Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Lift pump or something else?

[Blademan]

Well the ol Dodge finally left me on the side of the road. I was pulling a hill and switched from 5th down to 4th, got back into the throttle all the way and a couple of seconds later it was almost like I shut the engine off with the key. It just died with a few sputters and I coasted over to the side of the road. Done. It would just crank, and maybe after 5 or 10 seconds get just enough fuel to run really rough.



‪My Edited Video‬‏ - YouTube



So I had it towed to the Dodge dealer and I should here from them today or tomorrow.



Anyone want to guess? I can already hear them coming for my check book!



It's a bone stock 2001, with the 245 HO, 6 speed manual with 151,000 miles. Well, I guess I did replace my exhaust with a 4" MBRP a couple of years ago after my stock one broke into a couple of pieces. LOL!



I know, I know, I'm looking at getting some gauges now. Ha!

 

[TboneMan]

Did the CEL illuminate? If so, what codes are displayed?



My guess is the injection pump. If the injection pump was viable and the lift pump failed, the injection pump would likely pull enough fuel on its own to start the truck.

 

[Blademan]

Sorry I should have put that in the op. 1693 was the only code I got.

 

[TboneMan]

Here's a good read:



Blue Chip Diesel Performance Specialists

 

[Blademan]

Cool. Thanks!

 

[Blademan]

Here we go guys...



So the Dodge dealer called and said they replaced the in tank lift pump with a new one. Fine. They still have the truck, but it still isn't running right and now they are saying it wiped out the VP44 as well. So they wanted to sell me a new VP44 for $2400. I called Blue Chip Diesel as recommended and ordered his "Upgraded/Rebuilt Blue Chip VP44 Injection Pump with NEW Computer" for $1850. I also had him send me the "FASS DDRP Lift Pump".



So here is my question... Since Dodge already put in the new in tank lift pump, can I hook up the FASS and run it with the in tank pump still there? Or should I do something else?



Thanks for any help or ideas.

 

[TboneMan]

I'm not sure about your FASS question, but apparently Blue Chip raised their prices about $100 since January when I needed a VP44.



I bought the Blue Chip pump (new computer version )and had the dealer install it and the total cost (including labor) was $1,900.



Good luck.

 

[fox]

Here we go guys...



So the Dodge dealer called and said they replaced the in tank lift pump with a new one. Fine. They still have the truck, but it still isn't running right and now they are saying it wiped out the VP44 as well. So they wanted to sell me a new VP44 for $2400. I called Blue Chip Diesel as recommended and ordered his "Upgraded/Rebuilt Blue Chip VP44 Injection Pump with NEW Computer" for $1850. I also had him send me the "FASS DDRP Lift Pump".



So here is my question... Since Dodge already put in the new in tank lift pump, can I hook up the FASS and run it with the in tank pump still there? Or should I do something else?



Thanks for any help or ideas.

No, you need to get rid of that in tank pump. That is a mistake on dodges part. It isn't much better than the stock set-up and is more costly to change out.

You cannot run both, and cannot draw thru the tank on either.

 

[cerberusiam]

The in-tank pump is pretty good. You may not need the DDRP at all as long as the in-tank pump will hold pressure.



You could add the DDRP inline and see if that will work. It will depend on the in-tank flowing enough to not starve the DDRP. A Carter frame mounted pump in addition to the in-tank works well but its requirements are different from the DDRP.

 

[Chief USA]

Well the ol Dodge finally left me on the side of the road. I was pulling a hill and switched from 5th down to 4th, got back into the throttle all the way and a couple of seconds later it was almost like I shut the engine off with the key. It just died with a few sputters and I coasted over to the side of the road. Done. It would just crank, and maybe after 5 or 10 seconds get just enough fuel to run really rough.



‪My Edited Video‬‏ - YouTube



So I had it towed to the Dodge dealer and I should here from them today or tomorrow.



Anyone want to guess? I can already hear them coming for my check book!



It's a bone stock 2001, with the 245 HO, 6 speed manual with 151,000 miles. Well, I guess I did replace my exhaust with a 4" MBRP a couple of years ago after my stock one broke into a couple of pieces. LOL!



I know, I know, I'm looking at getting some gauges now. Ha!

Kinda late to this party. Perhaps there have been some troubleshooting steps not posted but it SURE does sound like you just ran out of fuel. These trucks are notorious for the fuel level sender going bad and providing a false reading to the operator. The truck simply runs out of fuel with no CEL or recoverable/relevant codes.



I find it extremely difficult to believe that both the fuel lift pump and the VP-44 would or could go bad at the same time unless you have no fuel pressure gauge and the fuel lift pump and/or fuel filter have been dead for a long time and this was the last gasp of the VP-44.



