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Main Stream Nutritionists scoff at Atkins

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But the tide is turning. These are excerpts form an article in the New York Times on 7/7/02.

Incidently I lost 35 pounds doing Atkins.

The entire article is here, but it is long.



http://atkinscenter.com/Archive/2002/7/9-672214.html



TAKING A BRODY



Health Sciences Institute e-Alert



July 10, 2002



**************************************************************



Dear Reader,



This past weekend at Wimbledon, Venus and Serena Williams

dominated. They each advanced to the final round of the singles

championship (little sister Serena won it this year), and then

teamed up the next day to win the doubles title - once again.



I watched their doubles match as I browsed through the Sunday

New York Times. The cover story in the magazine was a new

chapter in another intense volley that's been going on for years

in the diet world.



This volley is Brody vs. Atkins. That is: Jane E. Brody, the

columnist who writes on health issues for the New York Times,

and Robert C. Atkins, M. D. , the author of "Dr. Atkins' Diet

Revolution. "



To say that these two have been adversarial is to put it mildly.

And now, suddenly, their face-off has taken a surprising and

unexpected turn that may leave Ms. Brody with some high-protein

egg on her face.



--------------------------------------------------------------

That was then

--------------------------------------------------------------



I should mention that Agora, HSI's parent company, has published

Dr. Atkin's newsletter in the past, so I've met and worked with

this pioneer of complementary medicine. Over the course of 30

years, Dr. Atkins has not wavered from his controversial dietary

ideas. In a nutshell, Dr. Atkins advises us to eat as much meat

and other high protein and high fat foods as we care to, while

avoiding starches and refined carbohydrates such as breads,

pasta, rice and sugars. This plan has won many millions of

readers, but has drawn numerous, often passionate attacks from

the nutrition and diet establishment.



Enter Jane E. Brody who has ridiculed the Atkins plan a number

of times through the years. In 1999 she wrote a column for the

New York Times, in which she scoffed at the diet and gleefully

quoted two nutritionists who said, "'The Atkins diet is

potentially so dangerous that the Surgeon General should

probably put a warning on every book Dr. Robert Atkins sells. "

Finally she dismissively pointed out that no researchers had

taken the "Atkins scheme" seriously (although she personally

knew four people who tried the diet and had problems with it -

apparently that was all the "research" she needed to form a

conclusion).



But that was then and this is now. And now Ms. Brody has the

opportunity to enjoy a meal of high-fat crow, made possible,

ironically, by the very newspaper she writes for.



--------------------------------------------------------------

Low-fat chickens come home to roost

--------------------------------------------------------------



The title of the cover story of the Sunday New York Times

Magazine (7/7/02) asks this question: "What if It's All Been a

Big Fat Lie?" The article's author, Gary Taubes, states that "a

small but growing minority of establishment researchers have

come to take seriously what the low-carb-diet doctors have been

saying all along. "



Notable among these researchers is Walter Willett, chairman of

the department of nutrition at the Harvard School of Public

Health. Willett, who is the spokesman for a long-running study

that includes data on almost 300,000 subjects, says that the

low-fat-is-good-health message is clearly contradicted by their

findings. Furthermore, it appears that the extreme focus on the

adverse effects of fat may have contributed to the huge upswing

of obesity in America.



In the 30+ years that the idea of the low-fat diet has become

gospel, the number of obese Americans has been steadily rising,

to the point that obesity is now being called an epidemic.

Meanwhile, the current NY Times article points out that the

Atkins diet may successfully address obesity by controlling

blood sugar levels and reducing the intake of empty calories.



--------------------------------------------------------------

Tables turned

--------------------------------------------------------------



In a letter published in the New York Times in 1999, Dr. Atkins

responded to the accusations of Ms. Brody, saying, "As a

practicing cardiologist, my work is based on helping patients.

What motivates Ms. Brody's hostility? She does a disservice to

millions who lead healthier lives on my program and to many more

who continue to embrace unproductive dietary programs thanks to

misinformation of the sort propagated by Ms. Brody. "



Perhaps this past Sunday's New York Times article has signaled

an important change in direction, moving the conventional wisdom

toward the close of an era of unproductive dietary programs and

misinformation. Ms. Brody stated correctly in 1999 that there

was as yet no major research available to support Dr. Atkins'

claims. I'm really looking forward to see how (or if) she'll

respond now that her own newspaper has delivered the news that

research results have started coming in - and she was wrong.



