2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission Gel Batteries

[Matt42]

My original Mopar's were fine at four years but I replaced them with Optima red tops. Fred Swanson of Desert Diesel Parts recommended them saying they were the only type that can survive the hot climate of the desert where he lives. So far so good.

Fred's right.

 

[BK]

I think the technical term for the spiral cell technology is starved electrolyte.

"absorbed electrolyte"...

 

[Rebel Ram]

What would be wrong with running deep cycle RV Batteries? They seem to have better No's and cost less. I ask this because I dont know and need to buy soon. (read today)

 

[Jeepmullet]

DO NOT USE ODYSSEY BATTERIES... I cant warn you off enough. There's a handful of threads on www.x-h20.com that deal with odyssey warranty claims. That site has been hacked but when it comes back up I'll find the threads

 

[Bart]

My oem batteries (primarily the one on the passenger side) would spit acid all over the place during charging (almost anytime the engine was running). When one of them died, I cleaned everything up, repainted the inner fenders and installed two red top Optimas. They work GREAT!!! No more mess. I highly recommend them. Their staying power is beyond belief. I have one in my off roader and I could tell you stories about what it's done with the engine off and still had the power to fire the engine later.

 

[BK]

The Optimas are such a favorite in off road vehicles for two reasons, they take the pounding better and don't have liquid electrolyte to leak from a cracked cell, heat , over camber or a flip. I've had them in my other trucks and camper. . all been great. They will be going into the Dodge when I have to replace the OEM batteries.



If your OEM batteries are spewing electrolyte, they are being over charged. .

But that maynot be the fault of your charging system, but better that you check the charging system.

If the charging system is fine, what tends to happen is the remaining good cells of that battery will over charge if one or more cells are shorted internally.

Which is not uncommon for the standard liquid car battery, deposits build on the bottom, there is a space for it. But extra pounding or abuse can cause more deposits then anticipated, and the deposit build up to the where the plates come in contact, and you now have an internal short and the battery acts as if it's being over charged by a higher than normal voltage.

 

[djbobo]

Quote by Jeepmullet

"DO NOT USE ODYSSEY BATTERIES... I cant warn you off enough. There's a handful of threads on www.x-h20.com that deal with odyssey warranty claims. That site has been hacked but when it comes back up I'll find the threads"





I read the thread on that PWC forum and now it seams the guy has now posted that he now gives the Odyssey battery a THUMBS UP. (I even want one now!)



His problems were from the dealer (Batteries plus)



He now even has a dealers link in his signature promoting an Odyssey battery (The Battery Store) that he is very happy with.



Way more people were pleased with there Odysseys in that thread than dissatisfied.



Insidently, the batteries that were being discussed were PWC (Personal Water Craft) type - not the 60 lb PC1700 Odyssey being suggested here.

 

[Jeepmullet]

Quote by Jeepmullet

"DO NOT USE ODYSSEY BATTERIES... I cant warn you off enough. There's a handful of threads on www.x-h20.com that deal with odyssey warranty claims. That site has been hacked but when it comes back up I'll find the threads"





I read the thread on that PWC forum and now it seams the guy has now posted that he now gives the Odyssey battery a THUMBS UP. (I even want one now!)



His problems were from the dealer (Batteries plus)



He now even has a dealers link in his signature promoting an Odyssey battery (The Battery Store) that he is very happy with.



Way more people were pleased with there Odysseys in that thread than dissatisfied.



Insidently, the batteries that were being discussed were PWC (Personal Water Craft) type - not the 60 lb PC1700 Odyssey being suggested here.

I think his main issue was how he was treated with the warranty claim. The battery store went above and beyond and warrantied his battery out where the other dealer and odyssey both would not warranty it for him. The lying (apparently) that odyssey did about the specific charger to use for their batteries and the shadiness of their warranty department is what I wanted people to know about. I wouldnt trust them. The guy who bought 6 or 7 o them for all his stuff ''mouthfulloflake'' is a friend of mine, and I watched his high powered charger not able to get the drained odyssey battery above a 76% charge no matter how long he left it on.



http://www.x-h2o.com/showthread.php?t=4420 is the thread I'm talking about. It looks like the battery store took one for odyssey and warrantied out his battery when odyssey wouldnt take the blame for how their dealer wouldnt warranty a battery (even though it was within Odyssey's policy for warranty).

 

[Missouri Mule]

I thought I read in a TDR issue that Optimas were gel batteries?

I'm on my second pair my first ones lasted over 5 years my oem's lasted 3 years ( red top).

 

[BK]

I thought I read in a TDR issue that Optimas were gel batteries?

I'm on my second pair my first ones lasted over 5 years my oem's lasted 3 years ( red top).

The term gel cell gets thrown around alot. I'm guilty of it and I was in the industry.



Basically both a gel cell and a AGM spiral wound battery are close to the same, but some construction difference. . basically they don't have fluid that can leak. And they have suspended electrolyte, not a liquid electrolyte.



Lets see if I remember, it goes something like this. .



