Guns, Bows, Shooting Sports, and Hunting Looking for Deer Rifle Advise

[mikel]

Hi gang,



I'm looking for a deer rifle in the next couple of months. I have several guns that I can borrow for opening day, but I'd like to have my own.



I don't know much about deer rifles yet, but am trying to learn.



Right now I am consistantly hitting soda cans at about 120yds with a . 223 and have had several people tell me that this is a big enough gun, especially if I shoot the animal in the head, but I don't want to worry about wounding an animal and having to chase it across two counties or worse yet loosing it to die later.



I'm considering trying to shoot a . 243, 30-30, and . 308 (just because I know people that own these), but don't know if any or all of these would be good choices.



Can anyone make any recommendations?



Thanks,

Mike

 

[RHARVEY]

Remington Model 700 30-06!!! I do have the 243 and 30-30, but I bought this one so that I could deer hunt in Arkansas and also elk hunt in Oregon! Alot of different rounds available for this rifle.



Its a sweet shooter. .



Rick

 

[jwdeeming]

Mike,



Check your local regs. Here in Colorado there is a minimum caliber requirement of . 24. The . 223 is not a legal deer gun here. A properly placed . 223 would do the job, of course, but read the rules where you hunt.



If you like the smaller calibers, the . 243 is a great option. If you want all-around guns in the most common sizes, the . 270 or 30-06 are excellent.



And if you don't mind my saying so, don't mess around with headshots. There's too many ways for that to go bad. Broadside chest cavity is always your best bet.



My 2c.



JimD

 

[mikel]

Originally posted by jwdeeming

Mike,



Check your local regs. Here in Colorado there is a minimum caliber requirement of . 24. The . 223 is not a legal deer gun here. A properly placed . 223 would do the job, of course, but read the rules where you hunt.

I hadn't even thought of that. I'll look into it.

And if you don't mind my saying so, don't mess around with headshots. There's too many ways for that to go bad. Broadside chest cavity is always your best bet.

That's kind of what worries me. I don't have any real attraction to the . 223, it's just what I was toying around with last weekend.



An all-around gun is exactly what I'm looking for. I'll probably use this to shoot wild pigs as well as deer, so I feel that the . 223 is too small and I need to look at the bigger guns. That being said would the . 270 or 30-06 be adequate and how does the . 308 compare to these? A buddy of mine has a . 308 and can't say enough good about it but it seems to me that any time I get three or four guys standing around talking about guns it's about like asking them if Ford makes a better truck that Chevy...



Thanks,

Mike

 

[jwdeeming]

If you put that bullet where it needs to go, it IS mostly a Ford/Chevy argument and it can get religious in a hurry. Any of those three (. 270, . 308, or 30-06) would be plenty for pigs. My Uncle, who's been the huntin'est fool I know for 80 years swears the . 270 is the only rifle you need on the North American Continent.



Will you ever hunt anything bigger? If elk, moose, or caribou are ever in your future, the . 308 should probably drop off the list. But I know having said that, someone will shoot ME.



My wife shot her first cow elk with a borrowed . 308 and it went down just fine - but on the bigger animals, a little more downrange energy is a good idea.



Any time it's a discussion about what's BEST, there's a lot of opinions, and you should use what you can shoot the best and are most confident in.



If it's a discussion about what is capable of a kill, there's facts that upset a lot of opinions. Like the incident over in Boulder a few years back where a lady shot a deer with an air rifle to scare it out of her garden. The miracle BB found it's way between the ribs, pierced a lung, and down it went...

 

[TPCDrafting]

All the above are great options. Check around for package deals. I bought my 7mm mag at Gart Bros about 10 years ago. I think they still have deals like the one I bought. I liked the 7 mag mostly because that is what my Dad uses and I liked it's versatility, accuracy and they happened to have a left handed bolt in stock that day. Good luck and good hunting.



PS, I shot a buck antelope on Friday. When I get pics back, I'll post'em. Elk and deer start next week. Oo. Oo. Oo.

 

[WDaniels]

Mikel,

In picking a caliber of rifle, just remember this. " Don't pick a caliber that is efficient in killing when everything goes right, but instead pick a caliber that is efficient in killing when everything goes wrong. " I read this somewhere but for the life of me I can't remember where, but it is excellent advice.

WD

 

[Kernel]

Cost of ammo is one issue that many look at when choosing a rifle. A buddy of mine has a Weatherby 30-378 that cost about $5 a shell. If price is no issue, go for it.



