Fuel addative?

[SShafranko]

I am very confused and i would greatly appreciate if someone could clear this up for me once and for all.



Half of my friends who own diesels(05 and up) say that you do not need any fuel addatives and the other half say that you do for lubricity.



Could someone please anwser this for me and if the anwser is yes what is a good addative and how much. Thank You in advance.

 

[HSpiering]

I don't use anything! Half the people will tell to use it. You will not learn much difference than you know now.

 

[DPellegrin]

SShafranko,



I doubt if you will clear this debate up "... once and for all" but here is my experience and info.



The fleet I manage of 1000 diesel powered vehicles uses about 11,000,000 gallons of ULS diesel each year all with no lubricity additive supplied by me. We have never experienced failures that we can trace to the lubricity characteristic of the fuel we use. We do test samples of our fuel however, and find that it meets both Cummins and DDC specs for lubricity. You can find these specs published on the relevant web sites and the standard lubricity tests are called "High Frenquency Reciprocating Rig" (HFRR) and "Scuffing Load Ball On Cylinder Lubricating Evaluator" (SLBOCLE) tests.



I do know that my fuel supplier blends a lubricity additive in the fuel at recommended concentrations from their refinery engineers.



This seems to work OK for us. I know there are many "Snake Oil" additive salesman out there, so just be skeptical about their claims.



Best Regards,

 

[SShafranko]

Thank you for your information. As of now i am going to stick to the same system i have used in the past seventy three thousand miles; and that is fuel up and go.



Thank you again

 

[AKaiser]

Just use a high quality B2 and you have no worries for lubricity. It's easily the best lubricant on the market. Read the report at http://inchoate.harm.org/~halbritt/dodge/Diesel Fuel Additive V3.pdf

 

[SShafranko]

Just use a high quality B2 and you have no worries for lubricity. It's easily the best lubricant on the market. Read the report at http://inchoate.harm.org/~halbritt/dodge/Diesel Fuel Additive V3.pdf

How much B2 do i use per tank? Can i ran straight B99or 100?

 

[cj hall]

what

Sorry I just cant take it.





All you that say just add or run b2 what is that amount going to do

2. 57 oz in 128 oz. thats what we are talking about.



so in 32 gallons of diesel oz you put in 88 oz. of biodiesel AND YOU ARE PAYING MORE FOR THE BIODIESEL. if you put in 5 gallons of b2 its 12. 85 oz.



MY THOUGHTS ARE ANY AMOUNT OF BIODIESEL BELOW 75% IS A WASTE OF TIME 2% IS A FEEL GOOD FUEL. it makes you feel good thats it.



So you can stick your head in the sand or you can deal with it in any way you want but if you ask 5 people you will get 6 answers.



this is my . 10 cents worth



cj hall

 

[HSpiering]

This may be a real DUMB question to all of you additive gurus but: If you CAN NOT use additives in the 6. 7. Why would any one need it in a 5. 9?:-laf

 

[SShafranko]

This may be a real DUMB question to all of you additive gurus but: If you CAN NOT use additives in the 6. 7. Why would any one need it in a 5. 9?:-laf

I would love to know why you can't in an 07. Is it new technology on an 07 and if so why did they change from the 06. The fuel is the same from 06 to 07 isn't it? Maybe you do need a lube addative pre 07?

 

[HSpiering]

Read Paragraph 3, (6. 7 HP CR) Page #42 Last TDR.



06 XLT4X4 REG Cab Inferno Red LT265/70/OR17owl on/off-road tires. Leer Shell, ONKI NERF boards.



Sold 94 XLT 4x4 REG Cab Pearl Blue. Raider Shell 265/75/16 Toyo M-55

 

[AKaiser]

How much B2 do i use per tank? Can i ran straight B99or 100?

You use B2 as is. It's already blended 2% biodiesel in 98% No 2 diesel. If you read the article, the lubricity of a B2 blend AS IS (it's ALREADY BLENDED) is the best lubricity vice using typical (and not so typical) lubricity addititves. Yes, you could use B99 at a 2% v/v rate to do the same thing.

 

[AKaiser]

Sorry I just cant take it.





All you that say just add or run b2 what is that amount going to do

2. 57 oz in 128 oz. thats what we are talking about.



so in 32 gallons of diesel oz you put in 88 oz. of biodiesel AND YOU ARE PAYING MORE FOR THE BIODIESEL. if you put in 5 gallons of b2 its 12. 85 oz.



MY THOUGHTS ARE ANY AMOUNT OF BIODIESEL BELOW 75% IS A WASTE OF TIME 2% IS A FEEL GOOD FUEL. it makes you feel good thats it.



cj hall

Based on what data?

 

[JFaughn]

2% is about what any additive is meant to be by ratio .
Different yrs have different fuel systems requiring , or not additives , thats why owner manuals , to keep the owner informed .
cj you have fallen off the edge again ,
did not seem that you followed the post that you are knocking , and yes you can pay more for bio , but your statement implies that everyone goes to the highest price station , the most I've paid is $2. 00 commercially produced .

 

[cj hall]

So Sorry

But he asked about an Additive Not biodiesel (THE FUEL THAT WILL SAVE THE WORLD) someone else told him that the best additive out there is biodiesel, I think different thats all !!!!!!

If you want to make ADM and Cargill the next Cenex or Exxon or Conoco then by all means run your truck on biodiesel.



If you can get Biodiesel for under 2. 01 per gallon then good for you I am sure everone would love to get it at that price. I can't buy it where I live and I won't because when the one place had it did not even know what it was what it was made from or what blend it was the only thing they knew was it cost more than reg diesel fuel at that time AND THEY COULD NOT SELL IT !!!!



