Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Lift pump

[Ncostello]

The stock style ISB 24V lift pump is a bad deal at any price. $64 for a $2 pump? Cummins has been ripping off Dodge truck owners for years selling these things at $150 and more. Now all of a sudden... when a school bus is affected... its "new and improved kit time" with an amazingly low low price



Its funny these pumps were totally adequate to engineers/business leaders... then came along this kit and then an in-tank deal that seems equally weak.



Sorry for ranting... its just that the dang OEM lift pump made me hate the best vehicle that I had ever owned or will ever own. Few things compare to the sound, roar and fury of a good running 24V truck. But the little pump brought mine to its knees and I couldn't stand the idea anymore after investing tons of cash and time.



Do something different and dont rely on the OEM pump at any price.



PS: My "boo-coo" post numbers (if you can call 1400 boo-coo) are practically all from dealing with the cruddy lift pump issue. I should be getting boxes of donated pumps from Cummins.

 

[MAV1]

Thanks Don

Many many thanks to ya Don. I called my local Cummins facility and asked about the part number you gave on this post. They replied that the wharehouse had four. I asked if I could buy all four and how much. Yes and $64. 90 each plus minor freight. I was not required to provide any serial or vin numbers or vehicle info. Just how many I wanted. I purchased all four. Today, I installed one of these new lift pumps along with a Geno's Garage Vulcan Relocation kit on a friends 2001 ETC. I had previously checked the pressure of his oe pump and it was definitely on the way out. Barely 2psi at WOT. I CAN'T WAIT TO DO THE SAME TO MY TRUCK. The performance and drivability of the truck is vastly improved. Bout like putting on a VA or EZ. My friend is very impressed with the added (should I say recovered) power.
I for one, will be buying more of this lift pump kit. At 33 cents on the dollar compared to the 39------- part number, and the Vulcan Kit, I'll run Carter. The FASS would be nice but $500 plus, give me a break. Fuel pressure gauge, a Vulcan and a spare lift pump. #ad

 

[Ncostello]

My "Vulcan" relocation kit



18 months ago I installed a custom built relocation kit (I don't think Vulcan kits were around at that time). Practical Diesel Solutions made me a power extension harness with the OEM Deutch connectors. And I scavenged a handfull of the largest banjo fittings made for the 2nd gen trucks (there are large differences). My kit looked something that could pass for OEM... sort of. That was my intent. I also did some modificaions to the inside of the fuel tank module to make pulling fuel from the tank easier. My fuel line was also upgraded to full 3/8" diesel rated J30R9. However as a note... the OEM staninless and plastic are basically 3/8"... except for a couple fittings.



My idea was also to relocate the pump and keep a spare pump handy. I now have a few pumps in my garage junk drawer and no longer own the truck. Just relocating and keeping a spare pump doesn't mean you won't need to replace two pumps in 6 months. Or... you may never have to replace a pump as long as you own the truck.



I guess my point was that I personally could never find a direct link between pump location, fuel hose size and pump longevity. Seemed like the more I tried to improve the pump life... the worse it got. FWIW.



And changing the pump down there on the frame sounds more convenient at first... until you realize your at the low point and fuel will siphon out with the pump removed and thats not convenient. You almost need a shutoff valve behind and ahead of the pump to isolate it.



I'm not trying to discourage experimentation or improvements... just giving my experience in working for some time on the issue.

 

[Don Bellamy]

Your welcome MAV1, I've found that relocating this $65. 00 pump to the rear with the Vulcan big line kit works very well. I see 15psi at idle, 14psi running and 13psi wot and my truck is stock. When this pump was installed my truck was turning over 113,000. One thing I know this pump does that the original did not do was cycle from low to high? Nevertheless, all seems worth it to me.

Don

 

[ARoss]

I just installed one of these pumps a couple of days ago, since I replaced my VP and added some 275's. My original pump was seeing 14 @ idle, 12 @ cruise and 10. 5 @ WOT. With the new pump I see 13 @ idle, 11 @ cruise and 10 @ WOT ... not too impressed. I noticed the number stamped on the part is different and ends in a 'B' instead of an 'A'. What difference is there between the two pumps, does anyone know? These numbers are with a Vulcan relocation kit too!

