Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) It has to be the starter!! Now what? (Pictures)

[MacMc]

My starting problem that began only a few weeks ago was terminal. I eliminated the batteries, charging system, and fuel issues as the culprit.



We pulled the starter this morning. Here's the pics. Nothing special can be seen here, but please feel free to reference them in your reply if I need to do something to this one (specific bolts, etc. )



Do I just buy a new starter, or is there something I can do myself to rebuild/repair this one?



If I should buy one, going prices here are $500+. Is there another source, or is this fair?

 

[wildmanben]

check out larry b's starter rebuild kits. Most likely the contacts are worn.

 

[JFaughn]

I would rebuild the old one and get a nother for a spare .
You should be able to find a rebuild kit or parts [ contacts , bendix , brushs ] unless you have burn segments on the armature , with a small tryangular file , file the black stuff between the contacts , this is if your handy at all - do any of your own work ?
The problum with getting a 2nd one is the core charge , but if you go to Larry Bs web sight you should be able to get the info , the parts , and a new one [ no core charge ] about $300 for every thing [ 1 new & 1 rebuilt ] .
I do not have the site , but you should be able to do a search on this site to find .

 

[DPyles]

Hard to tell anything form the outside. Under the gold end cap with the three bolts holding it to the solenoid there are the starter contacts. They could be burnt. Mine started dragging a while ago and it was one of the brushes worn out. got new brushes from the local alt. repair shop and had to solder them in my self. Kind of a pain but only cost me about $6. 00 to repair it. Clean the commutater ( where the brushes ride and reassemble everything. If it the contacts you should get a set from Larry B's. they are alot larger and last much longer.

Hope this helps out.

 

[MacMc]

Hard to tell anything form the outside. Under the gold end cap with the three bolts holding it to the solenoid there are the starter contacts. They could be burnt.

Okay, this is what I was looking for first: how to inspect/diagnose the damage. I will go remove that cap right now and take another picture.



Dumb question: what is all the GSK4, etc? If I search it, it returns so many that it would take an hour to find out... Thanks!

 

[MacMc]

Am I supposed to take it apart further? To be honest, this is the first starter I've even taken apart this far. Does it look good? I wouldn't know yet.



There are wires that are soldered to some posts, but they look good. The solenoid pushes in easily, also.

 

[Willys]

Can you get a pic witout the shadow of the solenoid plunger(the thing with the spring on it in the pic above)? In most of the (few) cases I've seen, one brush will be badly worn while the other is mostly ok. When I replace them I save the good contact as a spare. I can't tell from the above pic the condition of both contacts. If both are good, then it could be the brushes. If the contacts look really pitted but have a lot of surface left, I'd take them out and file them flat again, and reinstall, making sure that they are put back in so the plunger sits flatly against them. Probably smooth the plunger as well.



If I recall correctly there is a small wire to the start that may overheat and melt/burn out. I think there is a recall or technical service bulletin on it... Sound familiar to anyone?



There is also a relay to the starter IIRC. Shoot, I can't remember anything for sure tonight.



So, how did you eliminate the batteries/fuel system/charging system as culprits?

 

[DavidC]

http://www.fostertruck.com/dodge/



Dave

 

[klaybus]

I bought a reman from Cummins NW for about $280. NO CORE. Then you can buy the brushes, contacts & plunger from Larry for under $100 & have a spare FWIW.



Clay

 

[Ram-Man Cummins]

Larry B's!!

Ive been through starters befor until I went to Larry B's.

You will not be disapointed.



By the way what is it not doing?

Will it turn over?

Does the starter engage the flywheel?



If the starter wont do anything and you know for a fact you are getting voltage at the starter main post and the solenoid then goto Larry B's.

If you buy factory you will get a good starter but pay alot and if you goto your local parts store you will get a crappy starter but it wont cost as much.

So goto larry B's, foster truck.

 

[MacMc]

So, how did you eliminate the batteries/fuel system/charging system as culprits?

Well, I bought brand new Optima Blue Top batteries. It was still getting slower and slower to start. After it finally wouldn't start anymore, I made sure the batteries were charged, and added my other truck into parallel with jumper cables, too. Still wouldn't get enough to turn anymore.



