Inverter/Converter change out

[TJJEEPER]

Has anyone done the change from a standard converter to a combo inverter/converter?

I'm in the process of a major upgrade to my rig. My toy hauler came with 2 group 24 batteries. It eat them up rather quickly so I'm going to 2 6 volt golf cart batteries to almost double the capacity. I am also looking at adding solar charging and a small inverter to run the satellite receiver and TV.

The stock set up is a 100 amp converter (could be a 50 amp but I need to get behind the access wall to look at the name plate). This is just the standard 110 volt in and 12 volts out.

I can add the solar charge controller and a small inverter and accomplish what I want BUT there are some pretty nice setups out there that will do it all. Interface with the solar, charge the batteries, and provide the 110 volts when shore or generator is not available.

Anyone been down this path before?
Thanks,
Greg

 

[Bill Stockard]

This is a converter you can use to change to a "smart converter" that won't "boil" you batteries dry depending on your type old converter. The installation instructions are available online for your information.
http://www.progressivedyn.com/pd4600_converter_replacement.html
I've never done the conversion, but know of others who have and they reported that it wasn't that difficult. I have a Progressive Dynamics converter with the Charge Wizard in my camper that is over 10 years old and I leave it plugged in to 120-volts AC all the time. The battery stays charged up and never "boils" it dry is common with the old style converters. I check the electrolyte levels about every 6 weeks and usually have to add a little distilled water about every 6 months. The electrolyte has never been below top of the plates.

Bill

 

[CKelley1]

the pg with charge wizard as bill listed is the only way to go. change every bulb in the trailer to led, they use a tenth as much as the bulb. get a separate true sinewave only, no modified sinewave inverter as a separate item I got a 1,000 watt one. I was looking at a fairly large lcd tv and noticed it had a 120 volt to 12 volt dc external power supply on it, I cut the cord and wired it to my dc source.

 

[TJJEEPER]

The existing charger has the new style charge circuit (absorption, bulk, float). I crawled into the compartment this morning to inspect it. It has the dip switches for the battery type (AGM/flooded/gel), it is a 100 amp, and I checked the battery voltage and it was at 13.04 volts... right were it's supposed to be for a float charge for the flooded cells. Probably the next step would be to unplug the shore power and let the batteries drain a little to see that it goes to the proper 14 volt bulk charge.

The original idea was to go to a single unit for the inverter and future solar. They run $1000 - $1400 and have the 100 Amp charge circuit in them. However since I posted the question this morning I've found I can get a pure sine wave inverter for around $400 and a Solar controller is in the $200 range. It doesn't make sense to replace my existing charger. I'll have to build my own transfer circuit but in a prior lifetime I was an Electrician and worked on plenty of UPS/battery installations. I'm also a bit of a propeller head with Amateur Radio as a hobby. I know my way around electrons.

I've already replaced the bulbs in the frequently used lights with LEDs.

It was a little disgusting seeing the rats nest of wires when I opened up the covers! Just a little more work.

Greg

 

[Shadrach]

I have 2 6 volts Golf Cart batteries ( would love to have 4 ) an 80 and a 125 watt Solar panel with a 1750HD converter. http://gpelectric.com/ When dry camping I plug my shore power cord into the inverter so I can run the whole TT, other than the A/C of course. I have the inverter mounted in the frt storage compartment ( close to the batteries ) and installed a second "shore power cable door" in the wall between the 2 frt compartments. When I want power I pull out the cable from the rear door and insert it thru the frt door where I have an RV plug socket mounted inside which is plugged into the inverter. That way I can't have both power sources being used at once. I turn on the main switch on the inverter and use the remote switch mounted inside to control the power. David

 

[jelag]

I agree with the separate converter and inverter... I use the progressive converter with the wizard... and a full sine wave inverter.. I was refereed to http://www.donrowe.com by an electrical engineer with the heating pad manufacturer my wife bought... we couldn't get the heating mattress pad to function with the inverter I'd purchased and contacted the manufacturer... he referred me to Don saying he had great advice and great pricing....

 

[SnoKing]

I have a Heart Freedom 10 Inverter/charger. It has a 50amp four stage charger and I use on shore power instead of the converter. I installed a 15AMP inlet for our Honda eu1000i and put the converter on a switch to this extra inlet. So I can while dry camping charge the batteries with the Honda/Converter and run the TV/Sat, microwave or hair dryer off the inverter. Honda can shutdown and cool for refueling and TV/Sat stays up! The old Freedom 10 has been in two boats and two 5th wheels.

