Feeling somewhat torn about a decicion I'm making.

[Rosco]

This may belong in a different forum but I'll post it here. After a lot of back and forth decision making I am about 90% ready to buy a Chevy Duramax/Allison. My last 5 truck have been Dodges starting with a '99 1500 gasser.



The reason for this change is due to some issues that I find way out of line for a $40,000 truck.



1. The seats IMHO are torture devices installed by DC to see just how tough Dodge owners really are.



2. The Cummins is exhibiting the same problems as the Duramax when it comes to injectors. I have replaced one already with another on it's way out.



3. My injection pump is weeping fuel.



4. I had my upper and lower ball joints replaced at 19,500 miles and most likely will need to replace them again in another 20,000 miles.



5. My entire steering column needed to be replaced.



6. I have the 65mph vibration.



7. My rear main seal is weeping oil.



Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge fan of the Cummins engine. However, at this stage of the game I don't think the HPCR is any less problematic than a Duramax. I know I'll be making some compromises going to the Chevy such as brakes and steering, although the two Chevys I drove did steer pretty good.



But on the flip side I gain a "true" crew cab, the benefits of the Allison, and more creature comforts including better seats.



Generally, I don't keep a vehicle for too long so even if the Chevy is a total POS it will be replaced it in a few years anyway. I just need a more comfortable vehicle for the money I pay every month and hopefully the Chevy will fit the bill.



Like I said I'm 90% sold on the switch to the dark side. One good thing for you guys is that I should be able to give you a pretty accurate comparison between the two trucks.



Flame suit donned .

 

[ata]

I'm with you, right now I think the Chev-G. M. C. trucks have a lot more going for them over Dodge and Ford. I know if I replaced my Dodge it would be a Chev D-Max 6 speed. I sure don't agree with you on Chev having bad steering or brakes but that's my 2-cents. Dodge has not improved the front ends (94 to date) on their 4X4's, they just changed axle manufactures and ended up with the same problems. In fact from 1994 to date they have not fixed much at all, they just added a few more things to fix.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

You know, members of this board for the most part, are pretty partial and drfensive when it comes to the issue of comparisons of the Dodge vs the competition - so you had just as well sit back, and get prepared for LARGE ration of sarcasm, ridicule and brand-bashing against GM.



Just like a Ford owner would in THEIR group if he was making similar references as to thinking about switching to Dodge - or a GM owner doing the same...



And really, since this IS a dodge group, exactly how many INFORMED comments do you REALLY expect to see in this thread - I'm pretty sure not MANY guys here have actually DRIVEN a new GM - or Ford, for that matter - so what sort of "expert" comment can you reasonably expect?

 

[Scooby]

Sounds like you have had some unusual problems. And those vibrations are sometimes the most annoying of all.



Good luck with the Dmax... I think you are in a fun position to try different brands and report back in. Have fun with it - after all, you are not defined by what you drive (this may be hard to swallow for car enthusiasts like myself)



Let us know how it turns out.

 

[klenger]

It's just a truck. Hope it works out for you.

 

[Rosco]

Gary,



I'm not looking for any expert opinions and I fully understand that we all become brand loyal to some degree or another. The only reason for my post was to advise people of my possible decision.



I have been a member of this board for 2 1/2 years now and visit it almost daily. In some regards I feel like we are a family and I needed to spill my guts to you guys. Like title to the thread stated, I'm torn by this decision. The idea of switching trucks has been on the forefront of my mind now for days.



However, if guys want to rattle my cage then so be it. I know I rattled a few myself in the past when other members talked about switching brands.

 

[Matt400]

Flame suit donned

Hold on while I roll up my sleeves.....

1. The seats IMHO are torture devices installed by DC to see just how tough Dodge owners really are.

Must be a personal thing because my seats are great and I have a friend that has the 04 D-max and I absolutely hate his seats and he has the nice one. The seat bottom is way to short for me, feels like setting on a fold up chair.

