Mike's steering brace

[Simms]

Here is another steering brace/stiffner available by Mike's Fab Shop. Features CAD plated nut, double powder coated finish, and a stainless steal salt resistant bearing with a lifetime warranty.



His kit will work for stock trucks, as well as trucks using the drop sway bar brackets from 5" lift kits. On some trucks using the drop brackets, he removed the drop brackets and flipped the sway bar. This is just a personal preference.



This pic is of Mike's truck with his custom steering, bag suspension, and sway bar. (2500 Cummins)

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Pics of the kit on a 5. 5" Fabtech lift with a 3" spacer, sway bar flipped. (360 1500)

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A stock 2500.

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Setup itself.

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I'll be able to give you guys further information and pictures by the end of the weekend. As well as a website where this stuff can be purchased using credit card, money order etc. Mike's Fab Shop is located in Carlisle, PA. For pricing and further questions or fab work, email Mike at -- email address removed --.

 

[Josparkz]

Looks interesting.

 

[JR2]

No offense ment here, but that looks an awful lot like the one in the other thread that aparently has a patend. The guy making these may want to check that out.

 

[Simms]

Originally posted by JR2

No offense ment here, but that looks an awful lot like the one in the other thread that aparently has a patend. The guy making these may want to check that out.

I'm not sure he is aware of the other design. As far as I can tell, its a different bearing, DOM tubing is used vs. box tubing, and the bracket assembly is different. But I am no expert on the rules.



I know this concept has been used on Baja trucks for years.

 

[JTMcCracken]

You and I are not expert on the rules, but rest assured there are bloodthirsty lawyers cruising the streets that are.

JTMcC.

owner, 1st Rate Fabricators and not affiliated with any steering brace whatsoever.

 

[illflem]

With the high cost and long wait involved I highly doubt Darien's brace is patented. I've seen braces similar to both of these for at least 25 years on offroad rigs, in fact I remember an old 4wheeler magazine that had plans for one. If someone decides to start digging up patents both Mike and Darien could be in trouble.

 

[JR2]

Well look at this in the other post. At some point in there somone asks if its patented, the reply (last post for that page) says Yes it is. That is all I know.



Who knows if it even matters, this one is somewhat different although the theory is the same.

 

[Simms]

Well here are my thoughts. Who knows who really has what patented. Maybe they both are, one in US and one in Canada, who knows. I don't think it really matters, they are two different looking pieces. Sure they are similar, they have to be, they are performing the same function. But it is also clear the idea/concept has been around and used for years. Whether its a machined nut, or a longer steering box shaft.



Lets look at traction bars. Rancho, RCD, Fabtech, L&L, ProComp, Whiplash, Fabritech, etc. , they all have them. And a lot of them are very similar and nobody seems to be infringing on any patents. If they are patented, its for their particular look and setup, not their purpose.



How about adjustable trac bars, DT and Skyjacker both have them, VERY SIMILAR, but nobody seems to be complaining.



Both guys are supplying a product to solve a problem for us. I doubt either one is going to suffer business because the other one exists. Let the consumer worry about which one he wants to buy. Hell, I don't care if 50 companies make them, I'm going to buy the one I want. Just like a lift kit.

 

[Simms]

I just found out on anothe site that some guys are just buying the bearing and nut form Daren, and fabbing up their own bracket.

 

[JTMcCracken]

"Who knows who really has what patented" ? the patent office keeps cubic tons of information and they most certainly know. "I don't think it matters" as I said, it matters to those cutthroat lawyers who make their living this way. "I don't care if 50 companies make them" If someone holds a patent you can be assured that they care... a lot. No offense directed to you but in the case of a lawsuit, you, or me, won't be called in to give our expert opinion. I have seen companies much, much larger than mine put out of business due to patent infringement. This is not something to just blow off and take lightly. I don't know anything about who does or doesn't have a patent on these steering box braces but I do know that patents are taken seriously by the courts. I don't know anyone involved in making or selling either of these products by the way. Just throwing my 2 bits in about patent violation, and I don't even know if a patent is involved here! Have a good weekend!

JTMcC.

 

[Marv Windecker]

Hmmm...



Just speculating at this point, but it would seem he was well aware of our design since absolutely everything is different in some way. To me, this says that he is trying to get around any patents by changing everything to some degree. Such as: Round vs square tubing, 4 wrench flats instead of hex, different mounting plates, "double powder coat", stainless bearing, etc.



"they are two different looking pieces"

What some people are thinking of is an industrial design patent, which covers a specific embodiment of a product. An example would be the shape of a grille or exact design of a disposable lighter, or the exact design of our (or his) steering brace. Irregardless of this industrial design stuff, any underlying patents must still be considered.