Now they Won't . Because they said "no one would buy it"

MY eight year old is smarter than these people. if it costs more and its works the same buy the the one that saves you money.



the people that make e85 have the right idea I have some that a friend got me in denver 2. 10 per gallon thats over 500 miles from me. THINK HE MIGHT BRING BIODIESEL UP IT MUST BE CHEAPER THERE.



GIVE ME A BREAK !!!!!



cj hall

 

[Regcabguy]

SShafranko,



I doubt if you will clear this debate up "... once and for all" but here is my experience and info.



The fleet I manage of 1000 diesel powered vehicles uses about 11,000,000 gallons of ULS diesel each year all with no lubricity additive supplied by me. We have never experienced failures that we can trace to the lubricity characteristic of the fuel we use. We do test samples of our fuel however, and find that it meets both Cummins and DDC specs for lubricity. You can find these specs published on the relevant web sites and the standard lubricity tests are called "High Frenquency Reciprocating Rig" (HFRR) and "Scuffing Load Ball On Cylinder Lubricating Evaluator" (SLBOCLE) tests.



I do know that my fuel supplier blends a lubricity additive in the fuel at recommended concentrations from their refinery engineers.



This seems to work OK for us. I know there are many "Snake Oil" additive salesman out there, so just be skeptical about their claims.



Best Regards,

Ditto on your experience here at work in San Diego. Our vehicle maintenance crew have never experienced a fuel related failure with our hundreds of school buses,trucks etc. Good luck? I can't say. Fresh fuel? Several times a week.

 

[AKaiser]

So Sorry

But he asked about an Additive Not biodiesel...

cj hall

Whatever. Cost issues aside, what makes Biodiesel NOT an additive? NOTHING. If you have 98 gallons of DF2 and you ADD 2 gallons of straight Biodiesel to it, the bio IS an ADDITIVE. And you can buy the fuel pre-ADDITIVIZED.



As far as price is concerned, well, soybeans are OVER $14 per bushel, which is about DOUBLE what they were just 3 years ago. I don't expect that figure to stay anywhere near that in the long term. There's an old saying about prices and it works both ways: The cure for high/low prices IS high/low prices.

the people that make e85 have the right idea I have some that a friend got me in denver 2. 10 per gallon thats over 500 miles from me. THINK HE MIGHT BRING BIODIESEL UP IT MUST BE CHEAPER THERE.



GIVE ME A BREAK !!!!!



cj hall

Sure, CJ, and watch your fuel economy drop drastically, unlike a compression engine running bio of any percentage blend. The GOOD news about ethanol, is if you up the engine compression, e85 fuel economy is at LEAST as good as a gasoline engine running 87 octane, perhaps better.



I think you're all wet on this one.

 

[cj hall]

additive or not

will thats your opinon

running 2% BIO DIESEL is a feel good fuel

Oh it makes you feel good but will not help off set the real problem.



this is my opinon if you dont like it I am sorry.

cj hall

 

[AKaiser]

will thats your opinon

running 2% BIO DIESEL is a feel good fuel

Oh it makes you feel good but will not help off set the real problem.



this is my opinon if you dont like it I am sorry.

cj hall

I'm not interested in unscientific opinions. Now, just WHAT, if I may ask is the "real" problem? The report regarding 2% Bio vs other "ADDITIVES" was regarding lubricity in fuel pumps, which is EXACTLY the problem we've been concerned about with ULSD.

 

[cj hall]

Ulsd

The problem with ulsd is the lack of lube in the fuel (suphlur is a lube) do you know how the ulsd is made this will scare you when you find out.



the fact that it will suck water out of the air when sitting in the storage tanks and the they (the refinerys) have had to build new tanks with large pumps on the sides of the tanks just to keep it all mixed up.



bio diesel is what the goverment wants us to change to but the problem is we have built houses on prime farm land and we cant grow the fuel we need.

e85 will replace gasoline but it means that corn prices will and have gone up.

biodiesel mostly made from soybeans has had the price go up also.



and even if we replace gasoline with e85 we wont get any more diesel from a barrel of crude you get 17 gallons of diesel #2 from 42 gallons of crude that's it.



so yes you can use biodiesel as a additive or you can use an additive as a additive. its up to the owner of the truck.



I live in Billings Montana we have over 100,000. people live in this town three refinerys and the funny thing is we can not get biodiesel here. I can get it in WestYellostone Mt and in Jackson Hole Wy. It costs more then reg diesel.



you need to add some thing to the ulsd for lube yes there are people that say its fine just the way it is but these are high fuel use and they get fresh fuel all the time do you have any clue how long the fuel in your truck has been sitting around before you got it.



I don't



cj hall

 

[RWalker]

You are correct there are a lot additives that don't work the way they say they should. I happen to work for a diesel fuel additive company and we test alot of the products on the market to see what there claims are,usually ther claims aren't quite correct. A sales trick of my competeitors that I teach my customers, is to look at any brand bottle and look at say the cetane promise. Say the bottle says up to a 5 cetane number, what number is up to? 1,2,3,4,5, there the experts shouldn't they know how there product performs. When we offer a product we know exactly what type of performance it will have and we put it on the bottle. I also talk to many independent truck drivers who come to our place to unload one of our chemicals and give them a sample of one our products that many of TDR subscribers use. Many of the truck drivers become customers, because they notice immediatley when they add our additive, that there trucks run smoother, have more power (15hp 20# torque,dyno tested)get better fuel economy, and the product has added detergency, lubricity and stabilization.