2. The Cummins is exhibiting the same problems as the Duramax when it comes to injectors. I have replaced one already with another on it's way out.

thats too bad. . my 03 still has its original 6.

3. My injection pump is weeping fuel.

Bummer... mine is dry.

4. I had my upper and lower ball joints replaced at 19,500 miles and most likely will need to replace them again in another 20,000 miles.

True, that stinks but working in the service industry I can say that I replace far more GM ball joints than the others and it costs way more to do it on an IFS 4x4 vehicle.

5. My entire steering column needed to be replaced.

What for?

6. I have the 65mph vibration.

I feel for ya there, plenty posts here on that one. I had it and the P/S hose TSB fixed mine. I sure would like to get my hands on one that does do it, I like a good challenge. Trouble is all the 03's, 04's & 04. 5's in our are don't have it so I may never get to see one that does it.

7. My rear main seal is weeping oil.

Is it enough to reach the ground? If so warranty that baby other wise look the other way cuz many other brands do that but I can't speak for the Isuzu's yet.

at this stage of the game I don't think the HPCR is any less problematic than a Duramax.

Another friend of mine with an 03 D-max has been towed to the Dealer twice that I know of and I have yet to see a tow bill. Besides those tows one time he ran out of fuel and it was a nighmare priming the system with the lawn mower style squeeze ball pump.

on the flip side I gain a "true" crew cab, the benefits of the Allison, and more creature comforts

I thought Dodge has that now for 06 and the Allison shifts like a centrifugal clutch IMO, I hate it. Can't even hardly feel the shift points.

Generally, I don't keep a vehicle for too long so even if the Chevy is a total POS it will be replaced it in a few years anyway.

Can't argue on that one at all. The Ram is a 200K vehicle for me and while I realize it would go further I think I will simply "want" a new and improved model then. I wouldn't think of taking the GM to that mileage. But hey. . If I had the bucks and they changed the seats I might drive one for 80K there, hows that?

 

[EBottema]

Since my opinion is worth gold are here, let me grace you with my presence. Only kidding. :-laf





Anyways, The new chevy and dodge is a toss up. One of my older relatives who does a lot of towing of a fitfth wheel just bought a GMC Sierra 2500 Dura/Allison in 2004 and with 20k miles there are no problems so far. He got the thing full loaded, paid sticker ouch!

Both trucks with all the new complicated injection, electronic systems are going to have problems on some trucks. Some people get lucky with perfect trucks and some get stuck with lemons...

Dodge has a better engine I6 design, better parts avalibility in the long term, but I don't think the Dodge HPCR system/drive by wire system is all that great. I love the rest of the engine though. Dodge Trannys are not that great but the Allison transmission is not really any better than Dodge one, they have their share of problems. If you get 4x4, Dodge has the advantage with a straight axle setup, chevy ifs sucks. interior is much nicer on the chevy and real 4 doors and long bed option New 06 truck looks like hell in the front so chevy now has that advantage. It depends on your needs and tastes. Both have their problems and positives. Dodge really only has one leg up which is the engine... Just my opinion, please keep the flaming to a minimum.

 

[Rosco]

Whew Matt,



Even after my morning shower my skin is still smoldering :-laf . As far the seats are concerned, I think everybody has different body ergonomics so what I may think is a comfy seat you may hate and vice versa. For my body the sears are murderous and from reading threads on this board I'm not alone in saying it. Also, considering my wifes Tahoe has the same interior as the Chevy I'm looking at I already know what I'll be getting as far as long term comfort.



I do agree 100% that overall the Cummins is a far superior engine to the Duramax. However, I have yet to drive a new vehicle over 75,000 miles so I reckon the D-Max will still have a little warranty left when I sell it.



I know what you mean about the Allison shift points being vauge when compared to our transmissions. However, since I drive Allison equipped fire trucks for a living I have become used to the defuel before the shift is made and I accept it as normal behavior.