Many big game hunters say the . 270, . 30-06 and its close brother the . 308 are all you need for the North American Continent. These calibers are pretty inexpensive to shoot, accurate, and aren't that hard on the shoulder.



The mags, like the 7mm Rem Mag, are nice flat shooters and accurate out to long distances. Shells are more expensive, but not as badly priced as they used to be. You take a little more thump on the shoulder, but that is the price you pay to play.



I would stay away from calibers like the . 243 and smaller. I have seen the . 243 drop deer where they stood, but I would rather have a bigger caliber especially when that big brute steps out into a clearing. I always hate not being able to find a deer that I have shot (doe or buck). Just my $. 02 worth.



Hope this helps along with the other suggestions posted. Good luck with this coming season.

 

[jsnyder]

My two pesos, FWIW. Stay away from head shots. If you've ever seen an critter with its jaw shot off because someone missed a head shot, you'll understand why. A vitals shot offers over twice the target area, which is a nice margin of error. Also, if you flub a vital shot, you're much more likely to still produce a clean kill.



Good advice above. Ask yourself what you are likely to hunt. A 30-06 or a . 270 are both excellent choices and have killed oodles of game. If you want to hunt elk, moose, bears, etc. I'd opt for the '06. If you're going to be hunting deer and pigs exclusively a . 270, . 280 are excellent guns.



Brand of rifle is up to you. Look at some of them and decide what you like, i. e. safety position, type of magazine (box w/floorplate or detachable clip), etc.



IMHO, a cheap and dependable hunting package would be a Winchester M70 30-06 with a Leupold 6x scope. Good for anything, anywhere except brown bears in the brush.



Good luck.



Jason

 

[Whitmore]

Mikel

A couple things to consider



Like mentioned above, are you going to hunt anything bigger than deer?



What kind of hunting is available to you ? Up here where I used to hunt a 500 YD shot was very common, anything less than that was luck. We consider a 270 or 30-06 to be inaddequate up here



Do you like to walk or dog the timber for your animals?



Can you shoot long distences??? not all have the skills, I am shacky and cant read a newspaper unless its lying down, I use a bi-pod and lay down .



I like to sit on the ridge with my binocks and spotting scope and find them and if 700 or less yards I pop em, if its further than that then I put a plan on and get to a closer location. I shoot a REM model 700 MAG and have a Bushnelle 6-18 scope with a 700 yd range finder in it, I measure them up, set the dial for the yardage and boom.



Very wisely look at how you hunt, what you hunt and type or style and the likely choices will stick out for you to choose.

 

[jwdeeming]

Whitmore,

Out of curiosity, what are you growing up there in WY that a . 270 or 06 is inadequate for?

JimD

 

[JConley]

I like the 270, 06, and the 308. Either one will take care of business. What I would look at is the accuracy of each gun, and the optics after you decide what caliber you want. The gun is only as good as the optics you put on top, and depending on how far you shoot will depend on the optics you need.



Also look at the Rifle twist of the barrel for the caliber you choose. The tighter twist will allow you to use heavier bullets, which you NEED for longer distance. I have a real tight twist on my 308, and it HATES light weight bullets. On the other hand, if you have a slow twist (like 1-12) you wont be able to stabilize heavy weight bullets so they fly through the air sideways. There is no perfect rifle for all conditions, so you need to pick one that will work in the conditions that you will run across most often.



Hope this helps

 

[Whitmore]

Sorry

Originally posted by jwdeeming

Whitmore,

Out of curiosity, what are you growing up there in WY that a . 270 or 06 is inadeqate for?

JimD

Its not the lack of power its just that they seam to fall off bad after 400 tds



along with my 7 mag I would like to have a 280 wich is a 7 express, fast and accurate, excellent choice for up to 500 yds... ... ... ... ... ... ... Kevin

 

[Hammer]

Well my take on this question will be answered like this...

Depending on what kind of terrain your planning on hunting in consistently is how you search for your gun of choice. Someone up above has made the best comment about shooting,pick the calibur that will best suit for where you hunt and something that will allow for a consistent kill in even the worst conditions.



Out here,depending on where I hunt whitetail,is how I decide what calibur to take along and I also keep the weather forcast in mind. Becasue the Lower Susquehanna valley are where I am at is widely populated it does not make for a safe shot with a heavy calibur(lord knows you would not want a flyer in this area with one of my big mags). When the air is light I'll either carry my . 220 swift or my 22-250. If the air is disturbed at all I will either use my 243 or my 6mm Ackley. Most shots in York county are below 400yds due to houses and farms so light is right.



