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Idiotic over-reactions have started

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From the last words of a hero....

Movie; Valdez Is Coming

A friend of my wife is flying to Seattle from California for the weekend to visit friends and family. As she passed through the security check point in LAX, her bags were searched. No big deal, until they confiscated her TWEEZERS!!! "These could be used as a weapon" was their response. In the box where they put her tweezers was also an eyelash curler and a pair of small nail clippers.



Give me a BREAK! Tweezers are a potential weapon? "I'm hijacking this plane. If anybody tries to stop me, I'll pluck your eyebrows out!" "I'll curl your eyelashes if you try to stop me. " What's next? :mad:



"Sorry sir, you cannot wear a belt on the plane, you might try to garrotte someone with it. "



"Ma'am, your diamond ring is a potential weapon. Please hand it over. "



"Sorry, you cannot bring your Game Boy on board. You might throw it at somebody. "



"Sorry, keys are not allowed in the cabin of the plane. You might give someone a puncture wound. "



"Ladies and Gentlemen, the food service will begin shortly. Today we are serving a food shake in a plastic bag. We do this so that you do not have access to any weapons, I mean knives or forks. Drinks will be served out of Aseptic juice boxes, but straws will not be provided. A can of Coke might be used as a weapon, so we only have soda in a 2 liter bottle. Also, wine will be served out of a box, we don't want the deadly weapon, also know as a wine bottle, falling into the wrong hands..... "



I can somewhat understand that the Benchmade CQC7 3 1/2" lockblade knife I ALWAYS carry everywhere probably should be restricted, but this IDIOCY needs to stop before it gets too ridiculous. This is the typical response of this country to threats: If a crime is committed with a gun, ban guns. With a knife? Ban knives. Use fertilizer to make a bomb? Ban fertilizer. Every time something happens, we react in such a way as to remove the OBJECT used in the attack, not the criminal committing the act. We punish the criminal, and all citizens at the same time by restricting their access to those items that might someday be used for self defense.



Are we safer on the plane without tweezers? Without eyelash curlers? Without forks? Without butter knives? Without steak knives? Without wine bottles? Without my lockblade pocket knife? Or, are we LESS safe? Time and again it has been shown that those whom assign no value to laws or life will find ways to defeat those policies and procedures. Please don't take away my options to fight back.



Hijackings will still occur, but the rules of engagement have now changed. No longer will passengers sit idly by and take it. Will some of them die? Yes, they will. Will the terrorists succeed? Yes, sometimes. Will they fail? YES, sometimes! But, if we have NOTHING with which to fight back, how do we succeed? When I board a plane from now on, I will add this following routine to my safety check: What is nearby that I can use as a weapon? I hope my only options are not a blanket, pillow and a magazine... ... .....
 
I'm with you. But you better watch out for the PC bleeding heart liberal flames heading your way.



The time for business as usual, playing by the rules is out. These dirtbags need to be eliminated with extreme prejudice - even the ones already behind bars in this country should slip on their soap in the shower.
 
Originally posted by Scollins

... Give me a BREAK! Tweezers are a potential weapon? "I'm hijacking this plane. If anybody tries to stop me, I'll pluck your eyebrows out!" "I'll curl your eyelashes if you try to stop me. " What's next? :mad: ...



My little Swiss Army knife with 1. 25" blade is a dangerous weapon, according to the cop guarding the entrance to the McHenry County (IL) county office building the last time I *had* to go in a couple years ago. I told 'em I was surprised they didn't take my belt, shoes, laces, pants, shirt, skivvies, glasses and the paperwork I was wearing/carrying because they, too, are dangerous weapons.



Such innocuous items are probably considered dangerous weapons in every zero-tolerance school district in the country. And probably in many other places as well.



The way I figure it, if I can't drive there, I don't really need to go. If the traffic is too heavy, I'll drive at night. If it's too heavy even then, I'll stay home.



At least the Roanoke County building here in VA hadn't succumbed to the insanity the last time I was there.



Nothing will change until we who are fed up constitute a large-enough majority to effect a change in policies.



Fest3er
 
Im with you too.
Too Funny, "Im Hyjacking this Plane, Do As I Say or I will Pluck your Eyebrows Out!". LOL!!.
It has Started, as you stated.
One of the Other Banned Items are Canned Aerosol Hair Spray?.
Ridiculous!
 
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Lethal weapons..

Shoot, ANYTHING can be used to be a lethal weapon. Why don't "they" (government) ban sales of frying pans? Whack someone in the head...

Tweezers, in the hands of a ruthless terrorist, as the ones who killed 200+ Innocent People aboard a plane, wouldn't even think twice about poking anybodys eyes out with tweezers, or what about sticking it in one pilots ear, while turning around and punching the other pilot with a fist that has a "large" diamond ring on it.



