2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission Help In deterininng Value of truck.....

[AndrewKing]

HI All,

I went to look at a truck today and was hoping to get some advice on what to offer for the truck:

The truck is a 1997 extended cab 4 WD dually (P Pump 12 V). 5 SP Trans. The interior and exterior look to be in excellent condition. about 155K miles. Truck is loaded (PW PL CC etc... Nice Sony Radio. Has all factory gauges incl a factory tach.

Seemed to drive fine. Tires wearing evenlt with plenty of tread left.

Has chrome brush guard up front, Diamond plate tool box, and bed rails. Has Reese type receiver hitch.

Concerns (no biggies but may require attention) : exhaust exits under bed , no muffler, owner said PS leaked but seems to have stopped, supposedly the door on the drivers side was replaced because of an accident but I saw no evidence of it except the engine oil pan had a dent in on the front side,
drivers side drum brake has oily residue but no leak (possible seal leak or wheel cyl leak), rear end looks to have a little seepage around where the drive shaft goes into the diff...

Other than that the undercarriage is clean,,,,


OH One thing that did concern me a bit was the fact that the tach was showing about 2000 RPM at about 55 MPH... . seems like it may be geared a little on the low side (where would I look to find the diff gear ratio?)... . seems like my other truck (1993 with auto and OD) with a tach revs far less at speed... . I may look into that again tomorrow... .

So any ideas on value?... . I won't post the asking price so as not to bias anything.

Thanks for our input!

Andrew

 

[GAmes]

Can't help you with value. Gear ratio is on a sticker under the hood next to the latch. My 3. 55 goes nearly 65 at 2000 rpm in 5th. The only other gear ratio in 97 was 4. 10.

 

[EricBu12]

Kelly BB as per your info shows $8200 for "Good Condition"

Kelley Blue Book - Select Condition - Dodge, Ram 2500 Pickup - Official Kelley Blue Book Site

 

[GAmes]

4WD duelly would be a 3500



1997 Dodge Ram 3500 Pickup - Suggested Retail Value - Official Kelley Blue Book Site



BTW, here's their value on my high mileage 2WD. I wouldn't sell it for this little.



1997 Dodge Ram 3500 Pickup - Suggested Retail Value - Official Kelley Blue Book Site

 

[AndrewKing]

HI

Thanks for the input guys..... I think the truck was pushing 2000 rpm around 50-55 So I think it may have the 4. 11... . I'll ask the owner to check tho... .

One thing that I did learn this morning when I asked them IF I bought the truck did they have clean title (no liens etc... ) It was brought up that the truck had a salvage / rebuilt title...

The truck looks and runs nice and the only think I noticed was the dented engine oil pan underneath (not badly dented but dented nonetheless)... the owners did mention that for insurance purposes the truck was "totaled" but it was rebuilt and repaired none the less... .

What do you think about that? I mean the titling issue?... Ironically, even if the truck was rebuilt perfectly (which it looks to have been because I would not have known anything was wrong other than the dented oil pan and them mentioning the door was replaced hence the key did not lock the door) I would feel better about the truck if the title did NOT say salvage / rebuilt because I worry that years down the line it may be hard for me to sell later if I decided to sell it eventually...

$ 8200 is an interesting number since they are in asking $8500 but indicated they may be negotiable given the economy and possibly becauise of the salvage title stigma (they didn't say the last part but I think they realize it is a stigma)... .

I may offer a low ball cash offer and see what they say... . There have been quite a few trucks similar to this one on eBay (altho 2 WD and with somewhat more miles) that have sold for about $6000... so I may try $6500 to account for the 4WD and fewer miles BUT the stigma of a salvage title... They'll probably counter and I may end up splitting the difference to hopefully under $7500... . Does that sound like a reasonable plan?
(I hope they aren't reading this HA)

Andrew

 

[RHestand]

IMO, a salvage title is a huge stigma, especially when you try to sell it in the future.

People are very skeptical about vehicles with salvage titles.

