Guns, Bows, Shooting Sports, and Hunting First Cast loads 45/70

[GHarman]

If you decide to handload and get setup, the amortization process begins as soon as you start reloading and shooting. You can buy bullets , powder and primers and build your own cartridges for about 50 cents each. If you buy a bullet mould and cast your bullets out of scrap lead and wheel weights, you can load 'em for less than 20 cents each!

The initial outlay is pretty pricey. However, over time and lots of trigger time you will amortize the cost of your tools. GregH

 

[BIGNASTY]

Sorry I dont mean to barge in on your post's. I have recently got into the 45/70 class of gun. and your statement,quote Yes, I am expecting the recoil on the 45/70 to be quite different than the Ruger 44 semi-auto, WOULD BE A MASSIVE UNDERSTATEMENT!!!

If I may be so bold as to make a comment about this round It would be to listen to Greg he know's of what he speak's

 

[GHarman]

Thanks! BIGNASTY! Hey! This is your thread!

Did ya ever determine what size group you were getting? Both the H-4895 and the RE-7 shot well, in my old 1895 Marlin w/microgroove barrel. Just got more Horsepower out of the RE-7 and it shot cleaner! Tried H-322 but was not impressed with the accuracy. GregH

 

[BIGNASTY]

Na just took the wife and sister into town to get their hair cut. And do some girlie shopping. I found a Starbucks and did the people watching thing. I didnt have time to trigger a few but I did notice that the RE-7 was burning cleaner kicking harder with less powder? Went to a meeting for the upcoming project with my Nephew and his college project. Some of the people have no idea of what it's like 40 miles out, It's like HELLO!!! this is real and not some amusement park ride. Went to the USGS to get some TOPO maps if I go I want to know where Im at. I dont trust electronics (oh crap the battery went dead). Picked up some more Brew ingredients for a fresh batch of Nasty's Nasty BIL gave it a name. Other than that just the same thing.

 

[HHhuntitall]

If I may say, the leverlution ammo has been much more accurate. I've shot quite a bit in the 45/70/ 450 Marlin, and the 30/30. I haven't handloaded any of the bullets, but the shape of the bullet give flatter trajectories and higher retained velocities at range(basically, a better B. C. ), so a lighter bullet has as much energy as a larger bullet at the same range. The 30/30 round, in my old 1926 Winchester '94 Eastern Carbine(30 W. C. F. ) will easily shoot 6" goups at 200-250yds. That's pretty good for open sights, IMO. And, shooting hogs and varmints, they seem to perform very well, too. I can't say about bear. Big bear is a whole 'nother ball game.



Which brings me to another question..... Greg, how did the 225 ballistic tips work in your 45 pistol round? I can't remember how well you said they were shooting, accuracy wise and velocity?

 

[GHarman]

HHhuntitall, They were the Hornady 200 gr FTX bullets meant for the 460 S+W, loaded into the 45 Long Colt case with 16 Gr. Blue Dot. (these only work in a Cylinder that is 1. 8" long. They wont work in a Ruger or Colt revolver) I had 3 consecutive shots in 1 1/4" tall X 1/2" group at 50 yards. I threw out the last two. Just couldnt see, my eyes started watering so bad! I havent chronographed them as yet. Lots of things going on, here. My productivity is way down! I'd like to try 2400 and maybe Hodgdons Lil-gun. But, so far, I have found no high velocity load data for the . 45 Colt +P with a 200 Gr. Bullet suitable for the RUGER, FREEDOM ARMS revolvers! I dont believe the Blue Dot load is that efficient. My guess is 1300FPS. I'd like 1600FPS GregH

 

[HHhuntitall]

Ah! I knew you showed them to me, but I couldn't remember what loads or velocities we had discussed. We'd talked about a lot that day!! If I recall correctly, I'll have to check, I think the Ruger loads I've used with 240 Sierra JHP, 28gr H110, CCI 400 were right around 1500fps. Again, IIRC, the H110 is really close to Lil' gun in burn rate, so it might work really close. I see no reason why the 200 wouldn't do that 1600... . not sure how whiplash will work on your back... .



