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2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission Larger Muffler vs No muffler

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I have been reading a lot of posting about getting some type of Muffler eliminator kit from Geno, although I have not been able to locate it. How much loader is it? Will it have the same effect as a larger muffler (banks)? I am planning on a new BHAF w/heat shield.



Any comments and help!



KC
 
i have the magnaflow 4" flow-through muffler and i can barely hear it. straight piped does sound good, but is too loud for the cops in my area.
 
I like purchasing from Geno's, but suggest you go to a muffler shop and have them take out the muffler. I had a shop take out the resonator as well. The straight pipe is much louder... sounds like a real truck. Neighbors say it sounds like a truck stop around here.



Cops have left me alone. After all the big rigs are louder.



Suggest you try the straight pipe first and then the muffler.
 
A Harley is probably louder, but common enough to not be singled out. A Dodge truck that sounds like something 10 times it's size (and turns everbodys head) sort of stands out more.



Having a large muffler (like a 4" straight thru) sounds about the same at idle, but really takes the sharp edge off at WOT.



I was straight piped fro a couple years. I like it much better with my Dynomax now.
 
cops?

98rammer,



why do the cops harrass you about the straight pipe being too loud? I was under the impression (from people on here) that it was a "national law" that a diesel engine with a turbo does not need a muffler, as the turbo is considered one.



Someone point me in the right direction before I get pulled by a cop and ask him to write me a ticket for my straight pipe... (only if he is being that big of a dick).



Thanks, Josh.
 
my bank's sound good....

but my stright pipe was a bust. . it sounded very strong but towing was deafing... is it not a fed offence to tamper with the emmission's(exaust) system?:confused:
 
Re: cops?

Originally posted by snowracer69

98rammer,



why do the cops harrass you about the straight pipe being too loud? I was under the impression (from people on here) that it was a "national law" that a diesel engine with a turbo does not need a muffler, as the turbo is considered one.



Someone point me in the right direction before I get pulled by a cop and ask him to write me a ticket for my straight pipe... (only if he is being that big of a dick).



Thanks, Josh.





because, modifying an exhaust is illegal... technically. even adding an aftermarket muffler is illegal supposedly illegal (that's still sketchy). taking a cat off a vehicle is a big no-no as some people have told me:rolleyes: if i know right, your exhaust isn't suppose to be over 95 decibals loud. lately the cops in my area have been pulling over people (mostly kids) for loud exhausts. some are fighting the tickets, but it's just rediculous. it's usually the one of the bunch who's into him/herself who hates people/objects. there's been a lot of profiling in my town lately.



i'd think that we'd have better things to worry about over who has a modified exhaust :mad: heck, all the harleys around here have straight pipes, but now they're cracking down on them:eek: :eek:
 
ok, but....

I still don't think it's illegal to modify the exhaust on a diesel engine. First off, I don't have a catalitic (sp?) converter ('01 24 valve), and I could have sworn that it was perfectly legal to straight pipe the exhaust on our trucks... . how could people legally sell 4" straight pipe systems, if it wasn't legal to run them? Makes no sense to me. I believe that Andrew in Texas found the law showing that it is legal to run a straight exhaust... but, I'm not sure.



No flames, just trying to get my facts straight for future arguments. :)



Later, Josh.
 
Read this, it is very good http://www.off-road.com/dodge/tech/Emissions_Legal.htm Here's what it boils down to:

"In a nutshell, there essentially are no legal exhaust modifications. According to EPA, pretty much any modification to your vehicle that in any way alters anything from the intake air to the tailpipe exit constitutes tampering. The only way an individual is absolutely assured of remaining in compliance after making modifications is to spend about $2,000 or more putting the modified vehicle through the full Federal Test Procedure (FTP) that the automakers use. Anything short of that, while not being an "enforcement priority", can be considered tampering. In short, unless you have the resources to put your finished project through Federal Test Procedures (FTP), you place yourself at the whim of a regulator's judgment. Should that regulator decide that your actions constitute tampering, you will be facing a $2,500 fine or the legal costs of attempting to fight it. If this comes as a surprise to you, you're probably not alone. Memorandum 1A states that the EPA will not consider any modification to a certified emissions control configuration to be a violation of the tampering prohibition if there is a reasonable basis for knowing that emissions are not adversely affected. In many cases, durability, aging and emissions testing according to the FTP would be necessary to make this determination. Whether or not your vehicle came with a catalytic converter stock makes no difference, the FTP for your vehicle are still in effect.

Is there good news? Yes. EPA doesn't intend to make this an enforcement priority. Essentially, that means that they maintain their legal right to fine you, but won't do so unless the political opportunity presents itself. "







Here's excerpts form the Montana vehicle code enforcement guidelines, if it's illegal in MT you can be positive it is at least at the same level, probably worse in most every other state. Heck, most of Montana doesn't even have zoning or building code laws, it's a lawless state.



"Excessive noise is primarily a nuisance issue rather than a safety concern, and determination of excessive noise is subjective. For this reason, enforcement personnel are to exercise sound professional judgment In making a determination of violation. The following guidelines and attached question and answer sheet (Attachment A) provide guidance to enforcement personnel regarding appropriate enforcement procedures.



Enforcement Guidelines

The only drivers who should be cited are those whose vehicles:



1) are not equipped with a muffler;

2) clearly emit an offensive, harsh, excessive noise, or,

3) have a clearly defective exhaust system (holes, leaks, etc. ).