I don't think it was a coincidence that they didn't mention it up front. If they don't know that this title is a problem (?), they will soon find out. ( My son went through this, selling his car. )

IMO, I would not offer any more than I would offer for a good parts truck, which would be about half or less than what they are asking.

I would say hold out for a lot less money. You've got time. They are not going to sell that truck anytime soon for that amount of money.

Ray

 

[GAmes]

For a vehicle to be totalled it takes a lot more damage than a dented oil pan and damaged door. Something else is being hidden. I wouldn't offer more than $4000 and would go for less to start.

 

[AndrewKing]

HI Guys,

Thanks for all the help thus far...

The owner called me earlier tonight because I had asked him what the rear end ratio was on the truck he didn't know BUT he could tell me the RPM's at various speeds... .

At 55 MPH 1750 RPM
AT 60 MPH 2000 RPM
AT 65 MPH 2250 RPM

My other truck does not rev this high so I am assuming he has the 4. 10 rear end?

I am really tempted to get the truck BUT I think I would prefer the 3. 55s BUT since I will sometimes haul heavy loads... . mostly locally (well probably not heavy according to most peoples definitions here but maybe about 14000 lbs at most (got a small roll off trailer to haul junk... ) 4. 10 may be OK... . easier on the clutch for lots of stop and go maybe... .

I have been debating about the salvage title too... . If I can talk him down enough and since I plan on keeping the truck so long that even with a salvage title it may make little or no difference... . maybe... .

Andrew

 

[RHestand]

Flood damage can be hard to spot, and can create relentless, long term problems.

Be cautious.

Ray

 

[Davcruz]

My opinion is that they are wanting full retail value for a truck being privately sold and it has a salvage title. I have never rebuilt a salvaged car or truck, but I have rebuilt salvaged motorcycles and I can tell you that my experience with a motorcycle being sold with a salvage title is that they go for about 1/2 of what a similar bike without a salvage title will go for, do not pay that high price, it is not worth it.

 

[MBarnea]

For that kind of dough you should be able to find one without the salvage title. I'm thinking 5k would be the absolute max.

 

[24Vpirate]

another thing to think about is, check to see if you can get full coverage insurance on it due to salvage. my wifes jeep was salvaged and i can not get full coverage on it due to salvage. fyi im in cali. so dont know how it applies in other states.

 

[DennyDay]

AndrewKing - - - You don't say where the trucks is registered or where you are, but there are many flood damaged trucks out there that I would only purchace as salvage - - some where around $4k tops, the door replace and dent in the pan don't tell the story. If you want to be sure pull the door panels and give a good look under the dash. On a '97 the instrument panel is real easy to remove and look for evidence of hidden water marks. It might be worth a CarFax report - - a member was offering a car fax check last week somewhere on this site.



Be extremely careful friend!



Denny

 

[DennyDay]

AndrewKing - - Look in the second gen site - - JSpurlock has a '98 12v for sale for $12k with 140k miles - - sound like a lot better truck than the salvage truck you are looking at

 

[RHestand]

Andrew,

I bought a pkg. of 10 Carfax ? last Oct. I still have several I have not used. I don't Know exactly how you could use them, but if you do, you are wellcome to them.

If yes PM me.

Ray

 

[Flying_gage]

Andrew,



Yep, sure sounds like 4:10 gears. That is exactly where my truck is at RPM/MPH wise. The only thing I can about this is that a "nice truck" is getting harder to find and I had to settle for these.



It does make a huge difference where you are located. Here in Illinois should you title a vehicle greater than ten years old, it seems the title is "washed" and the vehicle then has a clear title. I would be a titch leary that they failed to mention this up front. To me that kind of speaks to the kind of person they are and in my simple calculation that reflects on their maintenance of the vehicle. I know it may seem silly, but I am assessing the person as much as I am assessing the truck. That make sense?



The previous post about insurance is a good one. My commuter car was just totaled in an accident. I looked at another car with a "salvage" title, and my insurance, State Farm, said they would only insure the vehicle for liability and not comprehensive due to the salvage status.



