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Fixed price on Smarty

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Frustrated by dealer service

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Hey Gary.



I saw your post, have not had time to be on the internet until now. When I bought my truck (Feb 06) there were not many with 6-speeds available at the time in my New Mexico dealerships. In fact there were not many in Texas or Arizona either. I really did not want to buy out-of-state because that would have been difficult for me to manage the travel, etc. I did contact all the dealers here in NM and had them provide me with truck info, price, etc via the internet. I spoke with all the different dealerhips on the phone as well. All of them were in the same basic ballpark price wise, all of them offered the same discounts, so the margin of difference was not really a big number and the 6-speeds were few and far between so no one was really interested in giving any BIG deals unless it was an automatic, something I did not want and they were overloaded with them everywhere. I purchased a Jeep TJ Sahara a few years ago from one of them, got a decent price, was a satisfied customer, actually have never needed to return for any warranty work with the Jeep. While I was mulling over all the prices, options, 'deals' each of them had proposed to me, I decided to return to the dealership where I purchased my Jeep. I have a Dodge dealership about 30 mins from my home, but the dealership I bought my Jeep and the truck from was a 2-1/2 to 3 hour drive. So, I made plans to go there several days later to buy the truck. I was dealing with a different salesman, the salesman I had with the Jeep was no longer employed there. As we were going over all the sales contract stuff the owner of the dealership popped his head into the cubicle and welcomed me back to his dealership. As the conversation continued between this fellow and I, he picked up the paperwork and started looking it over. He looked at my salesman and asked him if he knew where I purchased the Jeep we drove into the dealership - of course the salesman did not and I had not mentioned the previous purchase to him - he then instructed the salesman to give me a $2,500 ADDITIONAL DISCOUNT because I was a repeat customer to the dealership PLUS he also threw in a couple extra goodies in aftermarket stuff as part of the deal at no additional cost. All I can say is MANNA, what an unexpected suprise. I learned from the salesman that most dealerships knock off something for repeat business, but this amount and the goodies was not the normal something, believe me when I say MANNA.



I have not returned to where I bought the truck for warranty work, I took my truck to the closest dealership 30 mins away. The first time I was there one of the salesmen that I had gotten a sales bid from approached me and asked where I finally ended up getting my truck, I told him. He went on to say that if I had come back with the other dealers bid, they would have matched it and made the deal a little sweeter - so I showed him my purchase paperwork - he was floored at what I paid and told me that I got the best deal he had ever seen. AND GUESS WHAT - I did not play the negotiation game, I just went after what I thought was a fair bid from a reputable, good dealership, who in the end gave me an even better deal without coersion from me regarding the price.



I was eligible for several discounts because I was purchasing my first Dodge truck, have several college degrees (of which each of them get a discount amount that does add up), am a self-employed person, and best of all a repeat customer. It amazes me that the owner recognized me and went out of his was to say hello. I had not met him when I bought the Jeep.



CD
 
I wonder how many internet companies will accept a call on a sunday when their truck is down and need a fuel pump to be able to get home in time for work :-laf :-laf Enjoy your internet shopping Viper



Bob
 
BigPapa said:
Might I ask what you do for a living Mr. Viper?



Scott

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ViperQA1

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Join Date: Oct 2005

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I'm in the U. S. Military Bob and I'm complaining. How much do you think I charge in my line of work? A lot less than you might think for a complainer.



__________________

2005 Cummins 2500 4x4 SB Automatic, Big Horn, cold air intake, AeroTurbine muffler (if you even want to call it a muffler). NITTO Terra Graplers 305/55/R20. Century Cap. BigBob's CB Bracket. XM Radio. Running nothing but AMSOIL.

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Viper, you started this post by asking a question. Several people have posted what appear to be pretty ligitimate answers. Maybe not the ones you wanted but good faith anyway. I think you may be just trying to get under someone's skin. I did a search for "smarty" in ebay but didn't find any of the smarties you are talking about. That subject was addressed a day or two back. You may want to keep your eyes open for one on the internet, bid $684 for it, and if you win it you should be be pretty happy.
 
I had a legitimate question just for the sake of discussion. Bob has something against us military members for some reason. Bob has a tendency to turn it personal by bashing my posts. Bigpapa, I'm in the U. S. Air Force. I'm an F-16 Crew Chief and I've been deployed to the middle east four times, Korea for a year and most conflicts in between in my 12 years so I kind of feel like Bob's comments are off color and definetly inappropriate. I guess us military folks put ourselves in harms way so that Bob has the freedom to make comments like that.

Anyway, back to the topic at hand. I've said over and over that I just plain disagree with manufacturers fixing the price of a product to dealers. I think it's very socialistic. I never said ANYTHING about ebay or bidding or anything like that. I'm talking about just shopping around for the best price of a product you already know you want. I certainly wouldn't pay 20% more for a product if I could get it on the internet for 20% less. JVolpe, I totally agree with you. There are some things I just have to see in order to buy. Unfortunately for the guys downtown (they dont' sell the smarty anyway) I don't need to see the smarty. They're all the same.
 
