How to deal with a strike

[ob1kobi]

Yes I fully agree, the propaganda does flow from both directions. You just have to listen to them both and only believe what may happen to match, which usually isn't much.





I commend you for taking the time to see what it is that the Union is trying to get for you, alot of them around here have no idea what the issues at hand are, and just jump on the bandwagon.



I just don't understand why Unions can preach safety, safety, safety, then bust somebody's head when they try to cross the line. They hound the company to create a safe working environment, yet in Kalaehina's and most other cases where the is actually a strike called, it is the Union who is making if unsafe, and it's ok? It's a double standard that I am tired of seeing.



On a more personal note to you and I, why is it that they can preach about job security and no layoff's, but then have a public campaign to drive customers to the competition going at the same time? After the new contract is signed, are they going to have another campaign to get customers back? No, so what have they accomplished? What have they done to help ensure there own job security? Where else in our industry can you go, do the same work, and receive the same pay and benefits that we do? In Kalaehina's case, what happens when all of his customers go to other carriers, or enough of them do leave so that his employer doesn't need everybody they currently have employed? He will lose his job, and have to go to one of the same competitors that benefited from what his Union truely accomplished.

 

[Shovelhead]

Sorry if it seems we've hijacked the thread.



Ted,

I'm not trying to negotiate a contract in this forum, but where's the benefit in getting a contract with a pay increase, then have to pay out more for benefits than the raise would give us, and still have some "Bean-Counters" with "ink still hasn't dried on them yet" College degrees decide your job could be done cheaper by some "ferigner" sitting at a desk in India?



Edit to add:

As more of our jobs are sent overseas and more of our work is now subcontracted out, ya gotta stop and think.

"When we're all laid off, or fired,... ... . who are the managers going to supervise"?



How many managers that were there a couple of years ago are gone now?

 

[Ram4Sam]

Call him!

Call Ronald Reagan, he has a sure fire method that worked extremely well when used.



Sam

 

[Champane Flight]

Regan

Regan can't even remember what he did yesterday let alone back then, probably forgot it on purpose. Hope all you anti-union people out there work for minimum wage and have to stay under the bosses desk the rest of your life just to keep your job. Sounds as if you like the view from under there.



Sounds like the company knows this is happening and laughing about the whole thing. They WANT this to happen, when you can split a workforce up, you can kill the Unions.

 

[jwilliams3]

Champagne Flight,



You ever see the commercial where the kid (dressed in tie and shirt) goes "when I grow up, I want to be a yes man" and then goes on "yes sir, yes man, your right"?

That is hillarious, and what is so funny is that its true for so many people out there today, who would never admit to it.





--Justin

 

[Shovelhead]

Another kid,

" I want to claw my way up to middle management and be fired on a whim"... ... ... NOT

 

[ob1kobi]

Champane Flight,



You can try to **** us anti-union people off with your stupid a$$ comments, but it just shows your Union mentality. I know it is hard for you to believe, given your Union brainwashing, but there are some people out there that actually deserve a pay raise or better benefits, because of the hard work that they do. Not cause they pout around and sit on there butt holding a sign in there hand waiting for everything to be handed to them. Am I anti-Union, Hell yeah I am and it is cause of people like you.



Clawing you way up to middle management just to get fired, yep, it's called taking a chance to better yourself. Perhaps you have heard of the concept. It happens in all levels of jobs, not just management. Sometime it works, sometimes it does'nt. When was the last time either of your Unions tried to do something to make you better? Now answer that same question for your company.

 

[Ram4Sam]

Get out the handbook!

Champ, sounds like you have the union handbook memorized!



"Hope all you anti-union people out there work for minimum wage and have to stay under the bosses desk the rest of your life just to keep your job. Sounds as if you like the view from under there. "



Interesting comment from a union guy. Us poor unfortunate non union folks can actually get a raise based on outworking the next guy. Can you? Or are your raises negotiated by some used car salesman type union rep who drives a new Caddy every year. Better hope he likes you guys. Sounds like you are the one who needs to spend more time under the desk if you want a raise, not me.



Sam(with my feet up on top of the desk!)

 

[Champane Flight]

Had kids

Had kids like you guys show up at my job several times. They don't last long, usually whinning by noon the first day and quitting first holidays. Union brainwashing is not here, respect for my fellow American worker is. You guys go right ahead cutting each others throat, when it happens to you, don't come whinning to me...

