New 3500 DRW. Aisin or 68?

[dward]

I'm in the process of making some fairly big life changes.
After the last election I decided not to invest any more in California and bought a 150 acre farm with 2 houses and a stocked 2 acre pond in S/W Missouri. (I'm a farmboy from Iowa so not a big change like some people bailing out of this place)
With 2 1/2 yrs left to retire, I planned to keep my current house but a neighbor made an offer worth selling now. In 35 days I'll be "homeless" but have a liveaboard boat in Ventura and spend 1/3 of my time living at the Fire Station.
My plan is to get a new DRW and 9-10' slide in camper and work 2 weeks or so and then take off in the TC and try to enjoy whats left of this country before they try to lock down everything.
Truck market is crazy now, can buy a new truck cheaper than used. Dave Smith seems to be dealing the most and can get a 21 Tradesman CC 4x4 DRW 68RFE for Mid $50s (almost all 68RFE in stock)
I know "go big" with the Aisin, but with 4:10 and only carrying a 5k lb camper and maybe towing 5k behind I think I will be fine with "only" 850 ft/lbs . Ive also heard the non HO motor will get a little better mileage?
I don't want all the bells and whistles and like the Tradesman and really like the new 50 gal fuel tank.
How are the new trucks holding up and any other advice is appreciated.

 

[CROW]

My truck is a 2018 and at that time the towing capacity was considerably greater with the Aisin. Suspect that is true with the 2021. The additional towing capacity might come in handy on the farm property. In my opinion having the Aisin will make the truck much more desirable when it comes time to sell or trade. I have the Tradesman but wish I had gone upscale but I only get half a vote. My guess is that dealers stock the 68 transmission to have a lower price point since these things are so expensive anyway. Not going to argue with anyone, but my opinion is that the 68 transmission is decent but the Aisin is just more reliable and dependable with additional towing capacity and in the used market will be a real plus. I have an Aisin with a 3.73 rear axle (actually this is my third Dodge/Ram with a 3.73) and tow a 14K fifth wheel and do not see the need for a 4.10 rear axle.

 

[p-Bar]

I bought used 3500 dually 2018 ten months ago aisin with 4:11 gears. I think the 3:73 as my mileage falls off over 65 mph. Go aisin

 

[lpennock]

I agree with you on the gears. My mileage drops pretty quick when I hit 70 with the 4.10.

 

[Tuesdak]

Drive both.

I found the HO and Aisin to be quicker to get the memo that the GO pedal has hit the floor and GET WITH IT. From a light to catch a break in traffic pulling out or at 65 MPH. The '20 Trucks I drove were better than the '18's for being able to step out without delay.

The Aisin shifting is not perfect. Not a show stopper but notable despite two flashes that have improved it. It's clunky around 1st in or out of it and just doesn't know when to stay in it first or how to downshift into 1st. A few of us have driveways that are so steep it makes the most powerful diesel engine reach all the way down to 1st gear... It's clunky has shifted cargo on me and knocked off passenger's hats into the back seat. (Your 2017 may have had better shifting than the 2018+ ?) I learned how to drive around it's flaws and thankfully the TSB's helped one of them: 1-2 slam where I had to be light on the pedal taking off till it was in 2nd then put the power on. I still have to be careful to not test the anti-spin during a 2-neutral-1 shift going up my steep driveway. It bangs into 1st taking off from a full stop now and then.

It's heavier: that comes off cargo numbers you could have used for the camper.

The reputation of it being tough to break when diesels are known to eat transmissions for breakfast is big. Do you want to compromise the best you can get your hands on during a pandemic when repair parts are delayed? There are serious delays getting things into the dealer to get things worked on and not just RAM dealers as GM is the same. Sure something else can break on both but better odds are better odds. Nothing can break as again it's odds/luck.

Not sure why you are concerned with MPG between diesels in a DRW 1 ton. Maybe TCO is worth a look including the gas engine options. Gas engines are lighter and allow a heavier camper. The ~$10K cost difference can buy a lot of gasoline: $3 gal at 10 MPG is 33,000 miles of gasoline.

 

[JR]

Most of them are 68rfe's because "most" simply don't care what transmission their truck has. Most can't even tell you what they have in their current truck. I've come to this conclusion over the last several years of talking truck with different people and different walks of life. Your true car guys will know, the rest, not so much.

I agree with Tuesdak in that you should drive both and make your choice based on your own opinion. The 68 gets a bad rap but the reality is the odds of it breaking on you in the first 10 years of ownership are slim. Assuming of course you don't work your truck for a living. In stock form they are pretty reliable.

Pro's of buying the 68. A lot less up front and 2-4 times longer service intervals than the Aisin. You can also get your fluid at any parts store in town. Aisin is either dealer or order online.

Pro of buying an Aisin. The consensus is they're more reliable. But again I don't see threads on here filling up the forums with 68's crapping out.

I'm only at 130k miles so I am not much of a case arguing for longevity of the 68rfe but I can say I've not been disappointed one day with it. My lifetime mpg according to the EVIC is a touch over 13 for an idea of how many tow miles I tow. And they are hard miles, low and slow.