Nasty, I looked at my notes, and the load I'm shooting in my Marlin with the 300gr Sierra HP is 60gr H4198, Fed 210. It chrono'd an average just over 2500 fps. I thought that'd be plenty for most game and black bears. I'd forgotten about it, but it seems I tested some 400gr Speers w/ 48gr and 50gr of H4198. They tested an average FPS of 1920 and 2043fps, respectfully. I also tested some H322 50gr loads w/400 Speers, and they averaged 1996fps.



The leverlution bullets have been a little hard to come by. I've been shooting factory ammo for brass and the fact that they're much easier to find. With how well they shoot, it's gonna be hard for me to go to reloading them!! I bought 15 boxes of 450 Marlin, and 20 of the 45/70 a couple years ago, and I'm slowly whittling away on them. I don't really carry it much this time of year. Kinda hard to roll a pig at 600yds with one of those rainbow bullets!!! And then there's the whole process of installing ear plugs, earphones, and wrapping your head with a towel before shooting that stinkin' guide gun... ... I think I'm gonna cut two inches off the barrel!!!#@$%! I've been gonna order an octagon barrel from Lilja and have me a 24-28in SS Cowboy gun... . with no barrel ports!!

 

[BIGNASTY]

Thank's HH Ill put those down and get some more supplies and give them a shot.

 

[JJPage]

Those Hornady loads would be the one to try first. Hopefully they will work satisfactory.

Been reading quite a bit about these loads, seems the 45/70 crowd is fairly pleased with them, the 444 crowd, not so much.

If I may be so bold as to make a comment about this round It would be to listen to Greg he know's of what he speak's

I agree, went back and have read some of GHarmen's past posts... Thanks guys, I do appreciate your advise.

Here's a shot of my two latest additions from the pawn shop, the 444 was barely used, the 45/70 brand new.

 

[BIGNASTY]

Been reading quite a bit about these loads, seems the 45/70 crowd is fairly pleased with them, the 444 crowd, not so much.







I agree, went back and have read some of GHarmen's past posts... Thanks guys, I do appreciate your advise.



Here's a shot of my two latest additions from the pawn shop, the 444 was barely used, the 45/70 brand new.

looks great youll like the bottom one with the larger loop for chambering a round. At least I do my hands are big and it makes it allot better. Great looking pair I proud for you. Have fun.



BIGNASTY

 

[BIGNASTY]

JJPage you might really want to look into reloading as that is where that 45/70 comes into it's own. The factory loads are ok I guess if your going after game for the table. But even then the hand loads make that gun SING

 

[GHarman]

Been reading quite a bit about these loads, seems the 45/70 crowd is fairly pleased with them, the 444 crowd, not so much.







I agree, went back and have read some of GHarmen's past posts... Thanks guys, I do appreciate your advise.



Here's a shot of my two latest additions from the pawn shop, the 444 was barely used, the 45/70 brand new.

Nice LOOKIN' Pair of rifles!

Thanks for the kind comments. However, When HHhuntitall discusses rifles and shooting, listen to him, also. When He speaks, I'll just go "sit in the truck"! GregH

 

[GHarman]

JJPage you might really want to look into reloading as that is where that 45/70 comes into it's own. The factory loads are ok I guess if your going after game for the table. But even then the hand loads make that gun SING

BIGNASTY is Right on the money, here! GregH

 

[BIGNASTY]

BIGNASTY is Right on the money, here! GregH

SHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH dont tell anyone :-laf

 

[HHhuntitall]

Nice LOOKIN' Pair of rifles!

Thanks for the kind comments. However, When HHhuntitall discusses rifles and shooting, listen to him, also. When He speaks, I'll just go "sit in the truck"! GregH

Don't get me started on the benefits of experience, which I'm sure you have more of then I. I just have had the benefit of lots of play and no sleep. And don't go sit in the truck, that's no fun, no matter how mad I make you!! :-laf

JJPage you might really want to look into reloading as that is where that 45/70 comes into it's own. The factory loads are ok I guess if your going after game for the table. But even then the hand loads make that gun SING

... and that's evidence of experience, as well, as it's right on the money!! Most factory loads are backed way off, 'cause what happens if you put a hot load in a Trapdoor?!?! Bang!!! ..... and the bullet doesn't go down the bore!! Reloading for a modern Marlin really makes them come alive!!