Actually, I'm with SCOllins on this one. The criminal needs to be kept from getting on a plane.

Just think there is 10,000 Pounds of fuel, it is literally a flying BOMB in a terrorist hands. As we so tragicly saw on September 11th.



Even if Terrorists could board a plane with EVERYTHING Baned from them,, they could still hijack a plane,, especially, if, as rumoured, there were 4 terrorists aboard each tragic flight.

If all they had were there hands and feet, a plane could be easily HiJacked, using some modern hand-to-hand type combat.



Look at police Cars, they have a Divider between the Rear seat, and drivers seat, Did this just happen to come about by chance?? No!



Look at nearly Major Airliner, the Cockpit is completely accesable to anyone who wants to kill, as the terrorists did. What is needed is a Cockpit that is accesable in flight by, only intercom, and or VideoPhones. I also feel that instead of putting "Air Marshalls" on the planes,, Flight Attendants should be trained in top-notch Self-Defense and how to handle hostage type situations.





Just my $. 02



MerrickNJr
 
At least

At least they are looking now. I do admit tweezers are a little out of line. I have never seen anyone plucked to death LOL. However after seeing what happened last week,I can also see why they are jumpy. We are going to lose some of our freedoms,I believe it is going to tick a lot of people off. Lets keep a level head and watch em closely.
 
That is a good one Scott!

However...



my wife has tweezers that are designed/constructed for the specific intent of eyelash grooming (as probably was the case with Scott's wife... they are short for precise manipulation and blunt for ease and safety of use)... I on the other hand, have a pair of surgical tweezers with extremely fine, long points which are made of extremely tough (not hard) surgical stainless steel that would easily rival an ice pick... see where I'm going with this?



BTW, my trick tweezers were purchased for the expressed intent of fly tying enhancement (I also have several pairs of surgical scissors and accoutrements for this hobby as well).



I personally believe that all CCW or CWP holders should be allowed concealed carry on flights (using commercially available fragmenting loads... not hollow points... and for everyone's sake, not fmj ammo). BTW, a National CCW would be a great idea, complete with a weapons competency test prior to the issuance of same. Actually, this has been thought of before, Massad Ayoob of the Lethal Force Institute pioneered this idea. Great man, excellent instructor!



..... as they say, an armed society is a polite society!



..... imagine this... . four terrorists stand up with "box cutters" in hand :rolleyes: ) and state they are going to commandeer the airplane... with about half the remaining passengers drawing their guns while standing and taking aim!!!! God I love it!



..... as they say, don't take a knife to a gun fight!



:D
 
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I read a book a while back, don't remember the name of it, taht showed how everyday items can be used to fight back. A rolled up magazine can be thrust forward to break ribs, A long belt with a heavy belt bucke can knock a person out, a credit card with a "sharpened edge" can be as sharp as a razor, and steel toe shoes can be a painful ordeal.



I don't fly much, but You can bet I will have my 60" belt with a car-door sized buckle, steel toe shoes, issue of TDR mag, and all of my credit cards finely honed on the next flight. There are ways around these IDIOTS that are taking away the common ways to fight back.



Jeff
 
Originally posted by HDH

.

One of the Other Banned Items are Canned Aerosol Hair Spray?.

Ridiculous! [/B]



HDH,

You obviously have never seen a lighter taped to a can of hair spray. They were present at a lot of protests in CA. and I guarantee they are a very dangerous weapon. ;)
 
All the over-reaction stuff going on is going to do nothing to prevent what happened 9-11. All it is accomplishing is to add more expenses for the airlines and travelers, as well as making it harder for passengers to defend themselves.



The simple solution is to arm the flight crews on planes so people armed with knives and box cutters have no chance.



Sky marshalls will accomplish nothing but add expensive trained people that may or may not be on your flight.



The greatest deterent of them all would be to remove the airport ban for concealed carry permit holders and let us permit holders keep our weapons. It would cost the airlines/government nothing to let us protect ourselves.
 
I still haven't seen the most effective and probably the safest detterent mentioned. Since all pressurized aircraft are sealed environments, three things would do the most to stop most attempted hijackings.



1. Add some 250-300 pounds of weight to the aircraft in the form of a posivtive lock/bulletproof pressure sealed cockpit door, and partition from the cabin.



2. Add miniature video cameras to each partitioned passenger compartment with a monitor in the cockpit to view the actions of all wouldbe hi-jackers and passengers, and hidden alert buttons for attendant activation.



3. Have anesthetic gas cannisters installed that can be activated by the crew in the event of an attempted takeover.



The combination of these three things will buy the crew time to don oxygen masks while activating the anethesia supply and thereby sending every single person (good guys and bad guys alike) in the passenger compartment to the land of nod. When all are asleep, one of the crew may then don a portable oxygen unit, enter the passenger compartment, and then disarm/disable the would be assailants and then land safely at the nearest compatible airstrip.