Q1 Doesn't the VC (Vehicle Code) require a muffler on every vehicle?

Yes. Section 27150 VC requires that every motor vehicle subject to registration be equipped with an adequate muffler. There are no exceptions -- all vehicles, including trucks and motorcycles must be equipped with a muffler, as defined in Section 425 VC. A turbocharger is not considered a muffler.



Q2 Aren't all exhaust system modifications prohibited?



No. Section 27151 VC prohibits the modification of the exhaust system to amplify or increase the noise emitted by the vehicle, making the vehicle not in compliance with Section 27150 VC or exceeding the noise limits established in Sections 27201-27206 VC. Section 27151 VC does not prohibit all modifications to an exhaust system. It also does not prohibit all modifications that increase the noise level of the exhaust system over that of the original, factory-installed exhaust system (as it did until 1980). It only prohibits modifications that result in a noise level higher than those specified In Sections 27201-27206 VC. Accurately determining compliance with Sections 27201-27206 VC for enforcement purposes is generally impractical. Enforcement personnel must make an informed professional evaluation to determine if excessive noise statutes are being violated. "



I suggest you check your own state's VC to find out what applies, even if it's against the law whether it's enforced is a different story.
 
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I am not exactly sure of the number but in 1986 the Feds passed a law stating that no vehicle shall make more than 80 decibles when driven by at 40 mph. Now that is total noise level. If the running gear and engine are quiet the the exhaust can be louder. So where does my Cummins with the silencer ring, BHAF and straight pipe put me? Oh well only time will tell.
 
Like a big truck, I don't think they are that bad, for most of them the Jace brake is the loudest thing I hear. THere are lots of harley around were I live along with kids with the stereo's that rattle the windows. I guess I am still not sure.



KC
 
I am not quite sure what you mean by being "harassed" by the cops. You have broken the law and were caught. That is how the game works. When I speed I realize that I am subject to being pulled over and possibly being cited. That's how it is. Your actions, lack thereof, or equipment violations are why you keep getting visited by law enforcement. And just because the law isn't important to you doesn't mean it isn't important to someone else. As much as I love a straight piped Cummins there are times when quiet is good. Not everyone shares our tastes. This is why laws were invented in the first place. To protect and give people equal rights, say-so, etc. Example: The murderer likes to kill, however, his victims don't like being dead. This statement in no way implies that running straight piped is akin to murder. It is merely an illustration. All actions have consequences and we must be willing to accept those consequences.



Back to the topic:

I still don't believe the question has been answered. Will no muffler have the same effect as a larger muffler?



P. S. the following defense does not work in court "The officer could have been preventing a burglary, but instead he was writing me a ticket for no muffler".
 
I feel with a large, straight thru muffler, I have made an attempt to curb the harsh effects of an angry, overfueled Cummins. It may be in-effective, or slightly in-adequate, but at least I have tried. (Might hold up in court, right? I WANT A JURY OF MY OWN PIERS!:D Oo. )
 
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harrassed by the cops means just that. even kids with normal totally stock cars have been getting harrassed lately. they follow us for a couple miles at a time with their radar detector on the whole time. they make up false excuses to pull us over. they constantly accuse people: "you've been drinking haven't you!?" when no one has. "oh, your license plate showed up as another car's". there's a lot more stories.



WE ARE PEOPLE. yeah, i'm breaking the law with my exhaust and intake. heck, my taller 285/75 tires are illegal because the stock ones are only 245/75s. but we are people.



as for straight pipe, i'm not disagreeing with you, but i'm not going to go any further so as not to turn this into a bad thread.



KC. putting in a banks muffler will be a lot quieter than using the ME kit from genos.



Tom.
 
Tom, I'm pretty sure the cops don't use "radar detectors". They may use radar. False reasons for stops are illegal. Everyone feels that they are a victim of something.

(and quite possibly are in certain circumstances)



Has anyone actually researched the benefits of no muffler versus a larger muffler? What do the high horsepower guys (Diesel Dynamics, Piers, etc) run?
 
Does anyone know, is the Geno muffler replacement kit just to replace the muffler or does it replace the resonator as well?



KC
 
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"Back to the topic:

I still don't believe the question has been answered. Will no muffler have the same effect as a larger muffler? "



I think a high performance flow-thru muffler will give you every bit the performance gain you get from removing the muffler. No muffler has 2 benifits: low cost and cool sound.
 
Well when I put my 4" system on I put on a 4. 5" raceing flowmaster muffler on. It sounded cool at least better then stock. It made my egt's cool a lot faster and the turbo spooled faster. I then let a few fellow TDR members talk me into straight pipe. I thought what the Heck Ill go for it. I cut it off and WOW I was in love. Performance wise it didnt see a real difference but as far as the sound goes its AWESOME! Is it loud? Yes. Too loud? No. Not for me anyway. It sound so awesome pulling a load I am nothing but:D :D .



I have people tell me my truck is loud bla, bla, bla... ... . Guess what I dont care what others think! I paid 35k for the truck and its mine and I love it and I will have it how ever I want. Id say if your thinking about it. Go for the straight pipe first. If you dont like it put a muffler on. Dont do it muffler first and then cut it off you will waste money.



Mike
 
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