2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission Free-wheel hubs for 2002 full-time axles?

[geusterman]

While the new (stone age?) front axle minus the lock-out is certainly a reliable setup it lacks the mpg advantages of the lock-out. So, hubs are a possibilty and I wondered if any of you 2002 owners (and now 2003 American owners) have done any R and D on this subject? George

 

[tarussell]

Get your check book out and your credit cards and call Dynatrac !

 

[benhall]

Do you guys want the bad news first or the even worse news first?



Bad news, Dynatrac makes a conversion, but it only works up to the '99 model year.



Even worse news, Dynatrac doesn't have anything for our '00-02's because of an ABS sensor that would be in the way of their product. :{



Sorry guys.



Ben

 

[geusterman]

This is not good boys. Anybody check Warn yet? George

 

[jmeehan]

I e-mailed Warn about this since they build a locking hub conversion for the Wranglers. It's been a couple years now. The reply was they had no plans for a hub conversion kit for our trucks. Maybe a flood of e-mails would get them going?

 

[Mundgyver]

I had talked with WARN about a year ago on this and the response I got, if I understood it correctly was a problem of working with the sealed bearing that Dodge uses in the hubs vice the old style that you could pull apart and re-pac. My take was that you would wind up re-engineering the whole assembly which was cost prohibitive. Any body else heard this before

 

[tarussell]

That's the way I understand it. I was hopeing that things had changed but it doesn't look so. I even thought about using Ford parts but since DC changed the ball joint location on the 2000 or 2001 and up trucks we can't even do that. Anybody got any thought's ???

 

[illflem]

I don't know how that could be true since Dodge has been using the sealed front bearing on 4wds since at least '94

 

[tarussell]

Good Point, I just re-read the above. I was meaning that the after market probably would not do the R and D for just three years of production.

 

[jmeehan]

The Wranglers use the same style of sealed bearing/hub assembly that our trucks do, though rather smaller. For those Warn built a new spindle and hub that uses the old style tapered roller bearings.

 

[tarussell]

According to Dynatrac and benhall's earlier post the problem is with the tone ring for the A. B. S. not the hub/bearing.

 

[NVR FNSH]

I can't imagine there being a 'reasonable' return on investment for this mod. I believe the Dynatrac kit is ~$2000. For what kind of mileage improvement? I guesstimated it would take ~330k miles to payback on the installation of a GV overdrive at ~$2500.



If I was that concerned about the MPG I would have bought a 2wd.



Brian

 

[geusterman]

Hubs never cost $2000 before. Besides, ROI is not always the issue. So there. George

 

[KSTRS]

I agree with Brian, seems cost prohibitive with little return. Besides I get off road with my truck daily & would find lock-outs to be a serious PIA.

 

[tarussell]

Two reason's I wanted to get the Dynatrac kit was for the larger axles ( 1. 5" vs. 1. 31" ) and to put a locking differential in the front end. The hub and tappered roller bearing's in the kit would be nice but I have not had a problem w/the Dodge hub/bearing (sealed) arrangement;I just want bigger axles and a better diff. .

Thomas

 

[BigUgly]

I agree, it would have been good of DC to offer manual hubs as an option like Ford. I would have gotten them, Pity.

Now here's my slant on it. About a year ago I was all set for somehow getting lock-out hubs on this truck. Other stuff came up and I sorta forgot about it untill this post brought it all back. And then I got to thinking (oops). Do we really need thicker axles? Has anyone on this board ever broken a front axle? With all the tractor pulling, drag racing in 4WD? Anyone? I believe that if Stacked-N-Jacked hasn't broken one yet with his 36s and a goobs of power, I think most of us are okay. Sure, I bet that if I wanted to I could break one, slap some 44s on there, put twins on and go rock crawling, yup, it would most likely break.

But is anyone out there doing that?

Josiah

 

[tarussell]

I have seen two CTD manual transmission trucks break front axles. It was not because of big meats like 44" tall tires it was because of to much traction and weight. One of the truck's broke the front c. v. joint and a front inner axle at the spline ( to be fair ,he was spinning the tires searching for traction with a fully loaded trailer in tow while in some sand and the front grabbed and he did not let off of the throttle enough ). The other truck was not abussed just used like a true work truck and it broke the inner axle at the spline too. I understand that the stock small axles do hold up fairly well in our trucks but I want the added security of a strong front end just like the Dana 60's in the first Gen. trucks ( 35 spline 1-1/2" inner axles ). I am not saying that the axles are weak;I think that it is very impressive that the axles hold up in the sled pulling crowd,but I want a certain amount of overbuild in the truck -- just like the older ones had in the front axle department. I believe that with good and careful driving while in four wheel drive that most drivetrain's will hold up , but I want to be able to do what it takes when needed and not worry about snapping a down graded size axle shaft.

Just my point of view on the subject, Thomas

 

[NVR FNSH]

George - the Dynatrac kit includes a lot more than the manual hubs - try spindles, bearings, locking hub, hub (for the rotor), axle shafts, etc. The Dynatrac kit eliminates the vacuum switch/slider on the long axle shaft. So there Heck, if it was just a matter of bolting on the manual hubs my truck would have had them long ago.



Regarding the two axle failures mentioned in the above post:

Did the shafts fail at the sliding collar?



Brian

 

[tarussell]

NVR FNSH , The abused axle broke just past the spline on the intermediate axle shaft where it necks down in size; it splintered the axle shaft. The other one broke clean, right at the spline going into the side gear in the diff. . Both were where the axle is at its smallest size. The sliding collar and the rest of the C. A. D. stuff worked rather well and did not fail. I actually am starting to enjoy the convinience(SP) of this system but I wish the shafts were bigger and as over-built like the rest of the drivetrain.

In my opinion the axle's broke because of to much traction and to small in size, not because of the C. A. D. system.



The truck has the stoutest transmission( NVG 5600 ) ever offered in a 1 Ton on down, and a tremendous engine with amazing torque #'s from the factory, 1410 series u-joints in the rear drive shaft's and a Dana model 80 rear axle , but yet , they put the smallest front axle shafts, ever, in the front axle. Never before has the factory offered trucks with such great pay-loads and pulling ability in a 3/4 or 1 Ton truck and I think that every part of the drivetrain should be up to the task ; not just the parts that are used the most often.



I like the system on the trucks , I would just like the same engineering that went into the rest of the drivetrain. Well that's my $. 02 worth. Sorry for going on and on , Thomas

 

[JHansen]

I'm with you Tom-WTH is up with 44-sized axle shafts in our 60's? You would think that it would have clued into an engineer's head somewhere that extreme front end weight plus gobs of torque equals a potentially bad scene somewhere down the road-although I kinda think the engineers knew this but got overridden by the accountants... ...



Mine gets used as a work truck dragging my fat butt into some horrific places-some of which I would be walking back out of if I manage to fail something. There's definitely going to be some kind of an upgrade in my future-just not sure what yet!



Jason