Competition Just say no to Diesels on drugs

[LPreston]

I've heard people use the argument "well, people call tissues "kleenex"... OK, that's because the PRODUCT (tissues) are called "kleenex" by Johnson and Johnson... you don't call them "Johnson and Johnsons", right? I mean, that IS the company that manufactures the delivery system of said product.

Technically Holley owns NOS, so I suppose I should change it to "no Holley". However, technicalities are causing you to miss the point. The point is/was that certain brand names are synonymous as being representative of a product. Kleenex=tissues, FedEx=overnight delivery, Trojan=condoms. It's all part of brilliant marketing. You don't hear a pimpled 16 year old walk in to CVS and ask for a pack of Magnums.



You don't work for NX, do you? Oo.

 

[LPreston]

While we are on the subject, what is wrong with chips?

Our point is that this truck is all motor. You could pretty much bet that if we took 2 identical vehicles and stuck Keatings motor in one and in the other vehicle anyones elses motor (at this moment) with only water added to the mix, Keating would probably be across the line first. There seems to be so few people that have the ability to go fast with only engine build technique. The motors Keating runs contain more "recycled" parts than most people would suspect; it would boggle most peoples minds. Can't wait until we start to add some of the parts he has been working on this winter.

 

[Sled Puller]

The NOS Fast and Furious crowd thinks that EVERYTHING has a chip on it. (And the PSD boys)

Even I have to answer that question.



"Cummings, eh?"



Yea.



"Is it chipped?

Does it have propane?

Do you run NOS?

Alcohol?"



No, its a REAL Diesel. :-laf

 

[LPreston]

The NOS Fast and Furious crowd thinks that EVERYTHING has a chip on it. (And the PSD boys)

Even I have to answer that question.



"Cummings, eh?"



Yea.



"Is it chipped?

Does it have propane?

Do you run NOS?

Alcohol?"



No, its a REAL Diesel. :-laf

Careful Sleddy... . you said NOS.



Interesting side note: the Hazardous Shipping Labels that the trucking industry uses don't say "nitrous"... ...



#ad




COMPRESSED GASES,N. O. S.

UN 1956

L855-1956

 

[Jim Fulmer]

I'll stick with you on the "NO NITROUS" deal but I like my water/meth, now if it ever came to it, all I would have to do is change over to straight water... ... I guess the new goal would be 900 hp on diesel only with no water..... street truck... ... like the kind you drive all the time.



Jim

 

[JasonCzerak]

Some people get it:



Truck Information:



NO nos, NO propane, NO chips, NO washer fluid, NO alcohol.



Engine: Cummins B Series 6 cylinder

Body: 97 Chevy 1500 Extended Cab/Short Bed, Steel Bed & Cab

Chassis: 140" custom tube

Transmission: Lenco with "secret sauce"

Turbos: Keating Machine hybrid

Fuel System: Keating Machine custom

Fuel: #2 Pilot pump diesel & water

Crankcase lubricant: Shell Rotella

Weight: 3550/lbs

While you're at it. NO TURBO's. forced air isn't natural either!

 

[JasonCzerak]

My preference is that for daily driving or trailering, your vehicle should run it's best on diesel only.



For racing there should be classes that are fixed on diesel only and classes that have power adders.



While we are on the subject, what is wrong with chips?

Nothing. It's just these machanical weenies running scared of what is to come with the common rail and infinite tunability, once fuel delievery and ECU problems are fixed.



And with the CP3 mods, and the standalone ECU replacemnet... ... ... Well. yeah :-laf it's obvious isn't it?

 

[Sled Puller]

Nothing. It's just these machanical weenies running scared of what is to come with the common rail and infinite tunability, once fuel delievery and ECU problems are fixed.



And with the CP3 mods, and the standalone ECU replacemnet... ... ... Well. yeah :-laf it's obvious isn't it?

Its obvious the 24 valve 53 block Cummins and the VP-44 were an embarrassment to Dodge, Cummins, and Bosch.



We are still waiting to see this electron maJic that was promised in 1998. 5.

 

[JasonCzerak]

Its obvious the 24 valve 53 block Cummins and the VP-44 were an embarrassment to Dodge, Cummins, and Bosch.



