Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Lift pump answers from DC

[shaft]

Originally posted by JHoney

I'm starting out by writing a letter with your reference #

My truck is in the shop as I write this with 51000 miles on it and a bad lift pump being replaced at a cost of $550. 00 dealer says that they won't cover the lift pump, because I have a banks power system on it. I've argued that the banks system has no bearing on the lift pump, and they still say NO.

IMHO you need to run not walk as far from that dealer as you can get... ... . not just because they wont honor the warrenty but also because the LP on outright purchase is only $140-$160 and should not take more than an hour to change out. If they are charging you THAT MUCH labor then they are a pack of thieves and should be avoided like the plague.

 

[Steve St.Laurent]

Actually, last I knew the price on the lift pump from DC was around $350 - that was a couple years ago and it may have gone up since then. $140-$160 is from a Cummins distributor.

 

[PRout]

Originally posted by Steve St. Laurent

Actually, last I knew the price on the lift pump from DC was around $350 - that was a couple years ago and it may have gone up since then. $140-$160 is from a Cummins distributor.

Agreed, before I installed the FASS, I was checking all options. Cummins wanted 148. 00 for the lift pump.



The dealer wanted 377. 00 for the same pump, plus 124. 00 to install it. That's about 500 bones for DC to install.



There's the justification for a high end aftermarket pump right there.

 

[abranz]

Chock me up, I too sent a letter to DC re this lift pump issue.



Tony in Idaho

 

[abranz]

I've sent several letter and emails to DC over the past two years regarding this fuel system problem. In return, I've been sent the same crap others are now.



Bottom line IMO

1 DC couldn't care less once their trucks are sold.



2 Unless this becomes a "safety" problem, I dought we will get far with DC. They likely will only do what they have to do if forced by a gov agency. If they feared lawsuits based on safety issues, our fuel system problems would be quickly resolved.



3 We all keep buying their crap and they are not going to care/resolve issues like this unless their bottom line is hurt, even worse than it already is.

Tony

 

[dpetre]

I was a happy Dodge Cumins diesel owner when I took my vehicle in to have a heater fan replaced. My truck had 48000 miles on it with an extended warranty to 100K. The dealer change the fan gave me a bill for $310 and said the warranty was good only at the dealer I purchased it from. I also asked the dealer to check my fuel pressure and he said I had 9 psi at 2700 rpms. He offered to change the filter but I said no as I have some at the house. That was Friday, Saturday while going into town my truck went from 60mph to 50mph and would not go any higher. I had a quarter tank of fuel so I decided to fill up. After filling up my truck went back up to normal operation. Sunday I change the fuel filter and found a dead lift pump. On Monday I called the dealer that I bought the truck from and he said the other dealer had screwed me and I should go back to him and he would pay for the fan. I asked about getting my vehicle towed in. The warranty which had towing would only cover $80 and I would have to pay $180 out of my pocket. I said no way. I canceled my extend warranty and installed a FASS.

 

[Forrest Nearing]

why write DC on a vehicle that's out of warranty? they've already got your money...



realize that the 24v trucks have a design flaw and correct it with a suitable pusher pump and move on...



Forrest

 

[Pit Bull]

How DC's decisions affects buying decision. I sold my 2002 CTD because of the lift pump issue. Here is the problem as I see it. I bought the CTD for durability, dependability and the great 100K mile warranty. With the lift pump issue I ended up with a truck I had to worry about. If you install the FASS system you have the potential of warranty coverage issues. You also have the frustration of paying to fix a DC problem on your own nickle, that's BS. I voted with my $$$ and took them to someone other than DC. If I buy another Dodge CTD it will be on a buyer beware basis.

 

[dresslered]

I agree that DC should address the issue of the lift pump as this is a definite design flaw and they are well aware of it. But, once again, it is the bean counters that dictate the method of resolution. So far, on both my failed lift pumps (low pressure), I bought the pump from Cummins and replaced it myself. I then wrote a letter to DC and they reimbursed me for the parts, shipping, and membership to the Power Booster club. The best part about it is that I have the old ones to be used as emergency spares and I am confident that the new ones were installed correctly. When I see a better solution for the lift pump, I'll go that route. Otherwise, it hasn't been too much of a hassle.

 

[dsherman]

We all need to get together do a class action suit. You bet they will listen then The GM guys did it and so can we. they win there case

If they can do it we can

David

 

[justinp20012500]

Count me in...

Heres the reply I got...



