How do commercial jets slow down when Landing?

[Jim Fulmer]

Jim, when I was an enlisted guy working B-1 bombers at Dyess 1994-1996, we used to get weekly high-speed passes over the flightline just off the deck-- 200 ft-- to celebrate COB on Friday and another week of sorties.



The practice was discontinued when one jet went Supersonic at the end of the runway and did over $50K in damage to a trailer park just outside the north gate.



You haven't lived until you've stood between TWO B-1 bombers in full afterburner on simultaneous side-by-side engine runs. I had ear plugs AND ear muffs on, and it was STILL deafening. I could barely breathe.



Dyess was also cool because we could be Space Shuttle stopovers when it was piggybacking from Edwards to Canaveral.



Justin

That just rocks but 50k at a trailer park Over pressure is just something else, that part about standing between the B-1's gave me goose bumps... ... . too cool.



BOTW, the space shuttle is cool to watch launch also, got to see at while we were at coco beach for a stop back in the good ole' days when we had fun on the road.



Jim

 

[Jim Fulmer]

Hohn, sorry ole buddy to rain on your parade but part of our trim procedures is to advance the engines from idle to TRT in one to two seconds. The fan on that thing is so big it will not accelerate fast enough to do what you say. Many a time I've advance the throttles as fast as I can and nada. What the "R" engine can't take is a quick retard of the throttles. GE engines can't take stalls at all, If they stall, we have to borescope the entire engine. That sucks outside. These engines are not as fun as the old TF-33. Those you could stall all day long and nothing would happen to them. We used to try and stall them on purpose.

WD

Correct me if I'm wrong but don't the R's have CFM56 2A2's just like our plane, if so our's limited to to 87% N1 with the TR's. Yea boroscoping does blow but it's cool to see... . once. On trim checks I've laid a few fences over before, scary how much wind they make at TRT.



Jim

 

[RT66DOC]

OK y'all - all my comments re: USN vs USAF are meant as good old joshin'.



Truth be told, anytime anything goes overhead regardless of what's painted on the tail, I'm gonna be straining my neck to get a gander at it - props, jets, whatever. This aviation affliction of mine has been going on since around age five.



I retired myself from the left seat a few years ago because time constraints did not allow enough flight hours to stay current/safe with the kind of flying I was doing - ME/IR. So now I am content with just looking, listening, talking about it every chance I get and remembering - and tinkering with the CTD.



I surely enjoy hearing all y'all's "war stories. "

Thanks Gents and God Bless.



BTW, for some interesting av chatter check out PPRuNe http://www.pprune.org/

Mostly Brits but still alot of fun.

 

[JPope]

"... You haven't lived until you've stood between TWO B-1 bombers in full afterburner on simultaneous side-by-side engine runs. I had ear plugs AND ear muffs on, and it was STILL deafening. I could barely breathe... . "



Will date myself here, but a wing of B-36's all reving up to take off from Walker AFB @ Roswell, N. M. would make the ground shake for miles!!!! Could not get that close to them though, as LeMay was kind of stickler for security, especially when they were loaded with stuff Oo. that made a real big noise if activated



At the NSTL in Mississippi when they were testing the Saturn V (launch vehicle for the moon shots) on a fixed test stand it would make quite a rumble also.



We had to go indoors in case it decided to go bang, of course I understood they were more worried about fuel vapors in case of accidents. Guess the stuff was kind of hard on the lungs? forgot how many square miles had no habitation because of noise, fume concerns!



You have to admit the military likes noise :-laf

 

[Hohn]

Thanks for clearing that up!



You're right on the GE's-- the B1s have the same problem. Tell me again why they didn't choose pratts for the B1?



My new favorite engine: The GE90 as installed on the 777-- way cool.



jlh

 

[Jim Fulmer]

Will date myself here, but a wing of B-36's all reving up to take off from Walker AFB @ Roswell, N. M. would make the ground shake for miles!!!!



Wow that goes back in time(Strategic Air Command... . guess who we work for)... ... one cool plane and way ahead of it's time... ... ... once again a real Flight Engineer was on board with his Pilot buddies, just like us. Av Gas in a jet engine though... ... scary!



Jim

 

[AfterBurner]

I don't know about a whole wing, but I've stood on the tarmac in front of a B-29 running up all four P&W's and it was making the pebbles on the tarmac jump up and down

 

[RT66DOC]

A few years ago I "just happened to be" at the end of the runway when the B-17 "Aluminum Overcast" lifted off and flew directly overhead. Sure wasn't breaking the sound barrier but OMG! Made the ground shake. Probably made such a huge impression on me because of all the history associated with that a/c type.

 

[wcaldwell]

Back to the original question... ... . And I can't believe no one else said it.





When the plane is on approach and they need to slow down, they use their 'air brakes'. What else??? :-laf :-laf :-laf



And the 'reverse thrust' - isn't that a fancy term for an exhaust brake??





Wayne

 

[NPloysa]

"Back to the original question... ... . And I can't believe no one else said it.





When the plane is on approach and they need to slow down, they use their 'air brakes'. What else??? :-laf :-laf :-laf



And the 'reverse thrust' - isn't that a fancy term for an exhaust brake??"



On approach they use a lot of stuff, depending on the type of craft. Most commercials use flaps, which change the camber and surface area of the wing, spoilers, leading edge slats. Ground spoilers help slow on rollout, flight spoilers help on approach and descent. Spoilers just "spoil" the air and get rid of lift. The one picture of the F-15 with the "hood" up is a speed brake, which spoils the lift around jet.



Nick

 

[WDaniels]

Jim,

We do not have TR's so any rpm limit in reverse is moot. But I go above 87% N1 lots of times on engine runs. Our limits are more strict on the ground than what the pilots can do.

My first boss here in the Guard was an old engine mechanic on the B-36. MAN ARE YOU OLD! :-laf :-laf

The biggest thrill I got by standing by an airplane was at Mildenhall in England back in the late 70's when they had the SR-71 there. One was taking off late one morning and I got to stand about 100' away when it went in to afterburner to take off. It was so violent that I could feel my insides shake. Weird feeling. But what a rush.

And Jim, you do know why the flight engeineer was required to be an enlisted man don't you? It's cause Air Force regulations state that "an adult must be on the flight deck at all times. "

WD

 

[Jim Fulmer]

And Jim, you do know why the flight engeineer was required to be an enlisted man don't you? It's cause Air Force regulations state that "an adult must be on the flight deck at all times. " LMAO, I like it when the pilots turn around and go... ... Fulmer what is that



Ever wonder why there is a crash axe on the flight deck!



Jim

 

[LandShark]

Since we're talking about big noises that shake you to the core:

A few years back I was working as a contractor on a Spruance class destroyer at the ASW range off of St. Croix. We were about to fire an ASROC (rocket assisted torpedo) and I was listening to the countdown on a handheld radio. I was standing outside on a deck above the bridge with the launcher below me less than 100' away. Even though I was ready for the launch, the incredible noise made me freeze up for about 5 seconds and my hearing wasn't the same for a couple of days. I guess there's a reason that no one is on deck during most destroyer operations!

 

[WDaniels]

Jim,

Where do you work and what do you do?

WD

 

[Jim Fulmer]

Jim,

Where do you work and what do you do?

WD

Based here at Tinker AFB, the Navy (TACAMO) has part of the southern side! We operate 2 squadrons of Modified 707's last ones produced (320 frame) for comminication purposes, I 've been here since Dec 95' and came here from the boat for the Flight Engineer job and have been doing it since and on my 3rd tour now.



Jim