I purchased my truck 8 mos. ago for $7k. It is a good truck but needed tires and the usual front suspension work. I estimated whatever truck I was looking at would need $2000 in repair work just to be realistic. So far I have spent about $1400 of my estimated repair budget.



My experience has taught me with these trucks not pull the trigger unless you are %100 certain that it is a good foundation. They get expensive fast! Shelling out tons of cash kind of ruins the joy of these trucks. I would buy a $10,000 truck with a ton of receipts and a good owner before I bought a $6000 truck without receipts and questionable owner.



Lastly if it isn't time critical on purchasing a truck, do what I did. I use google, but I am sure any browser would work. Type in: "Craigslist + dodge cummins", (You can also do variations such as craigslist+cummins+12v or craigslist+4wd+cummins). You will get a bunch of ads but this is how I have found a bunch of vehicles... .



Just my . 02

 

[AndrewKing]

Hi Guys,



Thanks for all the advice... . I am going to look at the truck again tomorrow... this time much more thoroughly... .



I'll take a mechanic friend along with me also.



RHestand thanks for the car Fax offer... . I PM'd you.



Thanks to all again for all the help and advice.



Andrew

 

[KHelfrich]

i have had salvage titled vehicles and i have rebuilt cars that truck if it was still damaged like wrecked hard with a good engine and transmission would pull 3500 to 4000 at an insurance auction i think 6000 0r 6500 would be a great deal if you cant even see the damage even if it was a flood damage vehicle that wouldn't bother me the 12v is mechanical there are not a ton of electronics on the truck and as far as the body goes most of the 2nd gen trucks flooded there own interiors with either the 3rd brake light leaking or the ac dumping water back in the cab. car fax does not show much and salvage titles don't mean much to any one that knows cars. cars only get a salvage title and only show on car fax if the insurance totals out the car cars are wrecked and repaired all the time no one ever knows it if they weren't told about it if a new car is wrecked it can have alot more damage then an old car cause insurance totals cars when the repair cost exceeds a certain percent of the book value the truck books for 8k the door list from dodge for something like $1500-$2000 and to change the oil pan the motor needs lifted up a few inches so the oil pan clears the frame cross member repairs can add up quick. labor is expensive and so is paint

 

[surfbeetle]

Also, you can do a search on all of the Craig's lists at once by going to crazedlist.org : search craigslist like a madman

 

[AndrewKing]

HI Guys,



Thanks for all the help and advice... .



Just to let you know how it turned out..... I ended up ordering a CarFax and they basically confirmed the accident about 45000 miles ago... .



The owner and I took the truck to my mechanic and he looked over the truck with a fine tooth comb (he even found stuff I didn't..... Hmmm as I was feelin good about all the stuff I "found" but he found more... . That was good tho! ...



Anyways, the owner and I negotiated the repairs (mainly engine oil leak around pan/front engine oil seal, leaking PS pump, pinion seal in rear diff, rear axle seal, rigged strap on fuel tank, 1 rear cab mount missing bolt).



I ended up paying a total of $7000 but the owner also threw in a Truck cap (will use it on my other truck if it fits a first gen), Tool Box, Drop hitch, Extra push Bar assembly).



Even with the salvage title... . I think I overall did OK... I don' think the title will hurt me in the long run because I plan on keeping it pretty much forever... . Plus it saved mucho time searching for an exact duplicate of this truck (I really wanted a 1997 or 1998 12V extended cab, 4x4 dually, 5 sp, loaded... . heck it was even in my favorite color!)...



Oh just a FYI for those who may be curious , Despite me insuring a number of commercial trucks with Farmers commercial insurance, they would not insure this truck under commercial lines because of the salvage title... . My insurance agent put personal insurance coverage on it until she figures out what to do with it on Tuesday (not a super big deal since mostly it will be for personal use rather than business use anyways... ). .



Here is a pic of the truck... .



Thanks again!



Andrew



PS - I've spent days reading about the second gen trucks now! ;-)