I hope you guy's will let me still hang out play with you all, even if I do end up buying the pink ball .

 

[Matt400]

I have yet to drive a new vehicle over 75,000 miles so I reckon the D-Max will still have a little warranty left when I sell it.

In that case I say go for it. . With that short of term there is no reason not to enjoy variety.

I hope you guy's will let me still hang out play with you all, even if I do end up buying the pink ball .

I would and if the others don't you can always PM me.

 

[LightmanE300]

Most people will agree that the dodge seats stink. On the other hand, I don't think the chevy is built to work as much as the dodge, and the handling/road feel is terrible. I drove one a few weeks ago for 5 days. The brakes aren't nearly as good as the dodge's and the interior seems/feels cheap. I don't think the Cummins are having a lot of injector problems, the cases are few and far between. I also think half of the so called injector problems are people being paranoid because their diesel makes noise. .

 

[BHolm]

I sure can't tell you what to do with your money but I might just qualify as an "expert" in this field I have owned two Chev trucks with the Durapooch/Allislip set-up..... just poking a little fun there :-laf The first one was a 2001 4x4 ext cab short box 2500HD, the second was an '03 2500HD crew cab long box srw. I put 97k miles on the '01 and 34k miles on the '03. I also have a '99 Ford 7. 3 with 250k miles on it so I have lived with all three, except the 6. 0, which it would take a fool to buy.



In terms of general quality, the GM trucks fall short. I made lots of dealer visits for dumb stuff. The service 4x4 light, which requires some new module, both trucks, new steering shafts on both trucks (they start clunking), the Allison will not hold fifth gear towing worth a darn. This puts you in fourth on the highway at over 2500 rpms. That gives you 5mpg, I made an 800 mile trip that way, talk about PO'ed at a truck. The seats I wish I could have back, the Bose stereo, memory seats, integrated DVD player, and a few other luxo bits I sure would like to have on my similarly priced Dodge. I also had a big issue with the Allison in my '03. It never towed much but burnt its fluid black three times between 25k when it was flushed and 34k when I traded it for a CTD. Also be aware that you do not get 590 lb/ft of torque in first and fifth gears where you need it most, you get 520 because the Alli can't take the torque. It will be noisier than an '05 Cummins, it will have less power and worse fuel economy. Don't even think it will come close to an '03 CTD truck for fuel economy. My '03 D-max was getting about 14 mpg when my '03 Dodge was getting 18 mpg under the same conditions, same driver.



Then you get into the chassis meat. The GM trucks come with horrible shocks. I could run 80-90 mph on a bumpy coutry two lane in the Dodge and the Chev was dowright scary at 70 on the same road. A switch to Bilstein shocks is mandatory. They are OK after that mod. The bed sheetmetal is much thinner than Dodges. Both of my Chevs had lots of bed rail dents from simply leaning over the edge. Heck, they are getting so cheap they had to have a recall for the straps that hold the tailgate up... . how long have they been making pick-ups?



I completely agree with you on the comfort aspects, I like the GM's better. If you only keep it for the 3/36 warranty period and the dealer is close and friendly, they aren't BAD trucks. I voted with my dollars and now have three CTD's and NO GM trucks. I have had FAR fewer isssues with the CTD's. Nobody makes a perfect one but for my needs the Dodge is still the best of the three. My second choice would have been an F-350 with the new V10 in King Ranch trim. No fuel system problems, plenty of room and power, I would have had to wait 6-8 weeks though and the CTD was on the lot. I was so PO'ed at GM over my '03 I didn't want to wait another day. Despite the seats and other stuff I gave up, I would rather have the CTD/48re under my butt anyday, even if my butt hurts a little for it

 

[kernen]

Duramax/Allison vrs. DODGE Cummins

I had a 02 Chev. Duramax/Allison and it had a major problem that developed about 30000 miles. At startup no power steering or brakes , locked up for 20-30 minutes, no moving the vehicle. At first dealer said there were no known issues like I described. Only happened at startup and not while moving. Temperature(ambient) was not the issue. Finally 15000 miles later(now had 45000) dealer called me and sid there was a TSB out on the problem and there was no fix. Said I would have to live w/ it. They said it was not a safety issue as it only occurred at startup. It was a booster pump issue that only occurred w/ the allison/Duramax combo. No issue w /the 6 speed. For me the fix was obvious, Sell the vehichle and not enter a GMC/ CHEV store again.