I know this sounds complicated but really it is not being that the aircraft is a sealed environment, and most of the hardware to pump knockout gas is already installed. The video components and door would be more difficult to install comparatively.
 
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Swamp Rat,



My thoughts exactly, I thought these same thoughts about the day after last weeks events. It is really incomprehensible as to why items 1 and 2 have not been standard fare already. Before last week, item 3 might have seemed a little extreme, but now I don't think it is out of question.



Shelby
 
Bullets but no revolver...

A similiar thing happened to my girl-friend last year when she had to go into the County Court Building here in Buffalo, NY...



Knowing she was going to go through a metal detector and x-ray machine at the door, she unloaded and locked her CCW (S&W Centennial) in the trunk of her car, placing the bullets in her purse.



She made it in no problem, took care of business, but on the way OUT, the rocket scientist looking at the x-ray machine exclaims BULLETS!! :rolleyes:



The Law pulls her over to the side and starts interrogating her about her "contraband"... she got aggravated, and sarcastically asked what she could do to hurt anyone with the bullets w/o the revolver... maybe throw them at someone?!!



Wrong answer... they detained her for an hour just to break it off.



Just goes to show you, don't mess with the Gestapo guarding the mindless sheep. :mad:



Greg
 
The FAA and airlines should encourage everyone to carry knives with 4-6 inch blades on board. If you were a hijacker with a gun, would you feel comfortable walking in the close confines of an airplane knowing everyone around you was packing a big knife??? I agree with the security regulations have gone overboard. My brother said at Port Columbus, OH, even safety disposable razors were taken. The prison shank, a toothbrush with a sharpened handle point makes a mean weapon that cannot be detected by metal detectors. A thick sock with a bunch of coins knotted in the toe area is another good weapon that can easily be fashioned on board. There are many ways to make weapons..... prisoners do it all the time.
 
Swamp Rat,



Who says they have to land? Open the door and let the hijackers out of the plane (asleep w/ no chute) over an unpopulated area, and continue with the flight.
 
Ahhh... VeeTenJeff... . You're good. I'll have to remember those suggestions.



How about my dental bridge? It's made of stainless steel and has pointy prongs that wrap around teeth, to hold it in place. I could pop that baby out and slice away.



Maybe they'll start pulling your teeth out when you board the plane. Don't they say the human bite is worse than a dog bite?



My eye glasses have real glass lenses, not the plastic stuff that most spectacles have now-a-days. I'm sure I could fashion a weapon from them. I can't see well enough to find a terrorist, without the glasses, but at least I could lash out at someone. :)



Doc
 
I think the double secure doors are great...



When trouble strikes, let the high jacker in through the 1st secure door, have it lock behind them, 2nd secure door never opens but the walls become electrified... than the bottom drops out of the floor... problem solved.....



I guess we need a way to just make sure that there's safe place for the splat to happen. . so maybe an external cage... to keep the "payload" qued up till there's a safe splat zone.
 
This is making me uneasy as hell. I've always carried a razor sharp little knife EVERYwhere I go, even on planes (2 3/4 locking pocketknife for life's little chores). Now though I'm not James Bond, I always felt a 'little' secure because it would poke a hole in something or someone if I really wanted it to.

Now... ..... no more, nothing. So when those little girls who clean the planes with the vacuum cleaners between flights or the caterer service personnel who are part of the scheme plant a weapon on board, all my fellow passengers and I are going to be armed with plastic cups and combs. Only the bad guys will have weapons. Doesn't sound right to me. :(Joe



I know this is wrong, but if there's way more good guys than bad guys, let's all carry guns and see if the plane gets high jacked or not.

Don't mind me, I'm just frustrated.
 
Originally posted by bighammer

Swamp Rat,



Who says they have to land? Open the door and let the hijackers out of the plane (asleep w/ no chute) over an unpopulated area, and continue with the flight.



Bighammer,

I thought about that too, but a lot these newer aircraft don't have aft-stair well stands that can be dropped while in flight (Remember the infamous D. B. Cooper), and if the body were to be tossed out from the forward fuselage the risk of injesting the carcass into the engine intake or causing aerodynamic wing/stabilizer damage is very high. Thats the last thing one would want detonating an engine or jamming stabilizer or flap control at 30,000 feet. Added to that is the rapid depressuriztion until the plane drops to about 10,000. Its not fun to lose cabin pressure @ high altitude been there done that. Handcuffing the perp(s) while unconscious is probably the safest way to go, then supply the remainder of the passengers w/clubs to beat some sense into him while cruising for a suitable airport. :D



I'm sure others can offer really good ideas on cruel and inhumane reatment. I know I have a book full that I won't disclose here.
 
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