GOTTA LOVE IT - the logic of big-buck unions and workers!

[Gary - K7GLD]

Latest headlines related to Chrysler:



Chrysler to Cut Up to 12,000 Jobs: Financial News - Yahoo! Finance



Very "intelligent" of the unions and workers to weep and wail as to how they "Can't survive" on their $70 an hour jobs, and must have a new contract for even HIGHER pay...



Well, they GOT their raise - for a week or so... :-laf



I wonder how the above 12,000 workers will like the pay they get from unemployment or minimum wage flipping burgers at Mickey-Dee's...



Wonder how they would vote on that new contract TODAY...

 

[dpuckett]

Historically, unions had their place. I am thankful for the guys in the past who sacrificed their lives and more to fight for better working conditions and pay. Were it not for the unions of days gone by, we'd still be working 16-20hr days for peanuts, with little to no opportunity for improvement, unless you go into your own business, which is another topic altogether.



BUT, the modern union does nothing more than add significant cost to the end product. I for one REFUSE to work any union job. I dont believe in letting a third party negotiate my pay and benefits- it's one more freedom that is given up. Sure I can make more money, but I am no longer free to go to work when and how I choose- I am beholden to the union. If the union strikes because of a pay/ benefit dispute, *I* look bad for joining them. I dont want to walk a picket line, I want to WORK- my boss pays me to work, not stay home. If I dont like a policy, I go to the person who can change it and talk man to man about it. If they dont change, I find another job. Simple, really.



That, and no union person I have ever met had a prayer of keeping up with me on a job that I knew well.



Daniel

 

[nickleinonen]

That, and no union person I have ever met had a prayer of keeping up with me on a job that I knew well.

i might. .

i personally don't care for unions.

but...

i work in a unionized company.

i am VP of my lodge.

i want change...

. . but that isn't going to happen.

all the doggers out number me, and i try and work my butt off getting my jobs done as quick/well as i can, and i get given grief for doing so, "i am setting a bad example". bs to that. . if the union at my work was gone, i can think of probably 10 guys who would be canned right away, and i know i could get a solid $10/hour more pay for being someone who can get the job done.

the unions did have their place back in the day, and in some places they still have a place. what really soured me to them was the auto workers unions. assembly line work is not something you should be making $100k. but i know plant workers from gm who make that. i work my butt off doing overtime [which the union has basically cut to none now ] just to make about 70% of what the plant guys make.

i know the next time we strike, i won't picket [and if i loose my position in the union, won't be a big loss for me]. last time we went out, we went back for the exact same contract we rejected minus 1 months pay. .

my union also doesn't like long term contracts. they want 3 years. this time we did get 4. i want to see 5 year contracts.

 

[ToolManTimTaylor]

I am still getting used to holding a Union job. Local 1150 has been the union for utc/sikorsky for something like 45 years. Now I need a crash course as to what to need the Union for . . what is should do for me etc.



The difference between union/non union @ Sikorsky is that in the union (Which is like $4. 00 more a month to be in it) you have a "Voice" when needed. Being they take out dues anyhow for $4. 00 less a month you do not have a voice if non union ... you can guess what the percentage of union/non workers is :-laf

 

[GIT-R-DONE]

Although I am no where near $ 70 an hour, the union has its place in the workforce. I am fortunate to have one that makes my life better by better negotiated wages and benefits, all of which would not be there if it were non-union. I too would be working for peanuts if not for the union.



Dont get me wrong, as much as they are good, they also have their flaws, but in the end, its better to have a union than not..... JMO

 

[Champane Flight]

We had a Union...

We had a Union, we had a scheduled work week, where you could plan being with the family, a day off, ect. . Now we are bounced in and out at all hours of the day or night, on call 24/7-365, and if you suggest going back Union? Well, lets say you are a black sheep, and a liability to the workforce... Even if you are the best hand there. . Promotions are whoever can stay under the bosses desk the longest... . :-laf



In short, Unions have a few drawbacks (Dues, red tape, strikes, ect), but if you have a Union, be part of that Union. It is only as strong as its members. YOU are the key, if you feel you have no say, YOU are not taking part, it is NOT the Unions fault... Like they are supposed to guess what you want...

 

[The patriot]

I'm not a big union guy, but I've been on jobs I wish there was a union.

Last union I worked for was raided by the FBI a few months ago.

 

[DJW]

Wonder what wages and working conditions would be like in the USA today had there never been Labor Unions, seems some think perhaps they would be better because of the historic benevolence of employers. One can be complacent while enjoying the fruits of someone elses struggles.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Wonder what wages and working conditions would be like in the USA today had there never been Labor Unions, seems some think perhaps they would be better because of the historic benevolence of employers. One can be complacent while enjoying the fruits of someone elses struggles.

Not many of us think Unions have been worthless - only that their leadership in the larger unions has been both corrupt and brainless - such as the example this thread starts out with - did the Union REALLY help those 12,000 members who are now jobless because of that "better" contract?

 

[daytripper63]

Wonder what wages and working conditions would be like in the USA today had there never been Labor Unions, seems some think perhaps they would be better because of the historic benevolence of employers. One can be complacent while enjoying the fruits of someone elses struggles.

So far here I have not read where anyone said Unions of the past were a bad thing, its the Union today that causes complacency and very little good and can not compete in a global economy.

I dont think anyone wants to work in a job that they give an honest days work and your fellow complacent union employee has seniority over you and always will while you seem to do all the work.

I believe in an honest days labor and if I perform better than my peer or vice versa the better person can excel instead of being told they need to slow down cause they are making the others look bad.



I think we all benefit from the Unions past efforts, but I also think we now suffer from current Unions working.

 

[rbattelle]

Personally I think the government should investigate the UAW as domestic terrorists, ever since I heard the local UAW leader here in Dayton say this on the news:

"If this plant closes, what do you think will happen to the crime rate?"

He was referring to the local Delphi parts plant (~5400 employees).

Then there was this guy, quoted by Automotive News:

[Raymond] Knuckles (a UAW pipe fitter) says he is a peaceful man who believes in God and country. "But I would sacrifice my life for a cause," Knuckles said.

Sounds to me like the threat of violence if UAW demands aren't met.

Ryan