"But it is also clear the idea/concept has been around and used for years. " No, that is most certainly not clear. They were not offered for sale anywhere and I doubt anyone on this forum had anything like it on their pickup or had even thought about anything other than a new box. There are steering box braces for Jeeps, but of all the designs we've seen, they support the box itself, and not the sector shaft. IF it was an old idea, it would have been in common use already. Companies are *always* looking for a new gadget to sell. Additionally, patent searches turned up nothing.



Darin's patent covers the concept of adding an additional bearing outboard of the pitman arm to support the sector shaft and eliminate sector shaft play/flex. Doesn't matter what it looks like. New idea, new concept. 20 years from now, people can argue the fine points of their industrial design patents regarding round vs square.



"Who knows who really has what patented. Maybe they both are, one in US and one in Canada" There is a little thing called an international patent treaty that gives a patent applicant the option to apply for patents in almost every country in the world and the original filing date is what counts.



"some guys are just buying the bearing and nut form Daren, and fabbing up their own bracket. " We are free to sell them and anyone is free to make one for their personal use. Patent law has always allowed this. We are just trying to help out some customers who weren't able to use one as is; primarily because they had a lift kit with sway bar drop brackets that already had a crossmember between them.



"Lets look at traction bars. " Ok. There *were* patents granted long ago for your typical traction bar concept (nowadays an old concept). Those patents are now expired on that concept. Again, all that's left are industrial designs if anyone cares to bother.

Regarding track bars, the original patent on the concept of a track bar, ( once again ) has long since expired. Anyone is free to make them as long as they don't infringe on someone's industrial design. And anyone is free to apply for an industrial design patent on a specific bar/mount arrangement.



"Both guys are supplying a product to solve a problem for us. I doubt either one is going to suffer business because the other one exists" Maybe not, but in civilized countries, we have patent laws to protect one's ideas and to give one the right to try and make a living from those ideas. If not for patent protection, why should anyone bother to design anything if someone else takes the idea? You said "either". What if it's not just two, but 50? That will certainly hurt us (especially if large companies started).



Just to clarify things, Darin's brace is "Patent Pending. "



It looks like the man does nice work, and I'm hoping he wasn't aware of Darin's patent.



Thanks,

Marv

 

[Simms]

Marv,



Like I said before, I don't know the rules. I was just giving my thoughts. I'm a consumer, not a manufacturer or lawyer.



That was some nice explaining you did there, but I have to disagree on one thing. The concept HAS been around for years, like other people have seen. And the concept of supporting the shaft is what I am refering to. Lee Manufacturing (I think in California) has been bracing steering shafts for a long time. I'm not positive if they used a machined nut with bearing, or a longer steering shaft itself with the bearing attached to that. But the concept has been around, may not have been mass produced, but around. I'm not referring to the steering box itself being braced, that doesn't really solve the steering problem here. But in the Baja world, its an old design.



I understand why people patent things. All I was saying if TWO guys made it, they probably wouldn't run each other out of business (throwing patents out the window). Obviously if large manufacturers started producing it, the little man would suffer. The 50 coment was not directed to the coment of puting people out of business. That coment is to support the idea of the consumer buying which ever kit he wants based on quality, appearance, cost, availability, customer service, etc. Just like the freedom to chose whatever lift you want out of the numerous manufacturers.



I understand the selling of the bearings and so forth by them selves because of the drop brackets with supports (Which is Dick Cepeks drop brackets). That is fine with me, I don't care, just a statement for others information.



"Just speculating at this point, but it would seem he was well aware of our design since absolutely everything is different in some way. To me, this says that he is trying to get around any patents by changing everything to some degree. Such as: Round vs square tubing, 4 wrench flats instead of hex, different mounting plates, "double powder coat", stainless bearing, etc. "



I doubt there is any way to prove if one guy knew of the others guys exact "Industrial design. " They do look different. So is a patent being violated here???



"Patent Pending", that great for him. I'm sure Darin would be glad to show patent information/proof and so forth with Mike's Fab Shop if something is being violated here. Let them worry about it.

 

[Simms]

If interested, you can find additional information at http://mikesfabshop.com

 

[Pit Bull]

Got this off the web site posted but it states that Darin gave this fellow permission to make this part?



"Welcome to Michael’s Design and Fabrication You can now purchase my Steering Stiffener that Marv and Darin (The makers of the Darin bracket) has giving me permission to make on line, Just click on ON-LINE CATELOG. The cost will be $205. 00 bare $225. 00 powder coating black $250 custom painted color of your choose using the paint code that you provide. Shipping and handling will be $20. 00 in the continental US. The steering brace will come with stainless steel Seal Master CR bearing, clear cad plated sector shaft nut to prevent rust and Holo-Krome mounting hardware. The brace will fit 94-2002 Dodge ram 4x4 and is made of ¼ wall DOM tubing and ¼ plate. 2wd and 3rd Generation truck will come available in the next month or two. I will need to know if you are or planning to run drop down brackets for your sway bar. Please fill free to email or call me with any questions. 717-486-8787"

 

[Simms]

Must have been a patent issue.