We are still waiting to see this electron maJic that was promised in 1998. 5.

As someone once said on this site before. .



"Diesels currently are in their muscle car era".



This is true with you guys making TONS of power.



'07's = the 70s/80s with emmissions. . Oh And to tell me that all that new electronic stuff worked perfectly back in the 80's.



Well it's not a direct 1-1 relationship but you get my point.



Also, you do know, with gassers, Fuel injection is superior in just about every way then a carb. Yes, carbs make lots of power. But you don't see a carburated top fueller do ya?



The same will eventually apply to HPCR.



It's obviously not easy to do. Look at these voting machines in Florida, Humans can't even get that crap right. Look at your Windows Desktop! I'm in the tech world, over 7 years ago Bill gates said they would fix all these security problems with windows... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... . But I use Linux. So I don't care.



What I'm saying is that Given time HPCR will eventualy take over, like the 24 valvers did with the 12 valves, took over.

 

[COMP461]

Our point is that this truck is all motor. You could pretty much bet that if we took 2 identical vehicles and stuck Keatings motor in one and in the other vehicle anyones elses motor (at this moment) with only water added to the mix, Keating would probably be across the line first. There seems to be so few people that have the ability to go fast with only engine build technique. The motors Keating runs contain more "recycled" parts than most people would suspect; it would boggle most peoples minds. Can't wait until we start to add some of the parts he has been working on this winter.

Maybe, maybe not, but because some one handicaps them selves with weight should not be the others fault

I would say that the current power plants in Ray Mac’s shop are some of the most advanced diesel long blocks in the country, with twins and no nitrous, this motor would make the same power, and my only reason for a single and nitrous was the weight of the second turbo over the front wheels. Another reason is that Mike Wood is a close personal friend. We have just started, we have two more cam changes that John Russin at Buddha Power was adamant that we do, and another cylinder head in the works. This amount of power was done with only 550 cc of fuel, and very little smoke . if you will look at the RPM’s and that this motor did not fall off up high , like others do, and I welcome them to prove me wrong and post a dyno sheet fro their dyno shop IE TFS





Bottom line if you work hard enough , you will get there.

 

[Sled Puller]

What I'm saying is that Given time HPCR will eventualy take over, like the 24 valvers did with the 12 valves, took over.

Well, HURRY UP!!

The 24 valves didn't take over, we were forced to them because of emissions. Of course that turned out to be bs, becasue they burn more fuel than 12 valves.



High tech electronics don't impress me because of their failure rate. If the durability was higher, I would have more respect for them.

 

[JasonCzerak]

Well, HURRY UP!!

The 24 valves didn't take over, we were forced to them because of emissions. Of course that turned out to be bs, becasue they burn more fuel than 12 valves.



High tech electronics don't impress me because of their failure rate. If the durability was higher, I would have more respect for them.

It all depends on who makes "tech electronics". My IT world example. I see crappy intel desktops crash all the time. Haddrives fail, motherboard fail, OS failed, what ever. Typicaly Windows based machines with _CHEAP_ heardware.



We have Sun based servers that, with the exception of a crappy power grid and corp not funding diesel generators (we were bought 2 or 3 years ago). There would be uptimes on servers over 5+ years for the machines that are not public facing and don't "need" software patching. Yes. Solaris is that good for an Operating system. And Yes, the hardware is typicaly that much better (SCSI vs IDE for harddrive, hot swapping vs. non-hotswappable. Better cooling. . Just better. ).



You mentioned the 53 bock and the vp44 as being crapp. they (vp44) was replaced in 03 with something new. only a 3. 5 year run. not very long. it's about 3 years on the CP3 now. Improvemnet in reliability? I would tend to think so. I don't ever see a CP3 post on here unless is related to a failed lift pump.

 

[Amish Elegance]

We have Sun based servers that, with the exception of a crappy power grid and corp not funding diesel generators (we were bought 2 or 3 years ago). There would be uptimes on servers over 5+ years for the machines that are not public facing and don't "need" software patching. Yes. Solaris is that good for an Operating system. And Yes, the hardware is typicaly that much better (SCSI vs IDE for harddrive, hot swapping vs. non-hotswappable. Better cooling. . Just better. ).