*****AUTOMATED RESPONSE - DO NOT REPLY TO THIS ADDRESS *****



Thank you for your email inquiry. Your question has been sent to the

DaimlerChrysler Customer Assistance Center in order to provide the best

answer for your Chrysler, Dodge, or Jeep question. Every effort will be

made to respond to your email within 3 (Three) business days.



While waiting for our response, feel free to visit our brand web sites

at http://www.chrysler.com, http://www.dodge.com or http://www.jeep.com.

These sites may provide the information you have requested.



NOTE: This is an automatically generated response. Our system is NOT

able to accept email at this address. Please do not use the 'Reply'

function of your email.



If this matter is urgent, please call us at 800. 992. 1997 (8:00 a. m. to

5:00 p. m. , Monday thru Friday).



For ALL future communications (related to this email), please refer to

the following information:



REFERENCE NUMBER: 12162634

 

[RPainter]

Anyone know if we can convert this system to the high rail system used on the 2004? Wouldn't have any idea of costs if it could be done but seems cummins changed to the high rail for a reason besides more power. I would seriously consider doing it if it could be done and not cost to much.

Randy

 

[DHawthorne]

Convert to Common Rail system, That would solve the injection pump issue not having one, but the lift pump is still there.



New injections at $ 400. 00 each (guess)

Hi pressure fuel pump (1500. 00 Guess)

New Computer and wiring (1000. 00 Guess)

New fuel delivery piping and a few other things.



It would be worth it if it came up to 325hp and 600ft/lbs of torgue. Cheaper than changing the engine out.



The lift pump would have to replaced with a pusher arrangement on the back side of the filter. My expierence with this type pump on a 85 Surburban 6. 2 is one could expect about 75-90,000 miles from one only if you had a filter between the tank and the pump. No filter, 1/2 of the mileage.



Dave

 

[shaft]

Originally posted by Steve St. Laurent

Actually, last I knew the price on the lift pump from DC was around $350 - that was a couple years ago and it may have gone up since then. $140-$160 is from a Cummins distributor.

True..... but then I stand by my statement $350+ for a $150 pump and then $150+ for an hours labor fairly reeks of theivery to me lol

 

[GSpeed]

Mine just blew in my 2003!!! Count me in

 

[PRout]

Originally posted by abranz

Unless this becomes a "safety" problem, I dought we will get far with DC.

There's going to be one heck of a lawsuit when someone causes a major crash because their motor quit and lost their steering & brakes on a hill while passing a gas tanker.



Unfortunately, it WILL HAPPEN sooner or later, and we will all feel for the victims.



Will have NO sympathy for DC's shareholder value when their a$$ is sued big, and their negligence is posted all over the evening news.



"Penny wise & pound foolish"

 

[CrewCabDiesel]

It would be great if something good would come from this like a real fix paid for by DC voluntarily, but I would have a better chance of winning the lottery . It would be more effective writing to your or Michigan's attorney general, Dot or NHTSA.

I (as auto makers have always counted on) have given up fighting DC. It is cheaper and easier to fix the problem myself than replace a lift pump every 30,000 mile(I am on the 4th lift pump now) by installing a FASS system or another aftermarket fix that works.

But it could be worse,you could have bought a ford or chevy. Think about the powerpoke and durafart guys and some of the problems they are having, not to mention their motors are done at less than 200K .

Kyle

 

[fj40dave]

I sent my e-mail at the customer service site in the "www.dodge.com" link (I had to "fix" the link - it had a comma in it

I'll post what they send me back!

 

[JimKing]

Originally posted by Shortshift

There's going to be one heck of a lawsuit when someone causes a major crash because their motor quit and lost their steering & brakes on a hill while passing a gas tanker.



no flame intended, BUT...



What about the steering problems that affect a considerable number of Dodge/CTD vehicles. Various groups have fought that one for years. DC ignores them. Pretends there is no problem.



Brakes Pull ?? No problem. .



My all time favorite - non-functional OP guage ?? "don't worry, if you loose ALL your oil pressure the check engine light will come on" Yeah, just before you scatter various parts all over the highway when it comes apart.



To admit trouble at this date would most certainly elicit a whole slew of lawsuits. I would hazard to guess there IS a case or two out there where the LP failed and a accident of some type happened as a consequence. I would also bet that DC knows about it and may have even handled it quietly, give the victim a fist full of money, make them promise not to talk about it...



No problem !!!