Viper... ..... you are assuming... I was in the USMC I have nothing against the military or you personnaly . I am proud to have served. I find some things annoying. You just happen to bring up some of those things. Relax go have a beer or something :-laf



Bob
 
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Interesting situation... ... ... ... A member here was sent a free smarty to try out. then later complains about pricing from a legal distributer vs an internet connection. The only reason to pay more would be?Gee lets see maybe R&D,test units sent out for free trials. Service with a smile?



Bob Semper Fi
 
This thread just kills me. Plain and simple if you don't feel the smarty is worth the 685 don't buy it. I haven't been able to get one yet since all of my time and money are tied up in my house and maintaing the fleet but soon I will have one. I have heard for years form customers I have had that I cost to much, but they have learned time and time again theres a good reason for it, I'M WORTH IT. Too many time they have had to have me come in and fix what some one else messed up since they were trying to save money but in the long run it cost more. And why do I cost more, I have more, such as tools and supplys and the quality of the stuff I use. As far as I'm concerened They have every right ot fix the price to make sure that thier name and product isn'ttrashed, and as for who you want to buy it from, does it realy mater? For the most part no mater who you buy it from you will get some of the best service anywhere. oh i'm stepping down.
 
Mr. Viper,



I appreciate your service to our great country. But let me be the first to say you need an education on what has made this country great and what may well bring it down.



This country has evolved by your "survival of the fittest" but the "fittest" isn't always (really almost never is) the cheapest. It has come from the "fittest" PRODUCTS, the "fittest" minds, and the "fittest" innovators. The "Walmart" mentality of people like yourself are chipping away at the foundation of our great nation. Sometimes there are more important things than the condition of your wallet.



Your math needs a little lesson, too. You stated in your latest post that "I certainly wouldn't pay 20% more for a product if I could get it on the internet for 20% less. " 20% is a great difference in price. That would bring your Smarty from $700 to $560. Even I would probably be persuaded by that figure, but in an earlier post you stated "If I know what I want and the guy downtown is selling a smarty for say $700 and the guy on the internet is selling one for $685 shipped, I'm 99. 9% going to get it from the guy on the internet. " That's a difference of just over 2%. You can take it home NOW,

Mr. Downtown has invested his money so you can have it now, the tax revenues will go to YOUR little corner of the world. Also, Mr. Downtown, your neighbor, has a business and a family to support. Are these things not worth just over 2% of $700? Why throw that away to the internet sluts for just over 2%?



So which will it be? As MA2LA stated, there's a lot more to a product than price. There's also quality, knowledge, and integrity. These are things that your wallet can't buy and they are what is being pitched away by people like you. When your "survival of the CHEAPEST" evolution comes out on top, and there are no more people left with these qualities, what kind of world will it be? What if your life depended, right now, on a product brought about by being THE CHEAPEST? Sure it may have been built by the lowest bidder, but I've never seen anything mil-spec that was anything like CHEAP. I guess your glad the military doesn't think the way you do. If they did they would have Juan or Jose doing your job with Chinese tools.



Scott
 
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CD, Do you tow with that 3. 73 in NM? If so, how does it do?

I test drove a '06 Mega 3500 6 spd today under the assumption that all 3500s were 4. 10 - sales pamphlet tech specs stated only 2500s offered 3. 73. But when RPMs were so low, I asked sales rep to verify and sure enough it was a 3. 73. I'll be towing about 15k - grateful for your opinion.
 
BigPapa said:
Mr. Viper,



I appreciate your service to our great country. But let me be the first to say you need an education on what has made this country great and what may well bring it down.



This country has evolved by your "survival of the fittest" but the "fittest" isn't always (really almost never is) the cheapest. It has come from the "fittest" PRODUCTS, the "fittest" minds, and the "fittest" innovators. The "Walmart" mentality of people like yourself are chipping away at the foundation of our great nation. Sometimes there are more important things than the condition of your wallet.



Your math needs a little lesson, too. You stated in your latest post that "I certainly wouldn't pay 20% more for a product if I could get it on the internet for 20% less. " 20% is a great difference in price. That would bring your Smarty from $700 to $560. Even I would probably be persuaded by that figure, but in an earlier post you stated "If I know what I want and the guy downtown is selling a smarty for say $700 and the guy on the internet is selling one for $685 shipped, I'm 99. 9% going to get it from the guy on the internet. " That's a difference of just over 2%. You can take it home NOW,

Mr. Downtown has invested his money so you can have it now, the tax revenues will go to YOUR little corner of the world. Also, Mr. Downtown, your neighbor, has a business and a family to support. Are these things not worth just over 2% of $700? Why throw that away to the internet sluts for just over 2%?



So which will it be? As MA2LA stated, there's a lot more to a product than price. There's also quality, knowledge, and integrity. These are things that your wallet can't buy and they are what is being pitched away by people like you. When your "survival of the CHEAPEST" evolution comes out on top, and there are no more people left with these qualities, what kind of world will it be? What if your life depended, right now, on a product brought about by being THE CHEAPEST? Sure it may have been built by the lowest bidder, but I've never seen anything mil-spec that was anything like CHEAP. I guess your glad the military doesn't think the way you do. If they did they would have Juan or Jose doing your job with Chinese tools.



