Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Holly Blue: Still Messing with it...

[RJWEST]

I know I should go for the High price Solution>>>



But that said, My Holly Blue is cavatating.



I have a Return style regulator installed just before OEm Filter,

It is set to 12 Psi, Holly Blue has High Pressure spring,

Filter is clean ( still white ) Pressure is direct reading at VP44.



The Holly Blue puts out the 12 Psi ( regulator ) is shuddering,

When Engine is not running ( fuel being bypassed by Regulator )

If I start to pinch off the supply to the Holly, it starts to run smooth. .



So Holly Blue is cavatating ???



Question 2: If regulator is moved to a position after the Fuel Filter,

will the extra pressure ( say15 psi and above) cause a problem in the Filter

or with the filter material ????





I think I will re install my original OEM LP at the frame rail, just to see how bad it is. When I removed it ( Engine mount ) it was running at 10psi dropping

to 7 psi min, wonder if frame rail location will increase pressure.



Last question, How can you tell if you have a dirty sock filter in the tank?

Seems the Holly Blue ran fine until I started to use 2 cycle oil as an additive,

? wonder if it is a cleaning agent ?

 

[ERuhl]

You have to pull the fuel module to inspect it, and it's more of a membrane than a sock. Do you have any pre-filter whatsoever between the tank and the pump? Does the pump have a strainer on the inlet? Since you have a three-port regulator already, you're most of the way to a Walbro conversion, you should seriously consider it. Leave the regulator where it is (pre-filter), that way you can see any pressure drop associated with a clogged fuel filter.

 

[RJWEST]

No pre filter except screen in fuel pump ( checked ok )
and filter is still white with 4000 miles on it

Walboro ( or similiar ) Probably where I'm going, just trying to understand everything before I jump.
Maybe the New replacement LP if it ever comes with a
frame mount fittings...

Just ticks me off that some are happy with the Holly Blue and I can't get it to work... Can't believe it died in 2 months...

Thanks. .

 

[ERuhl]

It could still be the screen in the tank, but again you'll need to pull the module to check it.

 

[MeritBadge]

Increase your inlet hose size. Can any inlet screens and go with a suction strainer Glacier Diesel Power - Product Detail or larger preferably. Make sure your inlet hose/fittings/pickup tube aren't leaking where the pump could pull in air.

 

[Misenheimer]

You can check for a plugged screen with a vacuum gauge and a T I made one using a swage lock t and three two inch pieces of tubing. I think that I read a factory speck somewhere about doing this.



Robert

 

[RJWEST]

Mhiemer: TX, Good Idea , will look in service Manuel.
DUH, why didn't I think to look in there,

Merit badge; resisting pulling tank, I would like to get a 1/2 inch
inlet into tank but don't want to loose fuel quanity...

Right now running on the original OEM LP mounted at the tank.
11 psi normal , can pull it down to 6-7 psi,,, BUT The pressure is steady, no psi fluctution, To me This seems good for the IP...
The steady PSI Part.

Was thinking about the Air Dog, Did not understand the 1/2
inch pressure line converstion, did not compute, bigger pressure lines than suction lines, thought it would be reverse.

TX all,

 

[MeritBadge]

Cavitation is the result of either undersized inlet conditions (restrictions) or air entering the system. My problem was the pickup hose in the tank had cracks in it. At full tank the FASS ran great, at ¾ it pulled air. I put in a half inch tube and fittings… problem gone.
Moving the lift pump closer to the tank reduces the pressure drop, in this case vacuum, incredibly. That's why everyone sees such better stock lift pump performance on a relo. kit. Plus its less flow than the holley and the stock inlet conditions can handle that. Half inch pressure lines??? that's irrelevant, well unless your really high horse, the ticker is the inlet conditions.

 

[JAG1]

When I moved my LP back near the tank and installed the Vulcan 1/2'' lines it made a huge difference in my fuel pressure. I installed my fp guage prior to the install so I saw how the oem lines made the fp drop on acceleration. After the Vulcan upgrade fuel pressure never drops like it used to. I also changed out the draw straw so I cut out the cloggy intank screens too, and put on a filter prior to the newly located lp. My reading about diesel fuel systems says to always have a primary 30 micron w/s filter before the lp, and then a 10 micron before the injector pump. It is a must! DC's idea of a primary filter (intank screens) is not right, just a bandaid.

I think my stock fuel pump works so much easier with 1/2'' lines, all the way, no sediment/ water, that it'll last a long time. Double filters helps the vp too. I carry an extra fuel pump just in case.

 

[RJWEST]

Jag1: can you still use 7/8 fuel from tank,

Well I stacked the Holly Blue with The OEM,

11-13 At idle , 10 Minimum so far, Gonna leave it this way for awhile, untill I decide what final solution is,,,
( Still don't like the fluctuation in fuel pressure, )
Did the 1/2 line get rid of the fluctuation???

 

[RJWEST]

Just an Update;

Fuel pressure is still in acceptable range ( for me ) prev Post. .

Some Things that may be of interest.

The Banjo fitting on the Oem Lift pump has a center hole
of 3/16 ",

3/8 fuel lines are not 3/8 at bayonet fitting, center hole is
more like 5/16" ( or less )

OEM LP was filled with Fuel, ?????
Is this normal? or is there a bad seal. ?

Holly Red,Blue,Black, not reccomended for Diesel ( Summit )
Neither is Mallory LP's

On Inspection of Holly Blue and OEm LP:
I took the plate off the Holly Blue, The Vanes are perpendicular to the Hub ( Part that turns ), Also did same with the OEM Pump
The vanes are at an angle, I believe that is how the OEM LP gets suction. ???
Also , The OEM LP had bearing wear, as evidenced by rub marks
on 1 side of the plate, Hub/Vanes cocked to one side. I suspect that is what causes the pressue to drop with age,.