Until you find a Law firm willing to file class action, DC will politely thank you for your input, and deposit your letter in the round letter file.



MY $. 02 worth

(I feel better now, thanks)

 

[justinp20012500]

Well Guys, here is my response from Dodge...



They are not much help.



Dear Justin,



Thank you for your recent email to DaimlerChrysler Motors regarding your

Dodge Ram 2500.



Unfortunately, the information you are requesting regarding the diesel

lift pumps is not available. However, I have documented your concerns

appropriately.



One way we have of being able to gauge what our customers want or need

is through correspondence from customers such as yourself. We're pleased

you have taken both the time and effort to express your concerns to us.



Additionally, our records indicate that the following recall campaign

has not been performed by an authorized DaimlerChrysler dealer.



Recall B04 Power Distribution Center Cable Connections



Since we can't always confirm that the needed service has been

performed, we ask that you contact your local authorized Dodge dealer to

make arrangements for an inspection and, if necessary, corrective action

at no charge to you.



Please take a copy of this message with you at the time of service.



Thank you again for your email.



NOTE: Please do not use the 'Reply' function of your email system. If

you have a need to respond to this message, please visit us at our reply

form (link provided below). Our system is NOT able to accept any emails

at this address.



For any future communications related to this email, please refer to the

following information:

REFERENCE NUMBER: 12162634

REPLY LINK: http://www.chrysler.com/wccsapp/wccs/brand_forms/us/reply.jsp?trk_ID=KMM1038383C0KM&





Sincerely,



Stacie Perry

Senior Staff Representative

DaimlerChrysler Customer Assistance Center





Original Message Follows:

------------------------

Form Selected:

--------------

Category: US Customer Service

Brief Description:

------------------

Left pump failure on ISB Cummins

Comments:

---------

March 22, 2004

Via E Mail

Daimler-Chrysler

Customer

Assistance-United States

P. O. Box 21-8004

Auburn Hills, MI

48321-8004

Dear Daimler-Chrysler:

SUBJECT: DODGE RAM LIFT PUMP

FAILURES

First I want to congratulate your company on creating an

excellent, overall truck! I'm the proud owner of a 2002 Dodge Ram 2500

Diesel and have been very happy with my ownership experience thus far.

I'm also a member of the Turbo Diesel Register, an organization that I

also noticed you promoted in your brochures as being a respected group

of

Diesel Ram owners, over 19,000 members! Usually this ?work? is easy when

I

spot a frequent topic being brought up by several different members.

This

allows for trending data to be gathered and the most talked about issues

tend to be addressed by Dodge as a TSB shortly afterwards if the concern

is

verified or data is presented to the contrary if it's an untrue

perspective.

The reason I'm writing is in hopes that we can get an issue

identified (if it's not already), addressed, and corrected once and for

all. There has been a repeated trend over several years now concerning

the

lift pump utilized in the 2500/3500 Cummins Diesel application. The

concern

seems to center around the lift pump being located in an out-of-spec

location within the engine compartment, which is a considerable distance

from the source of the fuel in the tank. Several members are paying out

of

their own pocket to research fixes that they hope to share with others

to

extend the life of the stock equipment, or when necessary replace the

equipment with a proven aftermarket setup that will be more reliable.

Most

of these setups tend to use a secondary ?pusher pump? located close to

the

tank feeding the existing lift pump, thus alleviating the burden on the

stock lift pump. The only reason this has gone to this length is, from

our

perspective, the lift pump failure rate is extremely high. And when you

consider that the failure of the highly expensive VP 44 injection pump

is

sometimes related to the failure of the lift pump, it could mean big

dollars for Diamler Chrysler, or the own when its out of warranty. When

you figure in that the demographic you seek for this particular product

line is going to be the hard-working, reliability-is-key, person that

will

lose time and money when a vehicle is out of operation I would hope that

any concern brought up by multiple parties would be followed up on

immediately.

Any information you can provide on the issue, it's

addressing or troubleshooting work in progress, or any released data

concerning this will be greatly appreciated. Rest assured it will be

disseminated upon receipt to the members of the TDR via website Thank

you

for your help in answering this frequent topic of discussion!

Sincerely,

SME STEEL CONTRACTORS

Justin Pitts

Sales/Estimating

c. c. TDR Website, Gillette Diesel Service, West

Valley Dodge

Sender Information:

-------------------

Title: Mr.

First Name: Justin

Middle Initial:

Last Name: Pitts