Archived KDP Warranty Service

[Missouri Mule]

I'll agree with design flaw Joe and illflem. Because its not that hard(or takes that long) to pick up a measuring device to check the pin's width measurement.

More than likely they changed the metal compounds where the dowel pins fit. But who knows.

I would think heat and vibration would cause it to loosen up.



A car/truck manufacture bought a quality engine from a quality engine company. The car/truck manufacture did not pay warranty money to the quality engine company. They probably felt that a quality engine going into a lighter vehicle than the engine was made for would easily make it past warranty period with a few minor problems here and there, but I doubt they thought they would see a design flaw(or smaller than supposed to be dowel pin) come out of this quality engine company.



Have a nice night!

 

[Sleeper]

Does JB Weld constitute a legitamate fix? See thread in 12V.

 

[Missouri Mule]

Sleeper,

JB weld is pretty good stuff and others have used it but I call it afro engineering. Especially if this what the dealer is going to do to fix it.

Are you close any member that works on the ctd's for a living or hobby even if you have to go into USA a few miles.



Have you seen the damage and do think JB weld is going to take care of it?

Your decision, but if you are planning to keep the truck a long time have it done so you feel good about the fix.

 

[rhoads]

KDP

First let me state M Mule is wrong on international/Ford warranty proplems Ford buy's there compents the same way. They asume all claimes--X miles/X mo's/years--case in point 1978 we(former emplorer) bought 5 class 7 vehicles,out of the box many issues--- I was at a training clinic(battery/starter) And a Ford rep was there and i stated our displeasure with our purchase for a rig to do a specfiec job , His first question was how many do you havein your fleet -replay 5-out or 117 other units---he turned his back and started to walk away--then i told him we were a member of nat'lease and met with the member -ship (independent fleet oweners) 3 times a year -at that time 120 strong,now if you times that by 5 and we give a thumb's down on this model for relibelty what will that do for your sales ?? That got his attention and he gave up a 800 # to get things corrected at no cost,(remember the clock was clicking and miles were climbing). and this was after mo's and we did the needed mod's & repairs in our own shop.

Numbers get results!!!

Would i expect no cost repairs with my miles,NO. But a discount. Knowing this eng with proper care will do 1 millon + easy.

Did cummins know and just keep building--I think not in ther wildest dreams. Was the pin to small?? There spec's +/-

Does vib's cause it to slid out ??

I ran for 5 years for a transport co and not one owner lost a KDP that was from 96-2001 i had 720k and the closest benind me had a 95 with 560k and no one else had the failure , Why?? When other owners in TDR membership here have reported trouble with less miles... ??? Wounder what the Ser #'s of the failures are?? Not included the mod"s just in case!!!

Cummins does knock on your door if there is a proplem in the big truck world, at least--in 93 we bought 28 units and 5 had a eng problem 1 went down and then the second and they were there at the door and replaced the 3 other's - block met spec's but on the lower end and there were 7 built (USA) with the (other blocks from off shore)-potental for trouble All replaced no cost down to driver motel & replacement rental cost.

The only things (in my experance) for a national recall on our rigs are head lamp sw (done)- throttle cable (done)-check valve on vacume pump (done) and" yet" to be addressed is the Pilot shaft -input bearing to flywheel? ... ...

 

[MidwestMotorman]

KDP

Wow... can everyone say "hot thread"?



There is a saying "an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure," but not everyone's rig is going to grenade, and no one can tell by looking at it. One just has to buy or borrow a kit to check it and block it off or tear apart the front of the motor and just jerk that little booger out of there.



Those KDPs can do damage, but some fall out completely missing the gears by some stroke of luck. It is your call. Most people will just wait until the 100k is about up, and unload it for a newer one.



Class action lawsuits will get nowhere. There would be enough lawyers involved to tie this up for years. There will be years of tests and fact finding just to prove who is responsible for the pin falling out. They would just point out the millions of other cummins motors out there that have no apparent problem. Plus they would blame the cummins owners, saying the damage occcured due to off-roading, racing, or any number of other factors. I am afraid it is a lost cause. Besides, the motors from mid-99 and up do not have this problem, so they could say they have "fixed" the "supposed" problem anyway.

 

[Missouri Mule]

tdramrmbr, nathanbush ,

Cummins engines with problems are 94 tru 98 12 valves.

(As far as serial numbers it is a longl list, starts at 94 and goes to 98)



Cummins engines with 24 valves had a design change for dowel pin. It won't come out.



The 12 valves in the 89 to 93 as far as we know haven't had any problems. Why ? Don't know. But some one does.



I'm not for class action law suit.



tdramrmbr, I believe I stated if International realized that the power stroke had a design flaw(or something messed up on production line) they would take the responsiblity and fix it.

(The cackle on the powerstrokes in 99 and ? was caused by ford's fuel injection system not International's).



Yes ford buys without warranty but they know the engine is known for reliability(proven track record).



Responsibilty lies somewhere with Cummins,Dodge or supplier of dowel pins or all three.



