2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission front axle rebound, scary...

[FHerault]

Hello,



Yesterday, on the road, my front left wheel hurt 2 or three small bumps, I was about at 50/55 mph. My front axle start to bounce and it wouldn't stop until I put the brake on. It was a very big and constant bounce, like an earthquake in the cab, I had one of my daughter in the truck and she was scared. The same thing happened to me few years ago, it was with a Comanche... I've never resolved the intermittent problem before I sold the truck...

It's scary because when it happens it seems that you don't have the control of the truck...



What to check ?

Thanks in advance !

 

[GrantP]

Do a search for "death wobble", lots and lots of info available on this site.

 

[FHerault]

Thank you GrantP.



The symptoms I described could be called the "death wobble" ?



So, in spite of the mods on my truck, it could have the "death wobble" ?... :-(

I do the search today.

 

[Extreme1]

Your truck (NOT YOU!) had a bout of death wobble. Don't worry, it's curable as long as the steering parts are all tight, the trailing arm bushings aren't loose (the rubber breaks down over time) and there is enough positive caster (5 degrees).

 

[FHerault]

Oufff... Extreme1... I thought my hands were shaking too much... thanks !

My truck has a steering stabilizer (DSS) and a 2003 track bar kit, so I didn't expect to see the death wobble with that, but I think I have to check all ball-joints and bushings and if all is tight. After that I'll have to perform an alignment and put my winter wheels...

So tomorrow morning I'll lift the front end anf will post to have assistance if I see something wrong.

Thanks again for the answers.

 

[Missouri Mule]

Worn shocks can cause it also.

 

[GrantP]

Thank you GrantP.



The symptoms I described could be called the "death wobble" ?



So, in spite of the mods on my truck, it could have the "death wobble" ?... :-(

I do the search today.

Don't worry too much, it's a curable "disease". The trick is to find the suspension component(s) at fault. Assuming your alignment is correct, check for any front end components that have any play, tie rod ends, trac bar, ball joints, wheel bearings, control arm bushings... check everything, you'll find something is loose/worn out. I've dealt with it on two separate occasions, the first time a new trac bar fixed it. The second time I replaced another worn out trac bar and replaced the steering with the inverted T setup from a 99. I haven't had a steering stabilizer since I switched to the T setup 20k miles ago. I'm "death wobble" free with 149k on the clock... .



FWIW, I was (and still am) running 2. 5 remote reservoir Fox shocks during the second death wobble incident. I was running new bilsteins the first time it happened. Good shocks won't prevent the death wobble if there is an underlying problem in the front end, same goes with a steering stabilizer. My . 02.

 

[BDaugherty]

I agree with the previous posts. You had death wobble. Repair any worn front end components first. Then install a new steering stabilizer and front shocks. I like the Rancho steering stabilizer available at Advance Auto Parts for around $50. For shocks, the choice is yours as long as you use gas charged shocks. The Bilstiens are really nice, but there are cheaper ones that will do the job... as long as they are gas charged.

Just my $0. 02.

 

[FHerault]

Thanks for the answers.



I've already Bilstein shocks so I will not go to that step first.

BDaugherty, when you talk about a steering stabilizer, you're talking about the shock on the steering linkage aren't you ? because I've already a DSS and I don't think this part needs replacement...



A poor alignment could cause the DW alone ? I'm in doubt...

I'm going under the truck right now, see you later

 

[FHerault]

OK I'm back...



I went under the truck and checked all joint with a "prybar", the 03 trackbar is solid, no play. The tierod end have no noticible play, either the lower and upper ball joint (I will have to re-check them with the truck levelled... ).

But... I try to explain with my words, correct me if I'm wrong...

The arm under the steering box (called pit-arm?) has a ball-joint coming threw (attached to the bar that goes to the right wheel). When my daughter is turning the wheel, engine off, I can see a up and down play (less than 1/8) at the ball, I doubt that is normal ?! Is it enough, with a bad alignment, to provocate the DW ?...

 

[Mishkaya]

Thanks for the answers.



I've already Bilstein shocks so I will not go to that step first.

BDaugherty, when you talk about a steering stabilizer, you're talking about the shock on the steering linkage aren't you ?

A poor alignment could cause the DW alone ? I'm in doubt...

I'm going under the truck right now, see you later

I believe that's what he is talking about. It should probably be replaced.

OK I'm back...



I went under the truck and checked all joint with a "prybar", the 03 trackbar is solid, no play. The tierod end have no noticible play, either the lower and upper ball joint (I will have to re-check them with the truck levelled... ).

But... I try to explain with my words, correct me if I'm wrong...

The arm under the steering box (called pit-arm?) has a ball-joint coming threw (attached to the bar that goes to the right wheel). When my daughter is turning the wheel, engine off, I can see a up and down play (less than 1/8) at the ball, I doubt that is normal ?! Is it enough, with a bad alignment, to provocate the DW ?...