Alright, I'm done now. Turn off the music. ;)



Scott



Scott, I totally respect your opinion and I'll provide a response with out singling you out. The world is changing with or without you. Since the invention of internet, the world has gotten a whole lot smaller. So it's vital to "Mr. Downtown", as you put it, to change and evolve with the times or risk going out of business or having a big piece of his pie taken away. This is happening as we speak to the business owners who don't realize that the fair market for certain products isn't just in their geographical area anymore. Eventually, all the old fellas that buy based on principle will leave this earth and some businesses will have to hop on board or just get out of the way. This country was founded on a fair amount of capitol freedom. It was founded on capitol darwinism. You're right, it isn't fair and I don't think it should be.
 
I have already mentioned this. I do not agree with price fixing and anybody who knows economics understands why. Price fixing causes shortages, surpluses, etc, etc. However it is Marco's product and he can choose to run the business however he chooses. Actually I know of the area around central indiana, the CEO of IMI(irving materials incorporated) is serving jail time for this. Of course the circumstances are a little different. I can understand why they are fixing the price of the smarty, I just think there are better ways to do this. Maybe the price fixing is just a short term to get the situation under control. Hopefully the cases of sales with no service will be small enough that they can drop the price fixing and let the free market economy.
 
I was well aware of the advertised $685 for the Smarty CR and was willing to pay that plus shipping. I bought from a vendor (doesn't matter who right now, my point still stand) for less than MSRP AND received free overnight shipping due to snow/delivery issues.



Nick
 
NPloysa said:
I was well aware of the advertised $685 for the Smarty CR and was willing to pay that plus shipping. I bought from a vendor (doesn't matter who right now, my point still stand) for less than MSRP AND received free overnight shipping due to snow/delivery issues.



Nick



What, no candy bar? ;) :-laf :-laf



With full respect for all posters to this thread, and sticking by by own comments as to price shopping when and where it's appropriate, no one has pointed out the obvious where the Smarty in particular is concerned!



Marco did literally YEARS of research and development in producing first the CaTCHER, and now several versions of the smarty. This is NOT a full-blown industrial factory/assembly line produced product, probably far more like one done in a garage or relatively small shop - and each Smarty virtually built/assembled and tested by HAND!



This is a very specialized and limited production item, and precious LITTLE room at this point for significant "adjustment" in pricing, especially when they are probably being bought as fast as they can be made.



We're not dealing with Banks, or Edge, or other relatively high volume producers here, so different rules of distribution and pricing have to apply.



Thanks for being there, especially to Bob and Marco who at this point have the most invested in time and effort - I, for one, well appreciate your product and service - and am a fully satisfied customer!
 
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ViperQA1 said:
Scott, I totally respect your opinion and I'll provide a response with out singling you out. The world is changing with or without you. Since the invention of internet, the world has gotten a whole lot smaller. So it's vital to "Mr. Downtown", as you put it, to change and evolve with the times or risk going out of business or having a big piece of his pie taken away. This is happening as we speak to the business owners who don't realize that the fair market for certain products isn't just in their geographical area anymore. Eventually, all the old fellas that buy based on principle will leave this earth and some businesses will have to hop on board or just get out of the way. This country was founded on a fair amount of capitol freedom. It was founded on capitol darwinism. You're right, it isn't fair and I don't think it should be.





Sorry, I see this differently. We'll use the MR. Downtown example. Mr. Downtown has a building to rent, employees to pay, taxes, advertising, insurance, tooling, ect. He has overhead. Plus he needs to take something home to eat with.

Most of your cut rate Ebay guys have few or none of these costs. He sits at home all day and just Drop Ships products from suppliers. Doesn't install, doesn't service, and doesn't help when things head south. Half these guys don't even own a diesel!!! They are there for the cash.



Someone brought up the truck pricing. I see a major difference there. Yes, you bought below MSRP, maybe even close to Cost. But that dealer gets incentives to move volume from the automaker. And they are making Money hand over fist. Aftermarket products are different. It costs what it costs, and we have to mark it up to cover our costs (advertising, rent, insurance, ect).



I don't see anyone complaining that the 3500 4x4 CTD cost more than the 1500 4x2 V6. Better products cost more money.



Bottom line, if you don't like the price either buy something different or wait for someone to sell a used one.
 
ViperQA1 said:
This country was founded on a fair amount of capitol freedom. It was founded on capitol darwinism. You're right, it isn't fair and I don't think it should be.



How about that! You answered your own question...
 
stevelauer.



Yes I tow, actually I tow heavy loads, draft horses 6-up and all that goes with them. I tow both GN and bumper pull trailers. I am VERY WELL PLEASED with the trucks performance. I also have 315 tires, which to some and their thinking would reduce my towing capabilities. I can tell you that this is not the case. Lots of power from starting out and also on hills. I have not had any problems in the tow power dept.



As I understand the ratios, the 410's with the auto pretty much are the same as the 373's with the stick when it comes to final ratios. I went to the larger tires to get the rpm's into the sweet spot of right around 2Krpm at 65mph. My fuel economy towing is also good.



CD
 
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