In 1886 a young newsboy named Steve Brodie jumped off the

Brooklyn Bridge and survived. For many years after, a leap from

the great bridge was referred to as "taking a Brodie. " Maybe the

term will be revived and the spelling updated and in 2002

"taking a Brody" will refer to the embarrassment of publicly

ridiculing someone who later turns out to be right.



**************************************************************
 
I took a lot of ribbing for doing it, but the Atkins diet lost me an honest 60 pounds two years ago. I took tests and blood pressure came down to normal, as did cholesterol and triglyceride (sp?) levels. And that happened while people looked at me crosseyed for not trimming the fat off my steaks!



But, I was excercizing too. Lately I've tried to knock off some more pounds with the same diet, but without the sweat, and it ain't working.



Sigh... Stairmaster, here I come. Oh well. Elk season is coming up and I needed to get in shape anyway!
 
I started it, but....

lost about 8 pounds and seemed to level off there. Problem was, it's not conducive to sports that require endurance and strength all at the same time. First time I had to "go off" the diet, I was a week and a day into it and out mountain biking. After about an hour or so on the trail, I just bonked. I was riding with a doctor who said I looked like I needed a power bar. I declined, figuring if I eased back a bit, I'd recover. Nope, another 15 minuts or so, and I was starting to feel a bit dizzy and tingly. Just the way my wife (a diabetic) describes it when her blood sugar goes low. So, this time, I accepted an offer of the power bar (I didn't take any to make sure I didn't cheat). 10 minutes and 45 carbs later, I was fine and rode another 40 minutes or so.



Not knocking the diet. It did seem to work and I did feel better sitting at my desk at work. Problem came when I jumped on the bike; just wasn't as strong after about 30 mins. So now, I'm just trying to watch my intake rations a little more closely, but not strictly and see how it goes while I put in miles on the road bike. I think a healthy diet with good exercise is best in the long run anyway.
 
The Atkins diet is the only thing I have tried that puts me in charge of how much I weigh. Let the main stream media complain about it all they want. No hunger, lower cholesterol and blood pressure are just a few benefits of this diet. I sleep better, have less heartburn and indigestion on this diet as well.



The disadvantages I have observed are:



-You have to cook nearly every time you want to eat.



-eggs every morning gets dull very quickly.



-giving up bread and potatoes is difficult.



-it seems to be a man's diet. Most women don't like meat, eggs and cheese as well as the guys.
 
hummmm... . Not sure about this diet, I've dropped around 50lbs in the last year by just eating reasonable amounts of food, cutting out things like french fries and generally keeping active..... I call it the eat good and get off your ass diet. It's not for everyone, but it works for me. I only have about 20lbs more to go before I get down to fighting weight (where I graduated high school at).



Morph.
 
Cut it out people. You are all going to live longer than the 'government' and 'elite intellectuals' can afford to keep you around.



Eat those fries, fatty foods, and smoke, drink and chase wild women like you are a Mass. Kennedy.
 
who said anything about cutting out booze, cigars and chasing women? I just cut out french fries... . I still eat steaks and everything else, just smaller portions and less greasy... . Oh yeah, one other important thing, I only eat when I am hungry (around 2 - 4 meals a day depending on activity level).



Morph.
 
Originally posted by Morphious

who said anything about cutting out booze, cigars and chasing women? I just cut out french fries... . I still eat steaks and everything else, just smaller portions and less greasy... . Oh yeah, one other important thing, I only eat when I am hungry (around 2 - 4 meals a day depending on activity level).



Morph.







hehehehehe, how do you think I stay at less than 190# and 12% body fat... ... and with only 3 hours a week at the gym, and 40 hours a week chasing skirts you can too!
 
it's NOT good

Look up Dr. Andrew Weil. He's not mainstream. I've read all his books and am thoroughly impressed with his credentials, experience, and approach to health.



