Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) MAD ECM and Comp Box???

[RacinDuallie]

RacinDuallie,

Oh yeah! I can't wait to hear of your time slips with that stack! Some big street slicks stuffed in those duallie fenderwells! Awesome!
But dont go and buy an Edge EZ, you already have one! Hook that Drag Comp back up and leave the pump wire hangin' off. The Redline will handle the fuel, the Comp the timing, and the Special will bring it all together.
The Special loves the big injectors and big boost you'll see at the strip.

ThrottleJockey-
Dang silly me!! You are absolutely right! Totally slipped my mind!!
Thanks for correcting my thoughts... .....

 

[RJPotts]

Well here's a new question.....

I will be getting the standard Catcher, and other than the exhaust, BHAF, and boost elbow it will be my ONLY mod. Until my warranty is up and I can save enough money for a new clutch.

-Will the standard MAD ECM with a "fueling only" box, some Mach5's, and an HT3B on bottom make more power???

or... ...

-Will the Special and a Comp make more power???

-Which one will be more driveable?? (this is the important question, if it ain't fun it ain't worth it)

What does it cost to upgrade from the Standard to the Special?



Thanks,

R. J.

 

[Clmsnow]

THat is a good question... what is the ost of the Special?? Do you need to send your ecm in and what is involved on installing this??

 

[darkhorse]

Well here's a new question.....

I will be getting the standard Catcher, and other than the exhaust, BHAF, and boost elbow it will be my ONLY mod. Until my warranty is up and I can save enough money for a new clutch.

-Will the standard MAD ECM with a "fueling only" box, some Mach5's, and an HT3B on bottom make more power???

or... ...

-Will the Special and a Comp make more power???

-Which one will be more driveable?? (this is the important question, if it ain't fun it ain't worth it)

What does it cost to upgrade from the Standard to the Special?



Thanks,

R. J.

Well... I'd sell the comp, get a normal CaTCHER & even with Mach 4's, you probably wouldn't see the need for a fueling box. I belive Bob W. is making over 400 hp that way with a DZ 14 turbo.

 

[darkhorse]

THat is a good question... what is the ost of the Special?? Do you need to send your ecm in and what is involved on installing this??

Installation is a snap except it's a bit difficult to get ones fingers in the right place. There is a single 50 pin plug held with a small allen screw & the body of the ECM is bolted to the block with 3 small hex bolts. Plug & play

 

[JRagland]

RJPotts,



I agree with darkhorse. I have the setup you are describing. Standard Catcher, exhaust, BHAF, and plugged wastegate (max boost 32#). It is extremely fun to drive. I am waiting on money to appear before the next level of mods which will be quite extensive. Clutch, turbo, Mach 4s, TST, fuel system.



You are in a good position. You haven't bought a Comp or EZ. So, you can start to build a truck with a standard catcher. The trouble comes from finding a combination of boxes and sticks to go well with a Special catcher without feeling like you have wasted money on a Comp or Catcher because you aren't getting the full benefit from the cost. That is where questions start to fly. You will not be disappointed with the standard catcher alone.



Edit: you have bought an EZ, never mind me.

 

[RJPotts]

Good stuff.

I would like to be in the 450-500 range when all is said and done.

I probably won't go bigger than Mach 4's. This won't be a serious race truck.

Basically what I want is a great all around, fun to drive, reliable, street truck that I can still tow with. I figured the ECM, Mach 4's or equivalent, a 3B on bottom o-ring the head and a clutch and be done with it. Maybe some water/meth.

I think I may invest in a RASP too.

-R. J.

 

[joaker]

Awesome thread guys!! Though I am still a bit unsure of on thing..... Which will net; a) Highest HP and b)Best driveability, or even both a&b, I presently have the Edge Drag box, and will likely have a Hotrod VP-44 by the end of next week, we have a blue chip waiting to be used, so will The "special" ecm stacked with the drag box be any better a) or b) than the bluechip stacked with the "un-special" ecm? I am aware of the bluechip's ability to increase the redline of the engine, but I am not really planning on playing with that too much, I hear parts start to come off at around 3800rpm..... so which combo will likely word best? I should have enough fuel, and boost is not an issue either, thanks for any help.....

 

[ThrottleJockey]

RJPotts,



Remember why the Special was created, for the guys running twin turbos... .



See, if you buy the Special, and team it with a timing box like a Comp, you can run big injectors and big boost (a set of twins)



The Standard CaTCHER has timing on it's own so running it with a Comp will advance timing too much... .



AND...



The Standard when teamed with a set of TWINS will create too much advanced fuel ignition. This is similar to advanced timing and the timing of the Standard will compound this event and she won't run so great on the top end.