If it was fuel, it would turn over, I would think. When it became terminal is how I eliminated fuel as the problem...



My friend took the starter off for me this morning while I was on a job across town. He said he made sure it was getting power to it so said the problem would have to be inside the starter.

 

[MacMc]

Can you get a pic witout the shadow of the solenoid plunger(the thing with the spring on it in the pic above)? In most of the (few) cases I've seen, one brush will be badly worn while the other is mostly ok. When I replace them I save the good contact as a spare. I can't tell from the above pic the condition of both contacts. ...

I just went out and checked very carefully. Both contacts look very much the same, with just some minor pitting maybe.



I got this picture from the Foster's Truck link. I have nothing like this condition. Should I disassemble the starter further?

 

[MacMc]

... By the way what is it not doing?

Will it turn over?

Does the starter engage the flywheel?



If the starter wont do anything and you know for a fact you are getting voltage at the starter main post and the solenoid then goto Larry B's... .

When the problem first appeared, it just took longer to start, turning over but not catching.



Within two weeks, it got worse and worse. Half-way through that fortnight I realized that if I gave it some fuel while it was trying, it would start right away, even though I could tell it was turning over much more weakly. (At the time I didn't know I was supposed to give it fuel when starting normally - I was still used to driving EFI gassers. )

 

[BigPapa]

I would rebuild the old one and get a nother for a spare .

What's the need for a spare starter? That's like having a spare battery, spare lift pump, or a spare drive shaft. If it fails, then fix it or replace it. They aren't in short supply and unless your traveling through places where there's no one around and no phone service, they're only a phone call away. Am I missing something?



Scott

 

[DPyles]

I can't really tell about the bottom contact but you say they are not that bad, so I will take your word on that. When one brush goes bad The starter will sound as though it were dragging on something. At least that is how mine acted and I too thought it was the batteries so I had them checked and was surprised when they told me they were well within their operating parameters. Checked all my cables and connections and still had the same trouble. last thing to check was the starter so I pulled it and checked the contacts and they were pitted but not disintigrating. Oh by the way you can just slide that plunger out of the solenoid. I took the 2 long bolts out of the starting motor and discovered the spent brush. It sounds like that is probably what you have going on there. When one brush dies all the amp load is trying to go through the other single remaining brush and it ain't long before it smokes it. Pull the 2 long bolts and the end cap off the starting motor and have a looksy at the brushes. It will be dirty and black or at least mine was. Blow it out with light air pressure so as to see them better.

I thought starters were a big mystery and I would have to pay some one an arm and a leg for a rebuilt one. Unless there is a short in the windings or damage to the armature they can be repaired pretty readily.

Good luck if you decide to take it on yourself. It didn't think it was too bad after I got it apart and seen for myself how the thing works.

let us know how it goes,

Dan.

 

[MacMc]

Foster's Truck says the following about their parts: "Super Size Starter contacts have approximately 90% more contact area than stock. Designed to carry twice the voltage load for easier starting and last years longer. "



I think they mean amperage, not voltage, no?

 

[MacMc]

I can't really tell about the bottom contact but you say they are not that bad, so I will take your word on that. When one brush goes bad The starter will sound as though it were dragging on something. ...



Oh by the way you can just slide that plunger out of the solenoid. ...

Ahhh. See there? You have to tell me everything!



I'll take out the plunger and get a better picture, so you can make sure I know what I'm seeing. Thanks!



I don't remember it sounding like it was dragging, though.

 

[Loghead]

I can see that the contacts in the pictured starter are the same as the ones in mine, and starting my truck was really iffy until I replaced the contacts.

Replace those contacts with some from Larry B, and think about getting the (fuel shutoff) solenoid saver diode as well. Money well spent.

 

[Ram-Man Cummins]

Yep sounds like the starter.

Rebuild the one you have or get a new one from Larry B's.

I have nothing to do with Larry B's I am just a satisfied customer from them.

 

[MacMc]

Okay, I'm glad you made me go make sure. Without a shadow, I can clearly see that they are worn differently. But is this still sufficient to cause this thing not to even turn over anymore?



Oh, and when I flipped this thing over, this steel ball fell from somewhere... Was it under the plunger? Do I just drop it back in?