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Need AC Advice

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R

Gauges Acting Weird?

  • ronalddragon
  • Replies: 2
J

Won't start after it warms up

  • jimscummins
  • Replies: 1
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RWherley said:
Where can I get one of these Horton fan hubs?
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The hub is available from Horton. EC 450 is used on our trucks and Frieghtliners.

The issue will be the wiring harness. Those are no longer made. And they have no stock. Been down that road recently. LOL Also the blades are no longer available.
 
BSchwarzli said:
What changes in the two valves? Spring pressure?
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The expansion valve is just an aluminum block with a plastic orfice tube. The one you bought with the fitting on the wrong side is common for the conversion kits. It is wrong. Most suppliers of the kits have been told about that issues. You bought one from a local store. So his listing for replacement is wrong also. He should be able to cross the number I posted to get you the correct expansion valve.

The orffice size is bigger on the 134 expansion valve.
 
Ok so is the plug that goes into the hub a common plug i can buy and make a wire harness with? can a dodge fan or after market fan be put on the hub, or what year freight shaker where these hubs used on so I can look for junkyard fans?
 
I installed a Horton on a previously owned '92 D350 and ran it towing a 29' Hitchhiker II 5th wheel for over 50k miles with the OEM fan blades even though it was not recommended. I checked the fan regularly for cracks, but found none during the time I drove the truck with the Horton. When I traded for a new '97 3500, I sold the Horton to another TDR member who owned a '93 D350. He also ran the OEM fan blades for a long time. The Horton cured my engine's high coolant temperature problem when towing.

Bill
 
Yeah I know others running the 91-93 fan and it seems to be holding together.

The wiring harness is not so simple. You will have a challenge finding the sensors (still not found the AC one yet), the main harness has integrated feedback diodes to prevent damage on the on/off spikes, the harness has a few random loops in it that I have yet to figure out but they are clearly there for a reason, etc. But I am sure you can figure out the diode and make a simple harness that would work for your application.
 
BSchwarzli said:
Yeah I know others running the 91-93 fan and it seems to be holding together.

The wiring harness is not so simple. You will have a challenge finding the sensors (still not found the AC one yet), the main harness has integrated feedback diodes to prevent damage on the on/off spikes, the harness has a few random loops in it that I have yet to figure out but they are clearly there for a reason, etc. But I am sure you can figure out the diode and make a simple harness that would work for your application.
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I did some reading on the wiring for those Horton fans. That protection diode they are talking about is a one way diode. Its just a protection for feed back when the fan kicks off. Any one way diode should work for that. It would be placed into the main power feed close to its connection point. Think of a one way diode as a gate. It allows power to only flow one way. In this case you power the circuit. It stops any feed back to the circuit supplying the power.

I need a Horton after converting to 134. I'll list up what it takes to make a wiring harness like Horton supplied with the fans in its kit. What I will use will be over the counter parts. I will most likely use a relay to control the fan also. That takes the load off the sensors. The way Horton did it was to supply power to the sensors. When the sensor closed it would supply power to the clutch. The clutch is rated for four amp draw. A relay has almost no amp draw on the relay coil. This way extends the life of the sensors. Horton used two wire sensors. Using the relay allows the use of a single wire sensor. They would be normaly open. When it closes it would be the ground for the relay pull in coil. On the engine temp side a sensor for a idiot light would work. Just find one with the temp you want for the fan to come on at. These single wire idiot light sensors have been around for ever. They can be had in many different close temp points.

Now on the A/C side I have to do some home work. The biggest issue I see is getting a fitting into the A/C line for the sensor. I still have some hose work to do on my truck. I'll tackle that when I bleed the system down.
 
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Are guys just haveing the AC issues with 134 after doing it them selves or haveing a shop do it they have been retrofitting 134 into R 12 systems for a long time with no issues so im not shure why everyone is haveing trouble . If you need to know a shop that does it let me know i have names . Also note R12 is avalible its just exspensive there is also the alternative Free zone that claims to be a replacement for R12 .
 
DVolk said:
....they have been retrofitting 134 into R 12 systems for a long time with no issues so im not shure why everyone is haveing trouble.....
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Perhaps THIS writeup by Tecumseh (a major manufacturer of A/C compressors) regarding the requirements for converting from R12 to R134a will explain the process more thoroughly.

Rusty
 
I did my own conversion. I installed a compressor rated for 134. I replaced the expansion valve with a 134 valve. I have half the hoses converted to barrier hose. I'll address the rest of the system pretty soon.

What everyone is seeing on conversions is our condensers are to small. At low speeds or stopped in traffic the high side pressures are going threw the roof. For those low speed or stopped apps you need to provide air flow across the condenser. A larger condenser will help also.

That's why Roberts truck popped the high side safety when idling that time.

Right now I don't use A/C below 30 MPH until I get a few things installed on the truck.

Most A/C shops will just clean the system out. Replace the oil. Fill the system. Then send you down the road. Anything after that is just more money repairing the system. They are not going to take the time to find fixes for any problems. When they refill the system with 134 you can see the high pressures on the gages if you don't have a fan in front of the grille. Just a little 20" house hold box fan drops high side pressures over 100 PSI on a 90 degree day.

P.S. if you see them put a fan in front of the grille. They know of the problem all ready. Plus you can bet they are waiting for you to return and donate to the pay more next time club.
 
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Philip

I've got the original booklet with installation instructions along with my hand written installation notes. IIRC the actual wiring harness was for a '93 but the instructions were for 2nd gen Dodge trucks. If you would like a copy PM me with your address and I will make a copy for you. BTW I do not have a scanner or copier so I cannot send them to you.

Bob
 
What can I say Robert. You gave me a good number for that Horton clutch. So I got lucky and found a spec sheet for it. :-laf

Now I noticed one thing going threw that spec sheet. They show two clutches with the same number. Is yours the standard or compact model??
 
I think this is the reason a lot of the manufactures all went to electric fans for when the ac is running the fan runs for instance the 454 gms have a electric fan on the grill side to aid in cooling
 
A pusher fan is all well and good if you have the room to put it in there, but add a 2nd gen intercooler and space gets real thigh.
 
Even with a stock IC it is tight for an electric fan. The thinnest I have found by spec is around 1.75". From what I can see it would be border line if it would fit. The Horton is a better option I think. Now I have a number and know our fan blades fit it. I'll find one and throw it on. The wiring is no big deal to me.
 
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Digital Magazines
FREE!
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Back Issues
Subscription Status
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