Marco says that advanced fuel ignition is the result of (This is me translating what Marco said) a set of twin turbos 'stuffing a WHOLE lotta air into the CC and a big set of injectors dumpin' a WHOLE lotta fuel all at once (that's what big injectors do, right?) into the CC. (It takes a big set of injectors to spin a set of twins)



Well, all this oxygen and all this fuel ALL AT ONCE will advance your timing, and so will the Standard CaTCHER. Too much timing.



Hello Special.



joaker,



The highest HP will always be from a Special, that is why it was created. But not from the ECM itself, rather from the electronics and hardware it's compatible with.

When I want to run big boost, I'll change out my DD IIs to Mach 5s and put on my twins, I'll take the EZ OFF my Special. And then your Blue Chip box comes into play.

Drag racing (RacinDuallie) I'd run with the complete stack on one pass, and maybe take the timing off for another... RacinDuallie could tell you more about advanced timing on the quarter mile, I'm a sled puller...



sorry so long winded.

Brian

 

[joaker]

Thanks for the clarification... . Will the special work with a single though, I have a decntly large single, I can makes lots of boost (Up to 55 psi), would that be adequate ? I just realized the Bluechip box we have is the new Redline unit, which apparently does timing and fueling..... whereas the older FMS box did just fueling, so maybe the ECM would not be neccesary..... it is said that with the redline and a hot VP44 500hp is quite obtainable... . gotta see it... . thanks again.

 

[MBreyer]

I'm one of the junior members when it comes to my understanding on this topic, but I think I've got a thought.



Why stack boxes & the Mad ECM, if Marco's creation can do it by it's self?

I'll be selling my EZ, and using just the ECM. I figure this is simpler than risking interference using diferent products together.



Just my thoughts...



~Matt



(PS) I know this line of thought wouldn't apply to you guys w/ massive boost, it's just for me & my "daily driver, must be reliable & efficient vehicle. "

 

[Clmsnow]

So someone with a Comp and DDII's would want the special right??? AND, I am running a single. . HTBG. HOw much$$$$?

 

[DHayden]

So instead of getting the regular and switching to TST, I keep my comp (for now) and get the special since I'm planning on twins at some point? Then twins and TST with the special?

 

[ThrottleJockey]

DHayden,



You got it. That's what I'm gonna do...



Clmsnow



Yep. See, if your gonna continue to BOMB, the Special leaves room to grow in HP.



MBreyer



That's fine... . If you don't plan on changing to big injectors to push twins in the future.

The stack(Edge and the Special) is the same as the Standard. Same amount of timing. Same amount of hot rodding fun capacity. The only difference is the Special will push a set of twins.



joaker



Yes. I run right now a set of DD IIs and a PDR HX-40 16cm2 with an EZ and a Special. Your charger is bigger than mine. I STILL have a silly grin on my mug.



Another cool thing about the CaTCHER, I have an APPS problem, so I bought a new one but I havent installed it yet. My truck will stumble badly and belch blue white smoke at 1800 rpm and get stuck there until you let off the throttle.



The CaTCHER will overpower the APPS signal and just keep marching up the powerband. My emissions are clean again in traffic and the truck is fun to take to the grocery store again.

 

[RJPotts]

OK, I understand now.

My plan is to do twins, some big injectors and all the other fun stuff in the future also, so the Special is what I will need THEN.

For NOW I will need the Standard, until I have the clutch and injectors to work well with the Comp. I have a Comp sitting on my desk begging to tap that wire.

Here's the money question again though. And excuse me if its been answered.

What does it COST to reflash a Standard to a Special? Because that is what I will have to do in the future.



-R. J.

 

[RJPotts]

I just thought of another questions too.

How long do I have to send my ECM in for the core charge??? I'd like to keep it until the Cummins warranty is up just in case I need some work.

-R. J.

 

[ThrottleJockey]

I'm sorry, I didn't answer you the first time.



Check this out, the Special, with a Comp hooked to it, IS a Standard CaTCHER.



It will perfrom like a Standard, it just uses the Comp for it's timing.



Cool, right? When your ready for one, PM Bob Wagner. The core program is a thing of beauty. If you want to keep your old one, you'll have to buy an additional one for the trip to Italy.



Brian

 

[RJPotts]

Sorry so slow to reply, I had to go to the lake this whole weekend with the whole fam damly.

Sounds good. Well, that sounds good, but I don't want to keep my ECM for ever, just until my warranty is up, will they still take it say 2 or 3 months after the sale and still send me the core charge back?

Thanks,

R. J.

 

[ThrottleJockey]

I'm pretty sure they will, give Bob a call.



That dang on lake. Oh well, somebody's gotta go up there, dude. Might as well be you.

 

[RJPotts]

I just pondered a while on what you said in a previous post.

The Special with a Comp IS a standard. I'm assuming that means a Comp on Level 1 (Like an EZ).

At what level on the Comp does the timing with the Special exceed the timing of the Standard?

-R. J.