Eat less + exercise more = less fat.



It really is that simple. ;)
 
I totally agree Wade. Dr. Weil has some of the best selling books around for 'Optimal Health'. That should make him mainstream. Don't even get me started on Atkin's:mad:



I've been down this road before and it's an uphill battle trying to convince the majority on the diet of a better means. All they see is where they are NOW, not HOW they got there (whether it was the best/safest/healthiest way or not). It's the wt. loss itself that is improving their health (blood pressure, cholesterol, etc. ). And it could have been done a much better way with the same or better results.



Here's one for you (one of many I have). If excessive ("all you can eat") greasy bacon, steak fat, and sausage is BAD for the person on the avg. diet (which it is), how can it all of the sudden be GOOD for someone on Atkin's? Hmmm.



..... Uh oh, I'm gettin' started.
 
WyoJim thanks for the post. I started on this Adkins about 3 weeks ago and have dropped 14 lbs so far. Feel allot better. I'm starting phase 2 now. Adkins has a good website, Phase 3, lots of good info.
 
I to have tried the Atkin's diet and it worked. I lost 12 lbs a year and a half ago and have been able to keep the pounds off. But, I did't like the restrictions on fruit, carbo's yes. With more research I came across the Paleo diet also called the cave man diet. So far I've lost another 13 lbs this year, only another 25 to go. How ever you do it, keep loseing.



Steve



http://www.paleodiet.com/
 
Walker... . If the plains indians weren't killed, they lived to be 90 to 100 years old, on meat and little or no greens. They did, and the museum in Miles City, MT has it pretty well documented. What does that say for your main stream pyramid diet?



Oleo with its plastic fat was invented around the turn of the century and sugar was pretty much unavailable except to the wealthy until the turn of the century. Then the first heart attack was documented around 1920 and now heart disease is our leading cause of death. What does that say about the main stream diet?



Dr. Weil must have a web site. Why din't you post the URL. I have been studying nutrition for over 10 years and I have never heard of him.
 
Crazy Horse... I went on a strict low fat main stream diet in 1990. At the same time I was spending all my free time horse packing into the Lee Metcalf Wildernes, sometimes nearly three months at a time. Hows that for exercise? I lost from 240 down to 200, but never got into real good physical condition, compared to the log jobs I had done previously.

I pretty much stayed on it until 2000, but I was going down hill fast. Didn't ride any more because I couldn't stand the exertion. Finally gave up low fat and began feeling better. But went up to 245. I decided if I had to go back to low fat and misery to lose it I was going to stay fat. Then I remembered the Indians at the museum in Miles City and began eating meat and vegetables, just like they did. I'm down to 208 and in better condition than when I was horse packing. And I don't exercise. My blood lipids are near perfect and all the time I had thought I was just getting old. Thats just what the main stream people want you to think and thats nonsense.

I'll be coming to Alaska in about a month, and I don't think I could have stood it last year.



You are on the right track, so read Atkin's books, lose weight and stay in shape to enjoy where you are fortunate enough to live. I just had people here from Wasilla for a couple of days. Their mainstay is salmon and moose. Boy, it don't get much better than that!!!
 
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OK. Here we go...

I just had to do it. I didn't want to post a reply cause I knew I'd get into a debate (why are the Atkin's zombies so touchy?). Just messin' with ya WyoJim.



First: My qualifications on the matter. 18 years in the health and fitness industry. I'd been a Certified Strength and Conditioning Specialist (CSCS) with the National Strength and Conditioining Association (NSCA) for several years, a Div. -1A university asst. strength and conditioning coach, an interim asst. strength and conditioning coach with an NFL team, a personal health and fitness/nutritionist for 11 years. [just wanted to give a basis for my future opinions].



Second: I'm not here to sell books for Dr. Weil. If you want to evaluate his information for yourself I'm sure there is plenty of info. on the web and at book stores.



But, I've gone over this in extreme detail before on another web site, HealthBoards.com. Here's the initial Atkin's topic I got involved with. I went by the screen name "LifeLine". You can read the debate between me and "Arkie6". There's a lot of good information (from me of course).



http://www.healthboards.com/ubb/Archives/Archive-000004/HTML/20011028-124-000345.html



I'm not in the field anymore, but it's still a passion of mine to "Educate the World". Well, it used to be. I just get fired up again from time to time.
 
