Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) HELP!!! No Start or Crank

[SteveAnsley]

Please help:

Went out this morning and truck in sig just barely turned over and then nothing like the batteries were dead (it's 80 degrees here today BTW)

I've been experiencing a slow initial cranking of the starter when cold, but then it would crank over and start - now nothing.



Notes:

- I've hooked up a battery charger/starter; no help

- The fuel shutoff solenoid does not pull up when the key is in the 'on' position; have to pull it up manually and it will then stay up (no previously problem)

- The Starter relay in the power distribution center clicks slightly when attempting to start. I've swapped the trailer relay and that was no help.

- Volt meter on the main battery cable at the starter shows 11. 9 volts.

- Volt meter on the small wire (black wire that's wrapped with the main red battery cable) never shows any voltage. I've checked this while my wife turns the key to the 'start' position. Both before I discovered the fuel shutoff solenoid not pulling up and after manually pulling the solenoid up.



Please reply with thoughts.

I'm at a loss and not the sharpest tool in the happy meal when it comes to electrical stuff.



Thanks,

Steve

 

[GrantP]

Are you sure the batteries are good? How old are they?

Last time I drained my batteries (short in the trailer I was towing), a battery charger would not get the truck to start even after charging more than 24 hours. The batteries showed 12 volts but still no go. Sounds like your batteries slowly died...

 

[SteveAnsley]

Here's info from CumminsForum - still looking for more thoughts:





Quote:

Quote:

Originally Posted by ykdave View Post

The issue is not in the batteries or charging system...



The kill solenoid will not pull up unless the starter in engaged (its hold coil is energized by turning the key on, thats why it will stay up when you pull it up)



I cant recall if the signal comes from the starter solenoid itself, but thats where i would start looking. the OEM solenoids are pretty well known for giving out, their are even 'aftermarket' contacts available for them. bad connection in the solenoid will cause the starter to drag its azz...

that could very well be the problem, but what about the dragging of the electrical system, and him trying to start it, it went from one day starting fine, to the next day dragging, and wont even fire, sounds like he had an electrical leak somewhere, just my opinion, i could be totally wrong, it may be nothing but the solenoid, and they are very easy to replace... but good luck, and let us know what you find out...

UPDATE: One battery was bad, one good. Went ahead and bought two new matching batteries; still no go.



I'm going to drop the starter next.

If I'm understanding correctly: If the starter solenoid is bad it is correct that the fuel shutoff solenoid will not pull up on it's own? But, it will stay up by hand with the key in the on.



Suggestions for a local fix?

I had installed Larry B contacts about 4 years ago.

Now I need to get up and running ASAP - best to get a solenoid from NAPA? Do I want to replace the solenoid only or also the starter?



***If the solenoid were to be bad; does it make sense that I'm not getting any voltage on the small wire going to the starter? (This is a small black wire that runs along next to the large red battery cable)***



Frustrating - I was going to head down to San Antonio for a co-workers funeral and just had to cancel. Well, at least I'm stuck in my driveway and not on the side of the road.



Thanks to everyone here for all the help... .

SA

 

[Missouri Mule]

Starter solenoid contacts will usually start clicking before starter solenoid contact are totally worn out.

Usually if starter turns over slowly it is because bad connections or low battery(ies).



The start solenoid not working should have nothing to with the fuel shut off solenoid pulling the rod up.

If when turning the key to start position the solenoid does not pull the rod up it is the fuel shut off solenoid relay (located on cowl/firewall, larger of the two relays that hang there). On 98s there should be a fuse in the PDC or fuse box that supplies power to the shut off relay (on earlier years there was a blue fusible link).



The small wire running along side of the big cable going to the starter should go to the starter solenoid. It should have power to it when the key is in the start position.

Check number two fuse in (green 40 amp) PDC if it is blown you will not have power to the female connector for the starter relay. The female conector that supplies power to the starter relay is colsest to the battery use a test light to confirm that it has power. If it has power take a house wire (solid wire) touch the female connector supplying power to relay touch the other end to the female connector oppisite the connector supplying power, the starter should turn over. If it doesn't look for loose connection or broken wire.



Here is a photo of house wire by-passing starter relay https://www.turbodieselregister.com...-members/206509-engine-dosen-t-turn-over.html

 

[Skydiver]

11. 9 volts= dead battery.

Test the voltage 24 hours after the charge. It is best to have batteries disconnected for this 24 hour period. Should be 12. 6 volts

All about batteries. Batteries -- and Other Electric Stuff by phred

 

[hsmith]

Make sure you test them individually. Multiple battery systems like ours are only as strong as the weakest battery.

 

[WilsonF]

The fuel shut off solenoid very rarely go bad, probably the most unneeded item changed on our trucks. They do, how ever need cleaning from time to time. The rubber boot can deteriorate and bind the rod from moving. Putting the key in start should pull the solenoid up, key in run should HOLD the solenoid up. Check the blue wire coming from the batt. it can corrode and keep the solenoid from working. You can take a jumper wire from the batt. straight to the solenoid one contact should lift the rod, I would use a heavy gauge wire for a jumper. If it does lift then move on to the relay.

Floyd

 

[SteveAnsley]

Back to the problem:
I can at least start the truck now by 'hot wiring':
- Key in on position.
- Pull shut-off solenoid up
- Jump post 30 & 87 of the starter relay to energize the starer.

At least I can drive and I assume it is something in the cab...
***Put a tester on the clutch switch plug (truck side of plug, not clutch side) while my wife depressed the pedal. No voltage was evident on either post.
Could these be the problem?
Is there a related fuse I'm missing?
BTW: I do have a plug with the wires soldered together to use in order to bypass the switch part of the clutch shaft switch - I know that's not a problem.

Thanks,
Steve

 

[Erik@LCD]

sounds like maybe battery cables or a bad fuse. The batteries are definitely dead given your voltage readings. No juice at the clutch switch is bad, but its more likely to be a fuse. Also, if that switch was bad, then it would have never cranked at all.

 

[Missouri Mule]

Steve, when the clutch is pushed in the clutch switch and ignition switch turned to start position you should see power to female connector relating to post 86.

Female terminal relating to post 85 on manuals should have ground to it all the time.

 

[icman95]

I would have said the clutch switch myself. I just had a similar problem in my '92 Jeep with an auto transmission and it turned out to be the neutral safety switch. Grounding out the starter relay gets it to start no problem. Since you have a stick, the clutch switch would be your version of that.