 

[mediccummin]

They lowered the price so you can buy 3 for the price of 1, because you know you will need that many to last you a couple years if your lucky, I finally got rid of that piece of crap stocker.

Along with Ncostello, I to went with all 6an and relocation, works fine for awhile but nothing will change the fact that these stock pumps with the never ending changing part numbers, which are the same part, are junk.

 

[ARoss]

They lowered the price so you can buy 3 for the price of 1, because you know you will need that many to last you a couple years if your lucky

I tend to agree! I was going to go with the Walbro system, but I wasn't able to get all the information I needed to confidently address it. Needed to make sure I had something new and reliable ( :-laf ) for the new VP.

 

[Silver_Ram]

Thanks Don Bellamy

I picked up 8 of the pump kits today for $64. 90. . 2 for me & 6 for a local diesel shop. .

 

[EGaskamp]

That sounds like a hell of a deal! Oops, I should have posted 7 months ago so I wouldn't have too many posts to be included in "whats his face's" little club! Sometimes these guys know they are talking about. I've never had a situation where they didn't. This site is for help and thats exacly what everyone does for everyone else reguardless of who they are.



Eric

 

[Don Bellamy]

Silver Ram, again, glad to see another take advantage of this $65. 00 pump.

Don

 

[Silver_Ram]

The guys at G&R Diesel thank you also for the info.

 

[Bodybomber]

AMassaro, What Walbro pump are you running and where did you get it?



I just had a Cater pusher go out and am looking for something different.

 

[klaybus]

Just replaced #4 today... . Number 5 now installed. Last one went 20,000 miles. On a side note, I'm running the Vulcan kit & it showed great signs with pressures but as others have stated, it's the Friggin CHEAP Carter pump thats the REAL problem IMO. Eric's kit is DEFINATELY an improvement but I believe it starts with the pump location & the CHEAP Carter Pump FWIW. BTW, I did relocate the LP back by the tank.



Clay

 

[Tiger Rag]

Thanks Don and thanks TDR. I ordered 2 today for $64. 90 and should have them tomorrow. Thanks again, Matt

 

[raf2000]

Called my local Cummins shop in Savannah, Ga today. They had 3 in stock for $60 something, didn't even listen to the something after I heard the $60. Told them the part number (4090046) and it was for a school bus campaign, they said OK. They asked if I was a dealer, said no. They put me on hold, came back and said I can't sell you those "because they are for a campaign"! BUT, I can cross ship you 3 from Atlanta (they have 37) and they will be there tomorrow. Duh, OK. Ordered the Vulcan kit last night (from Vulcan) so hope I am covered for another 2 years or so. .

 

[Huff N Puff]

I would be interested in one if thats the price. I'm thinking of removing the in tank pump because of the lack of pressure. I'm thinking of a new lift pump with the rasp. Has anyone relocated the oem pump at the tank with the big line kit then use the rasp? Thanks Jeff

It would be a mistake to get rid of the in tank pump,my suggestion would be add a lift pump in the old location in addition to the in tank pump. This will net you over 20psi of fuel pressure. Depending on your mods you probably wont be able to pull it down below 12 at WOT.

 

[JTCash]

Thanks Don,



R/



Jim

 

[remarc31]

It would be a mistake to get rid of the in tank pump,my suggestion would be add a lift pump in the old location in addition to the in tank pump. This will net you over 20psi of fuel pressure. Depending on your mods you probably wont be able to pull it down below 12 at WOT.

Mistake?---may be, but I've read where the tank pump fails also and when it does it's not an easy fix. I read on one forum where it cost ca. $650. 00 to replace. Also if equipped with both pumps the one at the "old location" is apt to fail and hard to get to. If it fails and you have a spare and proper tools it can be changed on side of the road.



I relocated mine to the frame rail near the tank using the Vulcan kit. I also installed an isolation valve and filter before the pump. I carry a spare filter and pump and either can be changed out easily in a few minutes.