At Present I am just going to run both pumps in series,

Thanks for all the replies...

Note : Found the Vacuum test for LP supply line in the Dodge Manual, Want to do this check to see if I learn anything...

 

[Cummins724]

When I pulled the tank to install the Draw Straw, my metal lines going into the tank were rotted to the point that they broke off trying to take my lines off. I would check the lines at the tank.

 

[gtwitch]

Holley Blue

Read My post in the lift pump voltage today and I did take the OEM pump out of the way as it only restricts the flow from the frame mounted pump. I think that anything that you can put ddown on the frame will be much better than the stock location as an engineer, I learned that you if you try and pump by pulling a liquid up from adn above its level there is always a risk of cavitation, where as if you have some head pressure i. e. fuel above the pump as is the case when the pump is mounted on the frame, the only risk for cavitation is if there is an air leak or restriction on the suction side between the tank pickup and the pump. Sorry about the Fluids 101 review!



gtwitch in Wyoming

 

[John - K5AWO]

I am using a Holley Blue for a transfer pump from barrel to barrel to my truck's tank.

I have noticed that if it is in any position other than the inlet on the bottom and the outlet on the top side, it cavitates.

I played around with it trying to see what was causing it and it is sensitive to orientation. I have clear plastic 1/2 inch lines on inlet/outlet and the inlet line is under ten feet long. No bubbles in the inlet line. Yet it has lots of bubbles in the discharge if I turn it over on its' side.

Just an observation.

 

[gtwitch]

Holley Blue

John, K5AWO as an experiment the next time you transfer fuel from barrel try this lower the Blue below the level of the fuel (outside the barrel) i. e. so that there is a siphon supplying the pump and see if the cavitation goes away. Once again Fluids 101!!



gtwitch in Wyoming -- also K7NOI

 

[John - K5AWO]

Now that you mention that, I did just that the last time. I moved it from the top of the barrel down to the bed of the trailer and also oriented it at the same time with the outlet up.

When on top of the barrel, it was very sensitive to orientation.

Didn't try moving it around when I lowered it to bed level. The bubbles stopped which was what I wanted of course.

Apparently , it does not like to be used as a lift pump.

 

[RJWEST]

That's why Holly states that The pump must be mounted below the bottom of the fuel tank.

And even than , as fuel level drops, so does fuel pressure.

 

[hackengineering]

Just to try to add since i am running a Holly Blue along with the OEM lifter with no issues. I have had this set up for about 15,000 with no complaints.

First in your original post you state you are using a regulator and i am not sure there is a need for that. Your pump with only run about 25psi max. I know these engines will not start if the VP has to much pressure behind so to fix that you just run a relay from the Lifter and have your Power come fron the relay so when the lifter is off the Holly also turns off. I run a consistant 23psi and 18 @wot. The other thing is to for sure run the pump below the bottom of tank.

You might ask why i am running both pumps and for me as an egineer myself i see very little reason not to. These Lifters are open vained and allow aditional pressure with very little harm to them. Plus if the holly goes out you will still have the lifter to get you home.

Just my . 02

 

[RJWEST]

??? REf to Who ???? If me:
Without the regulator ( bypass type ) 28-29 PSI Gage,
or higher, did not let it run there very long... seemed to high to
risk the vp44,
ditto on wiring, relay for Holly controlled by OEM LP
Power. ( also Holly is controlled by a 3 pos sw,
Normal(LP controll), Off, ON ON used for Air purged and test,

Below tank, not a problem with OEM LP feeding the Holly.

 

[hackengineering]

??? REf to Who ???? If me:

Without the regulator ( bypass type ) 28-29 PSI Gage,

or higher, did not let it run there very long... seemed to high to

risk the vp44,

ditto on wiring, relay for Holly controlled by OEM LP

Power. ( also Holly is controlled by a 3 pos sw,

Normal(LP controll), Off, ON ON used for Air purged and test,



Below tank, not a problem with OEM LP feeding the Holly.

I can send you diagrams on how to wire a relay from the LP that allows the pump to shut off when LP shuts down and still deliver a full 12v which is the point of a relay. Also as i stated i am getting 23 psi at the VP not a problem at all, infact you should get around 25 at least if you install a pricey FASS system. Many can run well into the 30's and have no issues. Now as far as your description of a 3 pos sw. i am not following, i have two more of these pumps also installed one on a big block chevy and another in my jeep and i have not seen a 3 pos sw system as you describe.

Can you please confirm we are discussing the same product. Here is a link.





Holley Performance Products 110 GPH "Blue" Electric Fuel Pump With Regulator
12-802-1

I have also not seen actualy documentation from holly stating this should not be used diesel, i have have seen that it is not to be used with methanol and alcohol. In fact if you look at this link for the Bully Dog system it uses the Holly Blue pump.



Bully Dog Fuel Pump at Auto Parts Warehouse

http://www.overnightautoparts.com/fuel^pump+bully^dog+performancep.html



Click on there pictures and you will see the same pump, also you will notice no regulator in this package.

I am not replying to disagree with you i am now confused and want to make sure we are all informed about what is the right process to use.

CH



Also i wanted to add that almost everyone i have heard running this system with a Holly Blue Pump mounts in on the frame rail between the tank and lifter. This reduces the heat and vibrations of the engine that gives issues also it gives space to be below the tank.