Attention: TDR Forum Junkies Re: Electric versus hydraulic?
Seriously, have you used a winch before? From your electrical story it doesn't sound like it, or you had a really cheap electrical winch.
Let me say this again, both have there own advantages.
You talked about reliability, true, hydraulics are work horses, but only when the engine is on. You can talk about how you can use a hydraulic winch all day long, but not when your engine isn't running. Also, they are usually painfully slow with the stock pump, many people have a dedicated hydraulic pump or a upgraded power steering pump. You think a tow truck uses one with a powersteering pump? You definately can't use that as a comparison.
Can't comment on the winch mount, I built my own.
You say when using an electric winch to pull yourself out it becomes a crisis? Seriously, this is just not the case.
To comment on the snatch block, if you need one when using an electrical winch, you'd probably want one when you are using a hydraulic winch also.
Stop watches? Spare parts? Temparature sensor's? Reving the engine? Get real!!! I carry a spare solonoid, but it's mainly a back up for my starter. A stock ford solonoid will fit in a warn winch fine. I'd think reving your engine would be for the hydraulic winch to speed up the power steering pump!!
One thing I really love about my winch is the speed. If I'm using the winch to assist me in going up a steep hill and I grab traction with the tires, the winch can keep up with me. The last thing I want to worry about when going up a steep hill is running over the winch cable. Same thing applies in the mud.
As far as your 3 points in the end, yes hydraulic winches are more durable, use more in professional applications, and are not found for resale much. All true, as for the resale aspect, they aren't as popular. I'd say for every 50 recreational electric winches there is 1 hydraulic.
So my opinion? If you're going to use your winch every day pulling heavy loads, buy a hydraulic winch. If you're going to be a weekend warrior and use it 15 times a year, get an electric winch.
Anyways, we could argue about this till all of us are blue in the face. If you want more opinions on winches, experiences, and details go search an offroad board such as http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/
Originally posted by JohnMcIntyre
That's an illusion - and I must disagree with you on that point. Let me explain why.....
A WINCH IS RATHER LIKE A FIRE EXTINGUISHER, absolutely useless if it doesn’t work when you really need it and just as useless if it only puts out half the fire. If you are going to the expense and trouble of fitting a winch to your 4x4, it needs to work every single time, whether it is recovering you from a small ditch, or a 200 metre long mud hole.
RELIABILITY may seem a pretty boring attribute, especially when applied to Motorsport, in the same way that “Safety” used to be considered. Well the Milemarker hydraulic winch is reliable and because it provides inexhaustible power, that 200 metre bog hole will be child’s play, instead of a nightmare.
So how do the comparatived costs stack up let's consider some typical, but conservative, ballpark figures... . (based upon European pricing, coverted back into US$)
ELECTRIC WINCH $800 will buy a 4 metric tonne rated cheap winch and a big bag of accessories, but hang on you need a winch mount, so another $200, but still only $1,000.
You can't wait to use it, but then it doesn't quite perform as you expect, because the guy who sold it to you or recommended it has twin Optima batteries powering his and you don't. Oh well, another $200, plus a carrier, wiring, split charge system at another $200. It soon mounts up. Can you take care of the installation yourself or will you have to shell out for that too?
That's much better, but you are now up to $1,400 for what is still a cheap and flawed winch system. Be grateful that your CTD comes equipped with a decent HD alternator - take pity on the Landrover guys out there relying on a wimpy 65amp stock alternator, because in their case the potential spend hasn't stopped yet, when you take allowance for a spare motor and solenoids, ($200) just in case.....
HYDRAULIC Now examine the hydraulic Milemarker solution. $1,000 will buy you a complete system, powered from the vehicle's own hydraulic pump. It's not super fast, but it'll pull you out of almost anything you get stuck in and your friends too, when they get stuck.
The Milemarker hudraulic system can also be enhanced with some upgrades if you really need them when you have the cash. More importantly the full-blown system costs another $250 more and then you'll get 4. 7 metric tonnes of real pulling power. Either way your winch will still be working when a third electric winch has cremated itself... ... and just think you can spend the money and time you have saved on a set of diff-lockers, new tyres, under-body protection, or even a newer vehicle and transfer the winch across.
INSTALLATION A typical Hydraulic winch installation takes a good day for the full blown, 4. 7 tonne dedicated pump system, or slightly longer on non-standard vehicles. I know , coz BTDT. The installer needs a modicum of mechanical knowledge, but no special tools are required.
An electric winch can be installed slightly quicker than this, but if extra batteries are needed and a split-charging system and up-rated alternator are required, then you are looking at a good few days.
READY FOR ACTION When you use your Milemarker hydraulic winch you set up for a straight pull and let the winch get on with it, concentrating only on safety. Keeping yourself and others away from the danger zone, until the winching has been completed, when you pack up and drive away. Pretty simple really.
With an electric winch this slight drama becomes a crisis, especially in the mud where electric winches are not supposed to be used anyway.Anyway, snatch blocks out, a stopwatch to monitor the running time, a temperature sensor and box of spares at the ready. Rev the hell out of the engine to charge the battery and then learn a sign language to communicate over all the din that your vehicle and winch is making. What is all that about?
With a 4. 6hp super-motor It looked so fast in the demo, yet you have been there for half an hour and you are still stuck. And the "drive-assistance" you were taught has you buried even deeper.
Why do you think..... ?
1. Most hydraulic winches are used in professional applications.
2. You very rarely see second hand hydraulic winches for sale.
3. Hydraulic winches are synonomous with reliability and durability
You know which one makes sense... .
Seriously, have you used a winch before? From your electrical story it doesn't sound like it, or you had a really cheap electrical winch.
Let me say this again, both have there own advantages.
You talked about reliability, true, hydraulics are work horses, but only when the engine is on. You can talk about how you can use a hydraulic winch all day long, but not when your engine isn't running. Also, they are usually painfully slow with the stock pump, many people have a dedicated hydraulic pump or a upgraded power steering pump. You think a tow truck uses one with a powersteering pump? You definately can't use that as a comparison.
Can't comment on the winch mount, I built my own.
You say when using an electric winch to pull yourself out it becomes a crisis? Seriously, this is just not the case.
To comment on the snatch block, if you need one when using an electrical winch, you'd probably want one when you are using a hydraulic winch also.
Stop watches? Spare parts? Temparature sensor's? Reving the engine? Get real!!! I carry a spare solonoid, but it's mainly a back up for my starter. A stock ford solonoid will fit in a warn winch fine. I'd think reving your engine would be for the hydraulic winch to speed up the power steering pump!!
One thing I really love about my winch is the speed. If I'm using the winch to assist me in going up a steep hill and I grab traction with the tires, the winch can keep up with me. The last thing I want to worry about when going up a steep hill is running over the winch cable. Same thing applies in the mud.
As far as your 3 points in the end, yes hydraulic winches are more durable, use more in professional applications, and are not found for resale much. All true, as for the resale aspect, they aren't as popular. I'd say for every 50 recreational electric winches there is 1 hydraulic.
So my opinion? If you're going to use your winch every day pulling heavy loads, buy a hydraulic winch. If you're going to be a weekend warrior and use it 15 times a year, get an electric winch.
Anyways, we could argue about this till all of us are blue in the face. If you want more opinions on winches, experiences, and details go search an offroad board such as http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/