Gel cells are batteries that use a thickening agent like fumed silica gel to immobile the electrolyte instead of a liquid electrolyte like the wet batteries.



The spiral wound batteries are AGM , Absorbed Glass Mat. So instead of having an actual gel suspended between the plates as in a Gel Cell, there is a thin Mat with absorbed electrolyte. . hence they are called "absorbed electrolyte" batteries. The thin mat enables a spiral construction, and higher density of layers as apposed to a conventional gel cell.



Minor difference, but a difference non the less.

 

[San Felipe Bob]

Odyssey PC 1700

I believe the Odyssey's are "Dry" cells.



1) They were expensive!

2) I run them in my PWC, Truck and BOAT!

3) It's the only battery that I have used that can take the pounding and vibration experienced while racing PWC in offshore endurance races.

4) Thing's break Even batteries!!!!!

5) They haven't built anything I can't break.

6) One of the best attributes of the Odyessy's is the "Dry" cells.

There is absolutely no sign of any corrosion on top of the batteries!



SFB

http://www.batterystore.com/Odyssey/OdysseyProducts.htm

 

[Thomas]

Odyssey and Optima are BOTH AGM (Absorbed Glass Mat).

From http://www.odysseybatteries.com/files/techbook.pdf comes this: The ODYSSEY battery ingeniously uses absorbed glass mat (AGM) valve regulated lead acid (VRLA) technology to offer ...

and from http://www.1st-optima-batteries.com/ comes this: An absorbent glass mat, alternating with the layers of lead, holds electrolyte in contact with the OPTIMA'S greater lead surface area. This laminated construction provides far more active surface area in the OPTIMA. It also supports a thicker layer of plate paste, for prolonged service life — typically half again to twice the life of conventional batteries. This technology is called "AGM" for "Absorbed Glass Mat" and it is a major advance in battery design.

 

[willyslover]

been running a 2150 Odyssey for over a year , after I went with twins . . wanted the room as I run only 1 battery now. .

so far very happy with it !! bought it from Mr. Bob's dist also [great guy to deal with]



looking forward to longevity , time will tell as moving to Coeur d'alane will put a bit more zero and below winters test to the single battery

 

[MKinner]

here is a link that might clear up a few questions about Gel and AGM batteries.

http://www.windsun.com/Batteries/Battery_FAQ.htm

 

[BK]

The other reason "dry cell" gets thrown around is that ,

one - no liquid to leak

and

two-the mats used in the AGM are basically dry to the touch.

 

[MRiley]

I have a red top in my other car (corvette). I had to switch to it because GM put the computers right under the battery tray and any little acid leak is a major issue (good planning). Most of the other guys I know have also switched for this same reason. That being said, we all seem to have the same problems. The red tops do not seem to hold a charge as well or as long as a regular lead acid. If I leave the car sit for more than a week the car will crank really slow, or not at all. This is a really common complaint that the red tops seem to discharge. They also seem to need to be replaced about every year and jumping really seems to fry them. My personal feeling is this. On the truck I want as much power as I can get CCC. Especially for powering my winch. That is why I'm staying with regular lead acid. The last thing I want is to be out in the boonies and need a jump!

 

[jeepit]

I have a red top in My CJ7 and it can stand a month and crank right over. Seems to hold a charge good for me. Although we are talking to different motors and computers...

 

[Cooker]

Today I heard an ad on the radio for a local auto shop. They were advertising "Optima Gel Cell" batteries

 

[RCook]

I have Optima red tops (they are spiral-wound AGM's, by the way) in my 98. 5. They're about five years old at this point. The last two summers I left the truck sitting with my boat trailer for 3+ months while I was out cruising in BC and SE Alaska. Both years, when I got back to the truck, it turned over briskly and started up as quickly as you could ask for.



I have Optima's for my boat's diesel as well, and several friends also use them in cars and boats. Not one has a problem.



I also use group-31 AGM's made by East Penn - Deka for the deep cycle house bank in my boat. They're five years old and seem just like new, with zero maintainance.



AGM's have several advantages over the older technology deep-cycle Gel batteries. One nice one is that their charging voltages are much closer to the same as ordinary flooded lead-acid batteries, so they work well in the truck without a special alternator/regulator. Optima red tops, which are starting batteries, not deep-cycle, are particularly convenient in this regard. The older deep-cycle Gel types require specialized regulator settings to avoid getting ruined by too high charging voltages.

 

[BK]

That's not entirely true. Gell cells have two recommend float voltages. .

one for standby use and one for cycle discharge use, such has a starting battery.



13. 6 for standy by and 14. 1 for cycle.

Your vehicle should be producing between 13. 2 - 14. 5 depending on temperature.

Which if you look at a chart of temp vs terminal float voltage for a gel cell, it's that voltage range vs temp your regulator does, is within the window recommended for the gel cell to optimize capacity vs temp.



True that a true gell cell vs an AGM doesn't deal with peak currents as well, and the gell cell doesn't have the density. But I haven't seen, and I could be missing a brand locally, a battery that isn't a AGM recommended for a vehicle. And I assum for that reason.