Inlet
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Inverter
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Control panel and E Meter(amp hr meter - Black round thingy)
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[Kirwin]

I used 2 Interstate 4D batteries I mounted on the tounge of my TT to supply a 2500 watt Freedom 458 modifed sine wave inverter/charger with a Link 1000 controller. This gives me a 340 Amp-Hr battery bank and 3 stage battery charging. I wired in a sub pannel with 4 breakers to supply the TT loads except for the electric water heater and the A/C circuits. The Freedom 458 has a built in transfer switch that shifts the loads to/from shore power when the inverter section is enabled. Just so you know though, the shift is sometimes not fast enough to prevent the Driectv DVR from rebooting when you loose shore power. Most inconvienient when your watching/recording college football! The only thing that I have found that won't work on this set up is our Sunbeam electric blanket. I have had this set up since 2003 and moved it from my old Holiday Rambler to the new one when I traded trailers. The Link 1000 has be discontinued but they show up on Ebay every once and a while. You can use the same control pannel as SNOKING shows in the picture above to contol any Freedom inverter/charger as far as I know. All in all, I think this is the best of both worlds. If I need A/C, I run the QD generator in the back of my pickup and I can charge my batteries at the max rate at the same time. My A/Cs are not heat pumps so I use the propane furnace when its cold. Just spent a couple of nights with temperatures down arond 5 F and the trailer did fine. Had shore power but used the gas furnace as it provides the heat to my enclosed tank area. You would have to use a solar charge controller, but I would think that would be easy to add to a system like mine since you can hook it to the fuse terminals for the inverter charger.

 

[AH64ID]

My TT came with a cheap group 24 which I immediately sold and put 2 Costco group 24's on the tongue for 170ah. They work alright, but they are a small and cheaper battery. Last year I started my upgrade and will finish it this winter before spring camping.

My original problem was the junk WFCO 55A charger would never go into bulk mode, and thus never really give the batteries a good charge when camping. We rarely have hook-ups and are usually miles back into the national forest. I have a pair of EU2000i's, and can recharge quietly but the WFCO would have needed 6-10 hours after 1 cold night of camping to get a decent charge. I did some research and replaced the WFCO with a PD4655 with the built in charge wizard. This made a big difference, the batteries where better charged after 72 hours on shore power while packing and would get to a 90% charge in 2-4 hours depending on the the State of discharge, a vast improvement.

Now my issues is inadequate amp hours when it's in the 20's at night. The cold batteries are barely enough for 1 night, and that's with the thermostat at 50 while sleeping. The reason I have group 24's is because that is all that will fit, in fact they barely fit. So the batteries are getting relocated.

I have a big dead space near my converter, fridge and furnace. Big enough for a pair of 6V's and an inverter. I have ordered a pair of 300ah Lifeline batteries, and a Xantrex 1500w inverter.

I have room to build a sealed and vented battery box, and mount the inverter to the outside. I will have about am 18" run to the converter/distribution panel so I do not expect to get any voltage drop during charge or use. This will also keep the batteries warm, increasing their usable amp hours.

The inverter is rated at 1500w continuous and 3000w peak, so should do anything I need to do while not on shore power. Xantrex also makes an inline transfer relay, that will automatically switch from inverter power to shore power in 30us. The camper has 2 110c circuits that power all the outlets, but not the fridge, microwave, or A/C so I shouldn't have any issues. A single EU2000i is rated at 1800w continuous, and that is always plenty for the little stuff. There are 2 outlets on the inverter, so 2 inline transfer relays will work great. The inverter also comes with a remote on/off switch, which will get mounted on the panel with the volt meter, ammeter, and battery switch.

I think it will give me a lot of usable power and convince. My TT came with a small solar panel, but at 10w it's not good for much but battery tending between trips.

I looked at converter chargers, but for the total overall cost I decided to increase the battery quality instead, as cold nights are my biggest concern.

http://www.xantrex.com/power-products/power-inverters/xpower-inverters-high-power.aspx
http://www.xantrex.com/power-products/default/inline-transfer-relay.aspx
http://www.lifelinebatteries.com/rvflyer.php?id=15
http://www.progressivedyn.com/pd4600_converter_replacement.html

This is where the rest of the switches and monitors will go.

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[TJJEEPER]

SO here's where I am so far...

New panel in the battery compartment.
This was to add better 12 volt distribution
From right to left
150 amp fuse to the 2000 watt inverter
50 amp resettable breaker feeding the house 12 volt panel and the hydraulic pump for the slides and front jacks
30 amp resettable feeding the two fuse blocks (the two resettable breakers replaced the original SMALL breakers (1"x1/2"x3/4" with #10 studs. Totally not up to the task)
Fuse block that serves the circuits that used to be on the old breakers (#14 thru #10 all on the two original breakers, some on the hot side and unfused!)
Ground buss tying all the major ground together.

The panel in the "locker"

The 200 watt inverter on the right and 35 amp solar controller on the left.

The entertainment center transfer switch

And the microwave transfer relay

And the rats nest I was referring to earlier.

And last, the control panels

Still more to do. I am not permanently mounting the solar panels so I need to build frames for them. The Golf Cart AGM batteries will be in next month. I need to reinforce the floor of the compartment. I'll be going form 84 lbs of batteries to 158 lbs.

The current Group 24s from Car Quest don't last very long running the microwave

Greg

 

[SnoKing]

The thing about inverters is they do really well on small loads for extended time or large loads for very short times! They do not however do well at large loads for extended times unless you have a large battery bank like my friends off grid home. Chris

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