Need to swap 2WD for 4WD

[slowmover]

Gravel uphill is the only problem I’ve encountered as I wouldn’t DREAM of driving this truck in snow or ice. It appears manual or air locking rear may be a solution.

4WD or 2WD:

500# is a minimum. That’s “empty”. Up to 1k doesn’t much affect my fuel mileage, but it’s flat terrain compared to yours.

If you’re going to get a different truck then keep the weight and try different ways of getting up that hill or hills.

Locker (as said above) isn’t a good idea.

Pennsylvania doesn’t lack for truck scales. CAT SCALE is a chain associated.

The SHERLINE scale is a tool you’ll be glad to have. Aim at TW being center-of-range (2k scale puts 1k halfway).

But it’s not the same as setting a WD hitch. Here’s some starter:

https://www.rvlifemag.com/taking-the-mystery-out-of-torsion-bars/

https://www.rvlifemag.com/understanding-ball-mount-angle/

1). Adjust the hitch ball height to 'level' the trailer

2). Adjust the weight distributing bars to 'level' the tow vehicle.

3). Adjust the hitch head angle to 'level' the bars.

At end of this rough-in, trailer should be dead-level for best braking and preventing tire side slip (load on both axles closer to equal). Not nose down.

At the scale:

How to Determine FALR

1). “If you want to use the scales data to determine tongue weight, and if you want to get the maximum information about your TV/TT combination and how well your weight distrtibution system is working, you need data from three weighings. Second and third weighings usually are done at a lower cost.

And, you need to find a scales with at least three separate weighing platforms so you can separately measure all three axle loads at the same time. Most, perhaps all, CAT scales have this feature.


First, the TV and TT should be loaded approximately as they would be for camping.

Second, the weight distribution system should be adjusted as it normally would be for towing.

Then, I would do the following:

Weighing #1 -- TT attached and Weight Distribution Activated
Let Front Axle Load be "FA1"
Let Rear Axle Load be "RA1"
Let TT Axles Load be "TT1"

Then, while in same position on scales, take
Weighing #2 -- TT attached and Weight Distribution Not Activated (WD bars unloaded, but hanging in place)
Let Front Axle Load be "FA2"
Let Rear Axle Load be "RA2"
Let TT Axles Load be "TT2"

Then, drive off scales and drop TT. Return to scales and take
Weighing #3 -- TV only -- TT Not Attached
Let Front Axle Load be "FA3"
Let Rear Axle Load be "RA3"

From the above values, you can calculate:

TV weight = FA3 + RA3

Gross Combined Weight = (FA1 + RA1 + TT1)
{should also be equal to (FA2 + RA2 + TT2) if scale weights are correct}

TT Weight = Gross Combined Weight - TV Weight

Tongue Weight = (FA2 + RA2) - (FA3 + RA3)

Load Transferred to TT Axles
when WD System is Activated = TT1 - TT2

This procedure should get you on and off the scales fairly quickly and still provide all the data you need.”

Afterwards (however many adjustments needed):

A. The combined rig will stop faster 30-0 than the truck loaded same will solo.

B. The feeling going down the road is that it’s on rails.

C. Find lockup point on loose surface at low speed with observer and adjust brake control to avoid lockup till later.

Keep the printed scale ticket with notes on final rigging adjustment. Future changes will be minor.

Adjust tires to value required. Not too high.

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[AH64ID]

Man, you’re full of it. Used to be helpful years ago. Fall far short of it now.

I’ve taken trucks in the oilfield, not AWD, where I guess you’d piss your pants. Hub-high mud. 2WD DRW & trailers loaded to 32k then Pete’s and other tractors with heavy loads. Can’t see the road for the water. Not every driver made it.

Been all over this country far more than you’ll ever go with non-4WD in every weather imaginable.

The OP may wish to ck fundamentals as noted. His single problem is steep gravel as he stated. The rest of what I wrote stands as is. Do some testing.

4WD wasn’t common. At all. Yet America somehow got built without it. You cite Wikipedia, I was there.

The load on a tire is fundamental. Called, “ground pressure”. An empty truck — any kind — is the one that gets into trouble with traction.

4WD is great for getting started. That’s about it.

Do yourself a favor and block my posts. There’s nothing you’ve said has helped the OP take apart and analyze what his current truck can and cannot do.

You don’t care about expense. Maybe he does.

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More psychobabble….

You don’t even read or comprehend other people posts, you simply like to rant about things that aren’t correct or relevant. Time to find a different hobby, for the sake of TDR members who don’t know any better about your reputation here. Those who do just ignore you, yet it’s getting old.

 

[Darkbloodmon]

I say this with bittersweet sarcasm, its always a "treat" when a thread derails or devolves into subjective opinions about OP's setup or intent behind a question or comment. I myself need to be more aware of it when responding to posts and others would benefit the same I think.

This to say if we can just answer the question and then move the back and forth of "Who's truck is best truck, or I know alot more than you from x y z experience or testing, etc" to another thread and not clutter a simple question we'd be better off.

.02 : I'll avoid responding to threads at 3 am since im not all there.

 

[Tuesdak]

Gravel uphill is the only problem I’ve encountered

It’s with that sand in place that I recently lost traction coming up my steep gravel driveway upon return from a trip pulling the trailer.

I owned a 2003 2WD 6 speed truck similar to yours. You will never see better MPG than it gets you. As noted 4x4 reduces MPG. The clutch is an extra "skill" with 2WD on slick surfaces.

X2 to the above: Sounds like the trailer was too light on the hitch lifting the rear wheels loosing traction.