 

[Shovelhead]

Ted, I've been working at the same company that hired me since 1981.

Even though the name has changed several times, and the management style changes right along with it.



I've always given them a good day's work for a good day's pay.

I've been though several contract negotiations and a few strikes.



I'll agree that the unions protect the "Less than stellar" employees too.

(I ain't happy about it, but then, I only have to face myself in the mirror. )



I've had "supervisors" that were absolutely clueless about what I was doing, and had no business ever being placed in a position of authority over someone else.

(Only time I've had to file a greivance in 22 years of service)

( took about 5 minutes start to finish on 1st step)



But they're also are the reason that we as PRODUCTIVE workers of this company still have the health care plans, pensions, and work environment that we now enjoy.



If there were no unions we could only accept the massive cut-backs in pay & benefits that were offered over the last 22 years of my employment, while upper management manipulated the budgets to provide them the largest bonus checks.



There is really no point in continuing to attempt win one side over to the other's point of view.



Ain't a chance that's gonna happen any more than you could convince me to buy a Chevy.



soapbox now back under desk, and padlocked.

 

[Kalaehina]

Okay guys, I'm back, calmed down a bit since last night, this is a great thread for me personally, I'm getting to hear both sides of a point of view and it is very educational for me, what happened yesterday just hit a personal chord in me and I know better then to do something stupid, my dad didn't raise a fool. All of you have great comments and suggestions and I am trying to be tolerant with my union as best I can, reading this thread has helped my understand and realize a few things that I had seen differently in the past. I was all for the unity and brotherhood of our union and I understand that without them I would still be at a 7 or 8 dollar an hour wage (where I was before they had us join, I was non union for 5 years, and union for 5 years also), and they are there for me as my strength against unfair management practices, but, my whole thing here is because of one decision that even if it was done by a few union leaders I hold it against our president because he is our leader, it's my feelings against him that I am realizing is the annoyance, not the union, unfortunately he represents our union so I have to constantly remind myself of the details and not just go by "what it looks like". Keep the debate going guys if you want, like I said I am getting a positive experience from this and thank you all for your input. I'll update you guys on the situation when I go back to work Tuesday.

 

[Ram4Sam]

Re: Had kids

Originally posted by Champane Flight

Had kids like you guys show up at my job several times. They don't last long, usually whinning by noon the first day and quitting first holidays. Union brainwashing is not here, respect for my fellow American worker is. You guys go right ahead cutting each others throat, when it happens to you, don't come whinning to me...

Page 13 of the the union handbook says" When confronted with some truth you can't deal with, respond with something thats make little sense. "



Champ, you are sort of drifting away here and have lost me!



Sam



P. S. I will bet you a cold adult beverage of your choice that I am probably older than you.

 

[Morphious]

I believe the only time I've worked for minimum wage was when I was attending college full time, and I put in 10 hours a week tutoring Calculus and Engineering Physics for the college. The other two jobs I worked, I made well over minimum. I've made as much as 53. 40 an hour as an independant contractor before the bombing and the economy crash, right now I'm "getting by" at 35 an hour with full benifits. Not bad for a backwards farm boy.



Yes, I've had problems with management in the past, and I've put them in thier place, made fools of them in front of the entire company, then walked out and took a higher paying job. You only get taken advantage of it you let them. Right now, I'm writing software for the department of the navy, by developing software to help them make better purchasing decisions (financial vs. capability analysis), the workplace arrangements aren't ideal in that there are three people in a two person cube, but we all work a flexible schedule, and can work from home when we need to as well. Can you do that with a union job? I don't bow and scrape to noone, I tell them exactly what I think when they make moronic decisions or come up with stupid ideas.



Morph.

 

[ob1kobi]

You say you have "respect for your fellow American worker", I am curious if the respect you claim to have crosses the picket line, or does it stop there?

 

[shoveljunk]

I Work Union!

Union wages help keep non- union wages up. Non-union tend to keep unions under control. Unions needs market shares to be effective. I choose collective bargaining. My cousin chooses non-union. What was the standard of living when gas was . 05 cents per gallon compared to today? President Reagan fired the Air traffic controllers because they had an anti- strike clause. Union contractors and the International Union of Operating Engineers work together to keep our union jobs going. Nothing is ever perfect. Learn your history and make an educated argument, not an emotional one. People will listen. We each have to live with our own decisions.





"Operating Engineers Local #3"