My 04.5 oil analysis question

[rotts4u]

I just did my first oil analysis on my CTD and there are a few items that looked a bit high to me. The truck has 18000 miles and this oil was in for 5000 miles with a FRAM oil filter (I know its not the best but it didnt cause these readings)



The oil was Valvoline prem blue 15-40.



Iron=49

copper=9

silicon=11

boron=185

sodium=9

silver=1. 3 over limit

aluminum=18 also over limit

potassium=40 this one was over limit according to the report

moly=193

phosphorous=1777

magnesium=25

water<. 1%

Fuel<1%

glycol=neg

TBN 12. 35

LEM soot. 41%

vis 14. 5 or SAE grade 40



I am very familiar with oil analysis for gas engines but not the diesel, so I am hoping someone can comment on the high metals. Everything else looks good.



The truck is towed about 10k miles with 4-5k lb trailer and it does have a fuel box on it if that matters.



Thanks for your comments in advance



Don



zinc=1884

calcium-

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

All your wear metals look about 3 times as high as they should with that many miles on the oil...

 

[mberry]

rotts4u,



I would say most of your problems are caused by that Fram oil filter. Just my opinion of course, but I would not use one when a Fleetguard can be found easily. Using good oil and a bad filter kind of defeats the purpose.



Again, just my opinion.



p. s. is your username in reference to the dog breed?

 

[Snow man]

Jeez,get that POS Fram filter off that truck now before it ruins your engine,and your left with no warranty. I run fleetguard Stratopore 3894 ,and never had any hi readings. Id start changing your oil more often and sample again for starters.

 

[MichaelWright]

Who did the oil analysis? I know that the newer engines (EPA), will show higher numbers compared pre emmission type motors, 02 and earlier. I would give Cummins a call, or find a good big truck diesel shop and run the numbers by them. They look fine to me, but that is comparing it to a 550 Cat, which I had similar concerns about after my first oil report. Some of the odd numbers may also be caused by the Valvoline oil. I would switch over to Rotella or Dello oil, and lose the fram filter. I get the Fleetgaurd Stratopores from my dealer for $8 a pop, and a 6 gallon case of Rotella for $31 at Sam's Club.



Mike

 

[klenger]

I'm not very knowledgable on thie subject, and I know the Fram filter is not recommended because they can fail under high pressure and clog the oil galleys, but other than that, how would a cheap oil filter cause high metal content? The oil filter doesn't cause engine wear. Is it because of increased abrasion caused by not filtering the contaminants?



I suspect there may be more to rotts4u's problem than just a cheap filter.

 

[Buzzer]

I'm not very knowledgable on thie subject, and I know the Fram filter is not recommended because they can fail under high pressure and clog the oil galleys, but other than that, how would a cheap oil filter cause high metal content? The oil filter doesn't cause engine wear. Is it because of increased abrasion caused by not filtering the contaminants?



I suspect there may be more to rotts4u's problem than just a cheap filter.

I totally agree. The filter is not the issue here. Something else is going on to cause those over limit readings. Best to start to document this issue. JMO

 

[Kirwin]

cheap filters

Unless the Fram filter has come apart and clogged a piston cooling nozzle :--) Lets hope thats not the case! You could cut it open and check it if you still have the filter. I run Preimum Blue 15W-40 and I've never had an issue. Ken Irwin

 

[Gauthier]

Looks like a coolant leak to me. Wear metals are way too high for an ISB with 5000 miles on the oil.



I see a lot of 3rd gen CTDs with high potassium.

 

[Tomeygun]

I just started using Synthetic Rottella Blue 5w-40



What company should I use for the oil analysis?

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I've had very satisfactory and consistent results with Blackstone - but they are expensive compared to CAT, which seems equally reliable at half the price...

 

[nanook]

I ran the oil analysis lab in Alaska for CAT for 3 years, heres my 2 cents..... Resample, you don't have to drain all of the oil just draw enough for a sample, you need to build trend line and with this being the first sample don't get overly excited... yet...

Resample for comparison, its inexpensive. You might also consider sampling on a specific interval for the next few times (ie every 2000 miles or some such number)

 

[rotts4u]

The oil analysis was done by Analysts Inc in Atlanta, GA . They are a large firm with several labs and I have used them for hundreds of tests that I did for motorcycle oil articles I wrote for some magazines a few years back. I have always gotten very reliable data from them even when they got blind samples that were sometimes duplicated without them knowing about it.



I think I will retest in 2-3k as suggested



Don

 

[tractorseller]

Fram oil filters

Bought one at Wal Mart last week for my 05. Haven't done my first oil change yet, but now I'm scared to put this thing on. I have to admit that I've always used Fram, Pennzoil, Lee, or Wal Mart brand filters on my vehicles (whatever was on sale at the time - that's what I learned to do when I was a kid and never questioned it until now). I guess I haven't kept any of the vehicles long enough to do any damage . I'm surprised at what I'm reading on other parts of this website about the engine damage on CTDs caused by inferior filters though, so I think I may take this back and start using Fleetguards so I can sleep better at night.



I'm running Rotella 10-40 too - so please don't tell me it will destroy my engine . I know it stinks, but it reminds me of my childhood in Texas when I smell it .

 

[MichaelWright]

Tommeygun,



Your in St Louis? Just across the river, over in Troy IL, exit 18 off of I-55/70/270 is a Speedco Truck Lube. They are right next door to, I think, a Petro TS on the East side service drive. If you feel like taking a trip, they do oil analysis while you wait. I think it around $25 for the test with a nice printout. They are open from 7am-11pm, 7 days a week, here is there #(618) 667-7811



Just thought I would let you know.



Mike

 

[bpenrod]

Tractorseller,

Is thatr 15W40 or 10W40, I didn't think the 10W40 was Diesel rated but Imay be mistaken.

 

[rblomquist]

Re-test for sure. No matter how good a lab is they're still occasionally going to contaminate a sample, get bottles missmatched etc.

 

[nickleinonen]

are the silicon, boron and sodium normal numbers for these engines??? and what about the silver in that report?



at work, when we see sodium [GE & EMD] we start looking for water leaks, but it could be rainwater sitting in the engine Vee and leaking in from headframe gasket [crankcase under low vacuum whine running under load]... when we see boron, we know we have an internal engine water leak, as we use borate-nitrate [shows as boron on sample] as our corrosion inhibitor in our cooling water, and that number to me would be condemed lube oil... and silver shows to our EMD engines piston pin bearing wear... the silicon seems high too [20ppm is condemed if i remember right for emd&ge engines]



i know the engines at my work don't share much in common other than choice of fuel, but who knows...

 

[tractorseller]

Tractorseller,

Is thatr 15W40 or 10W40, I didn't think the 10W40 was Diesel rated but Imay be mistaken.

15-40 is what I meant... ... ... . that's what happens when I'm in a hurry... ... ... or maybe it's the onset of alzheimer's .

 

[WNowlan]

Oil Analysis Lab

I just started using Synthetic Rottella Blue 5w-40



What company should I use for the oil analysis?

Tommygun, I would recommend CTC they do a good job. I have a lot customers using them for a variety of equipment and oils (300+ samples a month. )