 

[JJPage]

looks great youll like the bottom one with the larger loop for chambering a round. At least I do my hands are big and it makes it allot better. Great looking pair I proud for you. Have fun. BIGNASTY

The larger lever caught my attention right off the bat, I have a 44 mag Winchester with the large bail. I had originally given that rifle to Dad for his 70th birthday, he passed last May, and I now have it back. The problem with that large of lever, it hits everything, which kind of ruins the concept of that small carbine with the 16" barrel.

Nice LOOKIN' Pair of rifles! When HHhuntitall discusses rifles and shooting, listen to him. GregH

I have paid strict attention to HHhuntitall also, it's amazing the education that I have gained here, on a diesel forum...



Thank you both for the compliment on the pair of rifles, it was almost a threesome, as they also had a "hardly could tell" it was used, matching 450 Marlin, I figured I already had some "splainin, to do to Lucy" so I passed...

 

[GHarman]

HHhuntitall says;

Don't get me started on the benefits of experience, which I'm sure you have more of then I. I just have had the benefit of lots of play and no sleep. And don't go sit in the truck, that's no fun, no matter how mad I make you!!

Not mad at all:-{}:-laf:-laf:-laf!

GregH

 

[BIGNASTY]

Ya I understand the bigger loop getin caught on things. I ride with gloves on and I just like the bigger loop cause I dont have to call time out take off the glove and then call time in again. It's all about preference. I doooooo like these guns.

 

[HHhuntitall]

Ya I understand the bigger loop getin caught on things. I ride with gloves on and I just like the bigger loop cause I dont have to call time out take off the glove and then call time in again. It's all about preference. I doooooo like these guns.

:-laf I've learned how to lever one with my middle and ring finger pretty well... ... and keep my pinkie out of the way!!!! The big ring is a big no-no for me. I'll be twirling it and cocking it like Chuck Conners if I had one..... MARLIN BIG LOOP LEVER - Brownells



I like 'em all!!!

 

[HHhuntitall]

I KNEW there was one somewhere I had read. PROOF of GHarm's experience(I really just wanted to read it again!! It's some of the best info anywhere, and good for ANY book or trade magazine!!):



Thread: https://www.turbodieselregister.com/forums/guns-bows-shooting-sports-hunting/232977-45-70-a.html

Hawk Bullets; see . 45 caliber, . 458 diameter

Hawk Precision Bullets PRICE LIST



These bullets do not have a cannelure for crimping.

With the soft copper jackets, the reloader can crimp directly into the jacket in a series of separate crimping operations. An additional "tight grip" loading procedure for tubular magazines eliminates the expander ball when full length sizing. This gives the brass maximum spring tension on the bullet as well as the crimp.



Barnes Reloading manual #4 Provides data for the marlin in a 24" barrel. The 400 gr. original style bullet is clocking 1996 FPS with Alliant Reloader 7 powder.



Heres a picture of some loaded . 45/70 configurations I have used in various rifles.

L-R, 350 Gr Hawk FP, 350 Gr Hawk HP, 300 Gr. Nosler Partition, 400Gr Barnes semi-spitzer (for single shot Ruger #1), 500Gr Lazer cast and an empty . 30/06 case for comparison. Only two samples are crimped. The others were loaded for a single shot rifle. However, the configuration is similar for the lever action rifle with the exception of the Semi-Spitzer load. GregH

I also think I owe you guys an apology. I tend to hijack posts... . I just get so excited that I know something about it!! A hundred thoughts go through my head, and I only get a few of them out..... kinda like a blur... . and more throughout the day, even in the back of my head. I just hope I can help in some way..... and not be too big a bother!!