I think the dodge seats are the most supportive , great all the way around at leaast w the prem. cloth. I have had my dodge since Nov 04 and now have 15000, the veh is not perfect, but nothing is. The turning radius on the Dodge is like a sedan(agood thing) were as the chev takes a big arc

 

[jarmar]

I realize that the seating thing is an individual issue. My wife has a bad back and often used a TEENS unit for pain when we traveled. So before our purchse we tried and looked at all three brands throughly. She decided the Dodge was by far the most comfortable and after 25,000 and two cross country trips it has proved to be. She no longer uses the TEENS unit when we travel and I find the seat as comfortable as any I have used.



I guess our body shapes (or mis-shapes) just happen to match the Dodge and we are happy.



Have had no warranty issues as yet.



j ripley

 

[gonzo2]

I'm quite happy with the Dodge part of my truck (I'm not saying it's perfect) and find the seats comfortable, but if I didn't I would be looking elsewhere.

 

[JRhinehart]

I have a 2000 1500 4x4 gas with the leather heated seats and my 2004 has the Laramie package with the same set-up. The 2000 seats are MUCH more comfortable and have the power lumbar while the 2004 have the manual lumbar. Why they switched I don't know, must have been a cost thing. The 2004 seat bottoms are too short IMHO compared to the 2000 seats. I am about to take a trip out to California from Illinois next week and I will report back on my back! :-laf

 

[Byershome]

I have 35000 on my 03 now and everything appears to be in good shape. There were some minor issues early on which I expected in a first year run but nothing major. Service in this area is non-existant but I knew that going in. The seats have been fine for me and I wiegh in at a hefty 260 at 6' 4". My back hates being in any position for more than a few minutes so I was pleasently suprised at the comfort level during a 3500 mile trip I took when I first bought it. At one point during the trip I drove for 21 hours and the only reason I stopped was I hit the Atlantic and was dead tired. This is my third Dodge truck (200000 plus on two previous) and unless something drastically changes before this Cummins wears the truck out, my next will be the same.

 

[Tim]

You guys that are complaining that the seats suck need to get some aftermarket seats already. Nothing stock is ever perfect and if you spend the money it'll be worth it.



Don't trade your trucks, just get new seats.

 

[amsoilman]

Gary,



I'm not looking for any expert opinions and I fully understand that we all become brand loyal to some degree or another. The only reason for my post was to advise people of my possible decision.



I have been a member of this board for 2 1/2 years now and visit it almost daily. In some regards I feel like we are a family and I needed to spill my guts to you guys. Like title to the thread stated, I'm torn by this decision. The idea of switching trucks has been on the forefront of my mind now for days.



However, if guys want to rattle my cage then so be it. I know I rattled a few myself in the past when other members talked about switching brands.

The BIGGEST thing I have against the GM and FORD Diesels is when you have to work on them, they are areal PAIN! No room, and MANY things to take off to get to stuff, like replacing the surpentine belt. Try doing that on either of the V-8 Diesles!



my 02 worth



Wayne

amsoilman

 

[Byershome]

Ah you bring back memories of crawling inside the engine compartment of my old trusty 85' RAM 1/2 ton with that indestructible slant six(payed 7500. 00 out the door new )... ... ... ... ... changing spark plugs and oil filters was a breeze..... never had to do any real work though... .....



More is not always better :-laf