That arm is called the Drag Link. You should have no noticeable play.

I am responding to this post because I also have had the precursor to the Death Wobble on my '02 in spite of a DSS and third gen track bar kit. In my case, the control arms are shot (bad bushings), and I am replacing them with custom made ones, but the bushings can be replaced. Also the tie-rod ends have a bit of play (in spite of the fact that I couldn't detect it myself, but the alignment shop showed me plain as day). I also needed new sway bar bushings and sway bar links. I cannot comment on the change, as I won't have the truck back until Monday as I am not doing the control arms myself, nor the ball joints or the alignment.

Hope this helps some

 

[DonFitzwater]

A little slop in your pitman arm link should'nt cause the death wobble. I ended up chasing mine all over the place before a new steering stabilizer form BDS (twin shocks) fixed it. You should think about a DSS also.

 

[FHerault]

Thanks Mishkaya and DFitzwater.



I have a DSS already.

Do you know if the ball-joint is an assembly with the bar or it can be purchased alone ? I'm concern about this little slop but I'll wait for other reply about that...

To check the control arm bushing, the truck should be on or off the floor ? The bushing can be change at home or is it a press fit ?

Can the steering shock be tested or I just have to consider it bad after some years ?



Lots of question, thanks to be patient...

 

[Mishkaya]

Thanks Mishkaya and DFitzwater.



I have a DSS already.

Do you know if the ball-joint is an assembly with the bar or it can be purchased alone ? I'm concern about this little slop but I'll wait for other reply about that...

To check the control arm bushing, the truck should be on or off the floor ? The bushing can be change at home or is it a press fit ?

Can the steering shock be tested or I just have to consider it bad after some years ?



Lots of question, thanks to be patient...

Don't know about the ball-joint on the drag link to be honest. As for the control arms, mine were loose both on the floor and in the air... .

The bushings are press fit on them as far as I know. Depending on your location, you might be able to get a set used control arms for cheap to play with as many are upgrading to aftermarket ones (as I am), and would be willing to let the old ones go for the price of shipping. Just a thought. The poly replacement bushings are cheap at any rate. As for the shock, it can be tested easily once removed (which can be hard enough to do when they get old). Mine had visibly leaked oil so I knew it was no good.

 

[Extreme1]

The alignment can and does cause DW. Caster is the inclination of the line between the upper and lower ball joints. A lift kit will reduce this number and many people's trucks may DW after a lift kit if the front wheels werent's re-aligned to correct the caster change from the lift.



If the caster is too close to 0 the wheels can shake back and forth at a high rate if they are 'excited' (dynamic systems class rearing its ugly head) and that is DW, not up and down. One spring a few years ago a newer bridge transition that I drove over every day started causing DW on my truck at 55 but not at 45. I was going to get a cam corder and video the DW that Saturday but guess what the county road guys fixed that Friday afternoon?



The optimal caster target is 5 degrees, the local shop here gets all they can.

 

[GrantP]

The arm under the steering box (called pit-arm?) has a ball-joint coming threw (attached to the bar that goes to the right wheel). When my daughter is turning the wheel, engine off, I can see a up and down play (less than 1/8) at the ball, I doubt that is normal ?! Is it enough, with a bad alignment, to provocate the DW ?...

In my opinion, yes. Replace that joint and let us know if the DW goes away. You'll need to have your truck re-aligned after the joint is replaced too.

 

[bheiting]

About a year and a half ago the CEO of KORE reported that their research indicated
"death wobble" is caused by a fault in the Ram's front end geometry. It's caused
by tow in angle change as the tire bounces. The 2008's were supposed to correct
the problem. Worn front end components would certainly make it more likely.

 

[GrantP]

About a year and a half ago the CEO of KORE reported that their research indicated

"death wobble" is caused by a fault in the Ram's front end geometry. It's caused

by tow in angle change as the tire bounces. The 2008's were supposed to correct

the problem. Worn front end components would certainly make it more likely.

I agree that the inverted Y steering on most 2nd gen 4x4's is fundamentally flawed. The toe in/out that occurs when the front suspension cycles may make it more prone to DW. At the very least, tire wear will suffer from it. I've since switched to the inverted T setup and haven't had any DW experiences in the last 20k or so miles with the new steering setup. That may not be a function of the new steering geometry though, just that all of the parts are new and tight. Time will tell.

 

[FHerault]

One day I will perhaps switch to the T setup, when I 'll find 500$ under the carpet !



Before taking a RDV for an alignment, I decided to put on the Rock solid bushing that I have somewhere in a box... I 've finded the bushing, the pvc tube (installation tool) but not the retainer that they talk about on their site... Perhaps the first kits didn't have a retainer ? In my installation procedure, there is no reference for a retainer... What does it look like ? Can I bypass the retainer by putting the stock spring between the bushing and the shaft, or tightening a collar under the bushing ?



Thanks again...