing, Rep. Bart Stupak, D-Mich. , had a different take on speculation. "We risk having our economy brought to its knees" by "excessive" speculation in commodity markets, he said.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

OH, and Harvey, before you explode into a righteous indignation fit about "Patriotism", I gotta tell ya...



I love my Dodge - and Dodges in general - but I am NOT blind to their shortcomings in various areas - just as I am aware of the qualities and features of Ford and GM stuff.



Only a fool like some diehard Ford owners will childishly claim "My ford could be sitting in my driveway busted and on FIRE, and STILL be the BEST truck on the planet... :-laf:-laf



Yeah, I'm Patriotic, and love this country - but that does NOT blind me to the areas where it is sick, wounded, and in need of help and healing - and currently, our failing economy, hindered by the bleeding caused by runaway and uncontrolled energy costs is a sickness DEMANDING attention - and just thumping our chests grandly as we whistle "Yankee Doodle Dandy", doesn't accomplish diddly-SQUAT!

 

[HBarlow]

Gary,



That's even worse than I would have guessed. A democrat hack from MI who was pandering to his constituents.



Surely even you know better than to take his word for anything.



What are his credentials to make such foolish pronouncements? Does he hold a Ph. D. in economics or finance? Does he have thirty years or more of education and experience in the financial industry or markets?



No, I didn't think so. Another one of the hacks that gave the state of MI the worst economy and job situation in the nation, one on a par with a backwards third world nation.



Spare me mr. stupak's bs pronounements. I could learn as much reading the writing on the walls of a truck top toilet enclosure.



And what you consider a failing economy bla, bla, bla needing drastic intervention by more democrap hacks in congress only means another industry or institution that has come to your attention because they are earning money through, gasp, the free market and their own initiative.



Envy and resentment as usual.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

AH, Harvey, yer a hoot, as usual - but you forgot to use the phrase, "Blow dried, empty suits" - ya must be slipping... :-laf:-laf

 

[TFucili]

What they did was make risky loans to applicants who often were not credit worthy or were high risk.

... which is behavior that is antithetical to the discipline of banking in the first place. Either they are incredibly stupid(not likely), or they are, as I maintain, scammers. Banking is not a table game in Vegas.