Did anyone verify the actual fuel level in the fuel tank?



Did anyone verfy the fuel lift pump not only ran but provided adequate (min. 12 psi) fuel pressure checked at the VP-44 schrader valve?



Did anyone attemp to bleed the fuel system from the tank up to the injectors and THEN attempt a start? (assuming there the pump made any pressure or flow)



Probably too late for that now. At the very least I would absolutely NOT allow the dealer to install the in tank pump. It is JUNK. It is royal pain in the butt to service and troubleshoot. Not to mention that it does not make adequate pressure or flow (maybe just barely for a stock engine).



As mentioned above, I would strongly advise you to bite the bullet and get the Air Dog 150/165 or FASS as well as install a set of in cab A pillar or similar gauges for fuel pressure, boost, and EGT at the very least.



I see that you are in AK so I would suggest running the Air Dog or FASS fuel lines through the factory/OEM fuel filter canister to utilize the fuel heater for cold weather use. Either of these fuel pump/deaerators will provide steady and rock solid fuel pressure under nearly all conditions. This is what you want to ensure the long life of your VP-44. When properly set and adjusted either of these pumps will make that proper pressure (I run mine at 18 psi) enough to open the fuel pressure relief valve and ensure that maximum cooling and lubrication the VP-44 required from the fuel.



Hopefully this is not too late to help you out. Already been there and done that with respect to what happened to you.

 

[Blademan]

Wow... Thanks for all the help guys! Dodge called and said to come get the truck and it's running great. So we'll see.



As far as the way the truck died, I didn't run out of fuel. I read to check that on here somewhere, but I knew for sure that wasn't the case. It was verified, and verified again when they dropped the tank to put their pump in it. It was about half full. Most of what CHIEF asked was checked by them.



It sounds like the lift pump was not working right, and it killed the VP44. We went through all of my records there on the computer and it turns out that is the original VP44. This will be the 3rd lift pump though. So 151,000 miles on the VP44 with 2 lift pumps going bad. I remember when the first one quit the truck was running like poo, and I was getting very bad milage. So who knows how much damage that caused the VP44 too.



I think I'll just go get the truck for now, and at some point I'll switch over to the FASS lift pump. The first thing I'll still need to figure out is what gauges to put in. I've been searching through here trying to decide what the heck to do. I would like the 3 on the A-pillar as you mentioned CHIEF USA. Not quite sure what parameters they need to be for my truck yet...



The only thing I may do at some point is put some 275's in if my injectors show signs of giving up. I plan to pretty much leave things alone for reliability up here. This is my road trip truck and I need it to be absolutely reliable. Guess I should have put the darn gauges in before this all happened then huh? LOL!

 

[Chief USA]

I didn't see a shifter on the steering column in your video but still hard to tell. Looks like you have a manual trans. This is the gauge set I went with. You can talk with Eric and get some recommendations on any changes or customized touches:



ISSPRO gauge package for Dodge Ram 94-07



Bottom line is that a good set of accurate and dependable gauges is essential. Some folks prefer electric vs. mechanical. I went with mechanical.



As far as reliability, the Air Dog I have comes with a limited lifetime warranty:



PureFlow Raptor: AirDog PureFlow Raptor on SALE!



These are by light years, FAR more reliable than any OEM pump.



FASS has similar warranties:



FASS Fuel Pumps



I went with the Air Dog 150 because at the time it was a smaller and much more quiet pump. I think the FASS pumps have improved since then. Can't go wrong either way.



By the way. I just LOVE that Polaris 6x6 Ranger! That is way cool! Oo.

 

[Blademan]

Thanks! Yeah, it's a 6-speed manual.



If I did go with some electric gauges in the cab, I was wondering how hard it would be to also have a mechanical fuel gauge under the hood some how?



And the Ranger... Ha! Yep, that thing is bad to the bone! It was in my enclosed trailer when my truck broke down. I'll admit, the thought did cross my mind to use it somehow to get my truck off of the road if something wasn't going to work out soon. LOL!



Anywho... off to work.



Thanks again guys!

 

[Chief USA]

When you install the Air Dog or FASS. All of the fuel hose is 1/2 ID. It is very simple to cut into the hose and splice in a brass or steel Tee:



Push Lock Fuel Pressure Tee 1/2"



From there you can plumb in the gauge of your choice and mount it where you want. I have the mechanic fuel pressure gauge with an isolator. On one side that goes to the cab, is filled with engine coolant, the other side is fuel from the system. This isolator comes in the guage kit.



Boost Bolt for easy boost pressure access on the cummins engine