Andrew Weil, MD

No matter how big his books get Dr. Weil is _not_ mainstream.



Off the top of my head: Andrew Weil got his degrees at Harvard. At some point he became unsatisfied with the CUT and DRUG method of doctoring in America. He traveled the world in search of alternative prevention and cures. He firmly believes in the power of the mind in causing, preventing, and curing ailments. He has worked with drug companies. He has studied not only by books and classrooms, but by seeing, touching, and doing-on a world-wide scale. His program of optimal health is not soley based on nutrition. It consists of mind, body, and soul. Relaxation through breathing and meditation, Exercise-walking is his favorite, and Conscious Consumption are the corners of his framework.



He has a website, but it is a Q&A setup-heavily bannered and slow. There is plenty of info there, but I recommend reading his books for a better idea of where he is coming from. Here's the link: http://www.drweil.com/app/cda/drw_cda.php



ON CARBOHYDRATES:



Modern Nutritionalists are only beginning to understand the true nature of carbohydrate metabolism. The leading book on the subject is "The Glucose Revolution". I have used this book to enhance my physical health and athletic performance. The basic concept centers on the "Glycemic Index". The GI destroys the old myths of "complex and simple carbohydrates". It just ain't that simple. Knowing when or whether to consume high or low GI foods is key to blood-sugar disorders, athletic performance, and general health. GI lists are published all over the web, but you need the book to help you understand what the list means and how to use it.



I am not a nutrition expert, but I have studied it fairly diligently and learned quite a bit. It is my body and I'm going to try to keep it healthy and out of the Doctor's office.



And I have read the Atkins book and used that approach. I do not approve of it. But you do what you want with your body.



It's still: eat less + exercise more = feel better, be healthier, look better. Pills, potions and dietary trickery are just that. :p
 
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You're right Wade. The GI index (initially created for diabetics) is a good thing to go by for everyone. If you stay with the 'complex' carbs on the chart, you will not affect insulin levels as drastically. Which (high levels) can move "EXTRA" calories into the fat cells (storage) more easily. The exercise more + eat less formula is adequate (generally speaking). You think those Plains Indians did a little more physical work than the common computer/couch spud of today? Mmmmaybe.



As for Dr. Weil being "mainstream"; there is so much diversity of beliefs (from so called experts) in the nutrition/diet world, that I don't think there even is a mainstream anymore. It's been cluttered with a bunch of infomercials and quick fix crap; and has more people confused than informed. But, if selling millions of books means he's reaching a certain group/numbers, then the term "mainstream" should just mean "popularity," of which there are several.



Dr. Weil is definitely "into" many other aspects of complete health, not just losing the ol' L,B's. Which is why I refered to his 'Optimal Health' regime. I even got a chance to meet him personally recently as a guest of a friend (not that this affects my opinions). But, unfortunately I'm not a practicioner of my knowledge (to Dr. Weil's suggestions) and just try to be a "moderate" of any and all things.
 
LifeLine... I am glad you posted the URL to that Atkin's debate. It took me an hour and 45 minutes to read it. You should read it from start to finish because you lost. It definately comes off Pro Atkins. I hope every one here takes the time to read it. Its a good testimonial for Atkins, no doubt about it.
 
. WyoJim-When you get up here I'd like to meet you. Email me if you get a chance and let me know when you'll be in Anchorage. Maybe we could have a carbo free beer:D
 
Wyo,

I didn't know personal opinion was a contest to "lose. " Even though so called 'science' has pages of info. to support both sides (pro/con). You can just pick the side you want to believe, it's a free country. Besides, did I lose because fewer people agreed with me vs. the Atkin's clan, or from the guy that said he "wrecked his gallbladder" on the diet?



I knowingly got involved with the discussion as the minority. Just tryin' to help a few folks get both sides before making a decision. I don't know too many that buy a product from getting only one bid.



Funny, I don't feel like I lost, I get to eat all the carbs I want :D .
 
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