My current 2018 (4x4) has the anti-spin rear diff and something I prefer to have vs. an open diff. Getting things moving is generally the only problem I have had with 2WD. Thus my preference for the rear to be able to be the two driven wheels. It's a different driving style.

I am not 100% clear if this is the only reason you want a 4x4. Some others on here go as far as to chain up their trailer tires to hit some serious trails. If that's what you are doing...

Frugal, is to look over your setup and make a list of solutions in order of cost. Is a different RV like a camper an option? With full weight on the rear wheels traction should not be a problem.

I would recommend a NEW 4x4 pickup if you decide to get one. You have Lemon Law protection, no one's beat it, neglected it, bailing wire and duct taped a major repair, etc. With the resale value of used pickups being insane high, unless a low mile deal shows up, IMO it's not worth "used".

Going from a 2003 MT to a 2018 Auto is enough to give you whiplash in how much improvement there is from interior to the warrantied stock power levels.

The Power Wagon is now offered with the Cummins Option. Something to consider with the 4x4 direction you are thinking about.

 

[AnonEd]

AFAIK for 2025 the Power Wagon is still 6.4 Hemi only. The Rebel HD does offer a Cummins, but it's not the same suspension as a PW, doesn't offer winch option on the diesel, no front locker, etc.

 

[AH64ID]

AFAIK for 2025 the Power Wagon is still 6.4 Hemi only. The Rebel HD does offer a Cummins, but it's not the same suspension as a PW, doesn't offer winch option on the diesel, no front locker, etc.

The confusion is that the Rebel is technically the Power Wagon Rebel, but it has all the differences you mentioned.

 

[slowmover]

More psychobabble….

You don’t even read or comprehend other people posts, you simply like to rant about things that aren’t correct or relevant. Time to find a different hobby, for the sake of TDR members who don’t know any better about your reputation here. Those who do just ignore you, yet it’s getting old.

I’m not the one making personal attacks. Project much?
What I post can be tested. Every time.
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[slowmover]

I owned a 2003 2WD 6 speed truck similar to yours. You will never see better MPG than it gets you.

The clutch is an extra "skill" with 2WD on slick surfaces.

X2 to the above: Sounds like the trailer was too light on the hitch lifting the rear wheels loosing traction.

Getting things moving is generally the only problem I have had with 2WD.

Thus my preference for the rear to be able to be the two driven wheels. It's a different driving style.

I am not 100% clear if this is the only reason you want 4x4.

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Yes.

(Must be an echo).

Getting started one thing. Keeping underway, another.
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[AH64ID]

I’m not the one making personal attacks. Project much?
What I post can be tested. Every time.
.

Simply pointing out your disinformation, if you choose take it personally then go for it.

You’re the one who enjoys telling TDR how wrong we all are for how we use our trucks and spend our money, that’s a personal attack on the forum users.

Some of the stuff you post is valuable, but often there is disinformation imbedded that discredits the rest of the information.

 

[slowmover]

Try again. Numerical baseline is industry-standard method, not just common-sense. Fuel burn or hitch rigging, braking & steering efficiency, rollover-propensity. or matters associated. Traction, in this thread. A test or tests.

A 4WD with off-road tires?
Now it’s handicapped for the highway.
Pulling a trailer long distance “appears” to be primary mission. Bad set-up for distances.

The OP can do a few tests if that suits. As a trailer on only a bumper hitch up a graveled slope can/will unload the drive axle. TW ain’t a constant value. Nor is it payload.

The laws in physics haven’t been repealed. Center-of-gravity, roll center height, tire side slip angle. No such thing as having it both ways. 4WD is a penalty in search of a buyer, generally. Needs to fit use. “Convenience” is want, not need.

What percent of total engine time is spent in 4WD?
That’s an easy place to start. Just because the herd heads over the cliff is no reason to follow.

If it is, put the mask back on and go get the next booster shot.

If general analysis of vehicle use vs spec hurts feelings, same thing . . . .

“Disinfo” is ignoring or denying that testing has validity.
It’s cheap, it’s easy, and it maybe requires a library book or two. Formula = Prediction. One can find the limits of formulas, remember. SAE J2807 has them large enough to drive through. But you’ll have to test.

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[bcbender]

What percent of total engine time is spent in 4WD?

What percent of total engine time is spent in 4WD?
That’s an easy place to start. Just because the herd heads over the cliff is no reason to follow.

If it is, put the mask back on and go get the next booster shot.

WOW... I can't believe you're still bent on this......

I dont give a s&*# if you think my 0.02% of engine hours is a waste or not, its my money. and for some reason you keep (on not only this but many other posts) to point out how foolish we are for buying new trucks.. Shop around, I cannot buy my truck i)see sig) in 2wd or std cab; nor would I want to, times change, not everyone wants to drive a 20y old truck, I had the same truck as your but 4wd and dont miss it.....

4wd ALWAYS gives improved traction period, proven in tractors, trucks, etc, the list goes on... Performance road cars run AWD... just because you don't like it doesn't mean you should continue to berate everyone who does....

I do appreciate some stuff you post, but this is getting out of hand. No Im not going to block you and hide, I'll just consider your comments to be like the rants from Harvey Barlow at times and that's that.

And for the love of god; can we keep politics out of this, seems like every time someone cant complete an argument, they go low and insult one's beliefs. Never going to get anywhere with that and FWIW.. I highly doubt those of us you continue to demean are "taking the shot".

Just Regards

 

[BigPapa]

PREACH....