If Dodge/Cummins owners can put a tab over the dowel pin after engine is in truck than Cummins could of put tab over dowel pin on production line. They had to know about it, maybe not in 94 or 95 but there after.



nathanbush ,Four wheeling shouldn't shake dowel pins out they are pressed in.

Oh yeah mine was pounded back in this week. It was 1/8 to 1/4 inch out at 130,000 with STOCK HORSE POWER. No Four wheeling, no mud races, no sled pulling.



My time, my money to take care of design flaw (or smaller than supposed to be dowel pin) on a engine that should easliy see 500,000 before any problems arise (not a dowel pin falling out).



I take care of my engine, it is serviced regularly.



I run my truck hard no question but is treated better than most I've seen.

BUT I ran my ford vans hard too. Gas engines both made over 200,000 before problems started. One is still be driven today (not by me, with same engine as far as I know ) has to have 300,000 on it by now.





I took the RESPONSIBILITY and fixed the problem, after all I worked hard to buy the Missouri Mule.



As a ending statement my KDP is a tamed dp now! Oo.



( capitalization of words is to EMPHASIZE, not shouting at anyone)

(this statement should at top of post,sorry)

 

[MidwestMotorman]

more worries...

Missouri Mule---There were early 99s made which suffered KDP failures. One of the TDR members from the midwest has a pile of broken timing covers from KDPs and some of them were from 99s.



I think the odds of having a KDP failure occur as often as we end up with the block cracking. Yes, that's right, there is a certain casting of cummins blocks out there that can be prone to cracking the side of the outer block. Kinda rare, but it happens. Just one more thing to fear, besides the power steering pump going bad, the brake calipers dragging, the rear drums not adjusting, the autos melting down, clutches slipping, and many other plagues to our beloved Rams

 

[Missouri Mule]

nathanbush ,

I must of missed the 99 post for kdp.

Haven't heard about the blocks. Once again responsiblity issue.



It really depends where the block is cracking. Which Plant/foundry they are from. If they have the same metal compostion as the ones that are not cracking ... . Molds set up correctly... . They can back track and have their engineers find the problem/solution and take care of the problem. Unless the conclusion to the problem leads them to mistreatment as in added hp/torque that is making something in/attached to the block twist.



As far as the other failures mentioned wear and tear items ( as in movalbe parts some that take quite a beating). I'm surprised my stock clutch is still around. Dodge fixed my brakes at 30,000 just replaced my front ones a couple of months ago plus a few other things (u-joint to hub plus two other component in that area, seal to vacuum pump), once again moving parts I expect this, it would be nice if they lasted as long as the engine but they are not going too.



I recently heard that 0ff- road equipment with 5. 9's in them tear up there timing covers a lot, it's not because of kdp but some type of bracket on or close by the timing gear case.

 

[MidwestMotorman]

the blocks

Missouri-Mule



From what I can gather, the 53 and 54 casting blocks in some Rams could crack. The motorhomes and buses were more likely to crack. Looks like they crack or pinhole about three inches up from the oil pan on the passenger side starting about 6 inches ahead of the transmission. Looks like it was Brazilian made blocks at fault, which were half as thick as the Mexican made blocks. It appears that the 98 and 99 24V engines are ones currently showing problems.



There is plenty of info if one searches under "crack* block"

 

[Missouri Mule]

Sorry I don't get to the 24 side to much.

Found a few threads on both subjects apparently they fixed the timing gear case on the 24 valves but not right away.



Which means I know what I will be doing Thanksgiving when I take a few days off.

Going in for preventive fix on my Freightliner.



Cracked blocks seems to be rare as of now and nothing to fix to prevent it if you have block 53 or early 54.



So on the block, what ever will be, will be.

 

[rhoads]

KDP/CRACKS

Have to check miles some day as i havent looked at total miles just reset trip at fuel stops and gone to week/month/fuel-up on oil change--and am a owner of a 444 ih and have in a earler life had to deal with IH/nvstar warantty and as in the past response was the same NO!!!!... Now why would i expect anything differernt owning one vs managing a fleet of min at the low years 30 too high end 60 with a total fleet of 120 power units. . !

The belt idler bearing didn't last on year or 32k before it burnt of the belt-----yet---the cummins fan suport didnt lock up and burn off the belt till 580 K

Change a oil pressure swith on an Ford/Nvstr/powerstroke will cost you min 3 Hr labor charge not induding parts

Big rig drivers needing a can of starting fluid know to find a ford owner (glow plug ) failuer/cost incured---and if youe dont replace all 8 + the controller your going to be back -vs cummins grid heater---



the eletronics/fuel systen of the power stroke/ford/nvstr was contracted to cat... Ford's only control is from the ing sw to the the fire wire.

You need a recon eng for a ford go to Nvatar and you will save major bucks$$$$. .

 

[ablakemore]

KDP Failure

The best thing you can do right now is get on the list for the KDP Jig kit and repair it yourself. Why take a chance with it. I just finished with the repair yesterday, and thanks to the people that have put the repair kit together it was easy. Just took me a couple of hrs. and I'm no mechanic.

Protect your investment. /Oo.



Get on the list NOW!!!



Allen