If I go north or west I'll take my . 264 win mag,30/06,35 Whelen(best brush gun around since the 30-30),8mm STW or my Lazzeroni Patriot. It depends on the terrain and game for what I use. My all time favorite is my Pre-64 Model 70 westerner in . 264 win mag. Plenty of knockdown power and you can reload it light enough to still shoot most any game. If a nice even keeled,flat shooting,won't kill your shoulder or your wallet type of gun is what you seek then I'd recommend a . 243. I have killed many a deer,antelope,prairie dog, groundhog with this calibur. Its one of the most underrated caliburs of all time. Your choice though if ya have any other questions feel free to pm me or email me,I'd be glad to help... ... . Andy

 

[merryman]

The . 223 is a great round for varmints, but it seems to me to be very marginal for deer even where it is legal.



For deer and anything smaller, one could not go wrong with either the . 270 or the 30-06-----I prefer the . 06 for a little greater versitility---it will digest anything from 165 gr to 200 gr bullets.

For Elk, I use the . 338 Rem Mag, for reasons cited above----it still gets the job done when things go wrong; But this is a subject that can get people pretty cranked up. , so all you 7mm and . 300 fans don't jump on me too much :>)



Some of my long time hunting friends have taken a ton of Elk with . 06s, . 300s and 7s, but an interesting thing happened in Elk camp last year. Four of us showed up and when the rifles came out, all four were . 338s. If you should get real carried away and decide to go for moose or Kodiac bear, you are still well armed.



Vaughn

 

[jandtjil]

Bullet placement. Smaller rounds as Whitmore points out just don't haul the mail at extreme distances, they are very capable at proper distances for the caliber.

FYI... My . 270 and I drew an early season, either sex Elk permit in CO this year, am loading the truck tomorrow night.

Man am I excited!

Good luck Mikel and enjoy whatever you buy

JJ

 

[ddesau]

caliber

I've used a . 270 for deer and Elk and now I'm shooting a . 30. 06 - it's a good choice as the recoil is not that bad and you have a lot of choices 150gr-220gr. Anyway, thats what I use. .

 

[Rob Thomas]

Nobody has mentioned . 300 Win. Mag. yet, I love this caliber, shells aren't to pricey, and are very common at general sporting stores. Great power, many weight choices, and minimal drop at farther range. I have it in a Weatherby Accumark Composite/Stainless. Just my . 02





Later, Rob

 

[jsnyder]

Rob,



I used to own a . 300 Winny, and it's a darned fine caliber. I found it curious though that most wannabe popular calibers are compared to the 30-06. My wife hunts with one, and after a while I found myself leaving the . 300 in the closet and taking the 06. Lighter to carry, cheaper ammo, and for all intents and purposes is just as effective for any reasonable hunting range.



For you folks that reload, the . 338-06 is absolutely wonderful. I own a Winchester in this caliber. Easy on the shoulder, cheap to reload, light to carry, and will tip over any game animal that walks North America. I have been incredibly impressed with this gun, although shot placement is still the number one key!



Jason

 

[jwdeeming]

Since this thread was started by a guy asking to learn, I have to comment about something. I won't try to tell you experienced shooters what you should do, but I also wouldn't send a new guy into the field worrying about taking 400 to 700 yard shots.



Bowhunting has ingrained in me the idea of getting close, so when I take up a rifle, I still think that way. I've shot a lot of deer, elk, and antelope with my 30-06, and have yet to reach out 200 yards. Over half my kills have been at less than 100 yards, and this includes 6 antelope - the 2 in Wyoming were at 100 and 120 yards.



I waited 7 years to draw an anteope tag for a trophy unit in Colorado. I was so worried about blowing my big chance that I fell for the "must shoot long distance" idea and used my Dad's 7mm Weatherby Mag with a 4x12 Leupold Gold Ring scope. It's a $1600 setup. What happened? I spotted the buck I wanted from over a mile away and, with a little bit of planning, a little luck, and a lot of walking and crawling, I shot him at 60 yards.



15 years ago, I bought a used Remmington 721 30-06 with a junky old 3-power Redfield scope. I reload for that gun and have plinked hundreds of rounds of offhand shooting through it. It has killed all my rifle deer, elk and antelope except two - about 30 animals. I think I'm a pretty good shot with that ol' gun, but I don't ever practice at over 200 yards and, speaking just for me, attempting any shot longer than that would be an unethical, hopeful lob.



I vote for boot leather and lots of practice.

Sorry for the rant - I feel better now