Oh, ok. Now I understand. Its all clear to me now. :-laf :-laf



Jk Jason, but probably not the best illustration for someone tub-thumping about mechanical injection. :-laf

 

[JasonCzerak]

Oh, ok. Now I understand. Its all clear to me now. :-laf :-laf



Jk Jason, but probably not the best illustration for someone tub-thumping about mechanical injection. :-laf

Yes. very true BUT. off the top of my head I couldn't come up with any other example to prove my point. Any Geeks on this site will agree that's forsure.

 

[KBennett]

The NOS Fast and Furious crowd thinks that EVERYTHING has a chip on it. (And the PSD boys)

Even I have to answer that question.



"Cummings, eh?"



Yea.



"Is it chipped?

Does it have propane?

Do you run NOS?

Alcohol?"



No, its a REAL Diesel. :-laf

So my stock 305HP "fake" diesel is no better than the best stock 250ishHP 12 valve because it is computer controlled? What are all the big trucks running? Fake diesels?



Chips are no different than fuel plates. They both change duration and timing of DIESEL fuel. Sure there are some ignorant people out there that don't know the difference between mechanical and electronic injection but that doesn't make chips a bad thing.



There have been some bad designs trying to incorporate electronics into diesels but you are now seeing some of the benefits of it and it's the future.



As far as mileage goes you must make an apples to apples comparison including curb weight, horsepower, tires, and drivetrain.

 

[JasonCzerak]

So my stock 305HP "fake" diesel is no better than the best stock 250ishHP 12 valve because it is computer controlled? What are all the big trucks running? Fake diesels?



Chips are no different than fuel plates. They both change duration and timing of DIESEL fuel. Sure there are some ignorant people out there that don't know the difference between mechanical and electronic injection but that doesn't make chips a bad thing.



There have been some bad designs trying to incorporate electronics into diesels but you are now seeing some of the benefits of it and it's the future.



As far as mileage goes you must make an apples to apples comparison including curb weight, horsepower, tires, and drivetrain.

What is the curb weight of the biggest First gen 12 valver?

 

[JoshPeters]

Ok... . You want to talk apples to apples.



I know of a few 12v'ers running around that are curbing over 8,000lbs. They also get over 20mpg.



I have not heard (doesn't mean it hasnt' happened) of a HPCR truck hitting 20 empty yet.



How about one of our MNTDR members, Regular cab, long bed. Has an Aux tank in his bed. Everything full, probably hitting close to 7,500lbs. He has gotten 26mpg.



Sounds like electronics aren't what they are cracked up to be.



Let me know when a HPCR truck gets over 1000hp. We've known for years that the ole P-pumps could do it... . Now it's been proven. And I think that over 1000hp is possible on fuel alone. I think we'll see it within a year.



Man I love my 12v.



Josh

 

[COMP461]

this is the new duel stage NX progressive system , the retail is over a thousand, but the good guy price in most of the mail order cats will be a lot less , and for thouse of you on here that happen to know a dealer , its way less.

 

[JoshPeters]

this is the new duel stage NX progressive system , the retail is over a thousand, but the good guy price in most of the mail order cats will be a lot less , and for thouse of you on here that happen to know a dealer , its way less.

:-laf :-laf :-laf :-laf :-laf



Did you leave the bottle cracked on that thing?



Josh

 

[lmills]

Ok... . You want to talk apples to apples.





I have not heard (doesn't mean it hasnt' happened) of a HPCR truck hitting 20 empty yet.



pretty narrow minded assumption. both my 03 dually and my 05 have obtained 21 mpg runs on the interstate. plenty others have also.





Sounds like electronics aren't what they are cracked up to be.



Let me know when a HPCR truck gets over 1000hp. We've known for years that the ole P-pumps could do it... . Now it's been proven. And I think that over 1000hp is possible on fuel alone. I think we'll see it within a year.



P pumps have been around for how long????? They should be the HP leader. They have nothing to fool, like we have to with the computers.



Best summed up in a previous TDR magazine article, a couple years ago when the p-pumped trucks had been around for almost 7-8 years you all were scracthing at barely making 400-450 HP. The common rail has been around for 3 years and we have already got some in the 700 HP range. Give us time. We won't have any trouble making HP.