 

[Topzide]

I'll throw my hat in here, drive both if you can, then make your choice. Remember this truck will be with you for quite some time! I can speak that the 68 rfe has treated my right. No complaints with just under 160K. JR makes good point about service interval and fluid cost/availability! The HO/Asian combo is made for heavier payloads if that's needed. Just remember to not "cheap" out. Get what you want and don't look back! @dward Thank you for you service to the community! Sounds like you've got a great plan for retirement!

 

[dward]

Thanks for all the responses and great info. Its getting tough to find the Aisin and I could only locate 1 with 3:73 but comes with the 68. Its a Tradesman in Granite Crystal with just the basics that I want and its fairly close home.
Would the 3:73 be a good combo with the 68RFE? I know on the older trucks with 3:42 the low 1st gear in the Aisin helped get the load moving.

 

[Tuesdak]

9-10' slide in camper

Curious as to what you are looking at for in a camper and suggest a cost savings you look at what could work with your existing truck. For example Northern Lite is light enough to be able to work within the payload of my 2018 3500 SRW. They make short bed models. You mentioned DRW so I respect I may be way off the mark of what you are looking at.

 

[dward]

I currently don't have a truck and from past experience, a DRW is SO much nicer driving with a heavy TC.
Likely go with a 9-10 Lance with slide. 4-5000 lbs loaded.

 

[JR]

.
Would the 3:73 be a good combo with the 68RFE? .

I think they are a good combo for any trans. I have always felt 3.42 were too high for my usage in virtually every gear. A little higher rpm will help stay in the power band and the lower gears will help lessen driveline stresses. It would be interesting to know the reasoning behind fca engineers decision to ditch the 3.42 for the SRW trucks.

 

[gsbrockman]

It would be interesting to know the reasoning behind fca engineers decision to ditch the 3.42 for the SRW trucks.

Ironically....GM started utilizing the 3.42 ratio when the ten speed automatic was introduced in the DuraMax HD trucks.

 

[JR]

Probably not too ironic. When GM had the 6 speed the SRW option was 3.73. I think Ford had 3.55's. It makes a lot more sense stepping up to a higher rear gear with the 4 extra cogs to play with.

 

[AH64ID]

Probably not too ironic. When GM had the 6 speed the SRW option was 3.73. I think Ford had 3.55's. It makes a lot more sense stepping up to a higher rear gear with the 4 extra cogs to play with.

I actually think it makes more sense to go the other way. More OD options to make lower pumpkin gears worthwhile and take some strain off the trans, but that’s not the only part of the modern equation.

Mathematically speaking, considering average US speed limits, the options should be 3.42 and 4.10. I know that 3.73’s wouldn’t work as well for most highway/interstate grade pulling speeds as either 3.42 or 4.10 with current trans ratios.

On the flip side the J2807 specs don’t have anything to do with maintaining the speed limit, so 3.73’s will always win over 3.42 in that test. That’s why they switched. GM can meet the same, or better, J2807 testing with 3.42’s on the 10 speed and have a quieter more fuel efficient cruise thanks to its ultra low 1st gear.

I’m still considering 4.10’s in my 18 SRW. I do a lot of slow speed towing and you can only downshift so far. 3.73’s aren’t enough of a change to make it worthwhile, and at 65-70 they are in the wrong rpm band, IMO. 4.10’s would be better from 0-75, then they would take a good fuel hit. I’m not often at 75+.

Ya ya, engineers chose 3.73’s… but I don’t agree with everyone they do and engineers still have people telling them what blocks have to be checked. J2807 is why we have 3.73 as the new base gearing.

I’m not bashing J2807 as at least it standardizes things, but if you look at how they test it’s not practical for most owners.

 

[gsbrockman]

I’m still considering 4.10’s in my 18 SRW. I do a lot of slow speed towing and you can only downshift so far.

Is it not practical to run 4Low in some areas? If the surface is loose....I couldn’t see any harm done in running in 4Low.

 

[AH64ID]

Is it not practical to run 4Low in some areas? If the surface is loose....I couldn’t see any harm done in running in 4Low.

It’s practical and I do it sometimes. I also run 4Hi a lot on loose surfaces.

Biggest bummer in 4Lo is the torque converter won’t lock below 20mph, like hi range.

If I knew the torque converter would lock lower with 4.10’s I’d probably have swapped already, but I can’t confirm it will. I’m also not sure it will based on what I’ve seen in 4Lo.

 

[JR]

Since we are referring to SRW and GVW is limited I think the thought on going to 3.42 is, The 10 speed has something like a 4.xx 1st gear ratio to help get the load moving.Even 3rd gear is lower than 2 in the 68rfe and the Aisin. Just like how they spec tractors that aren't in heavy haul, rear axle ratio for highway efficiency, get the startability required from your transmission ratios.

I've often thought about switching gear ratios too but it is hard to justify the cost. A middle road between a 3.73 and a 4.10 would be really tempting.
I went the poor mans route and bought the BD 2 low kit

 

[JR]

J2807 is why we have 3.73 as the new base gearing.

Hasn't that been around for some time now? Close to 10 years?
Seems like Ram has been meeting the criteria prior to the change unless something in 2807 changed.

 

[NIsaacs]

Would the 3:73 be a good combo with the 68RFE? I know on the older trucks with 3:42 the low 1st gear in the Aisin helped get the load moving.

I say yes to the 3.73/68RFE. I haul pretty heavy, 26k+ with that combo. No issues at all, launching that load from stop light to stop light. It will run circles around my juiced up '01 with manual 6 spd. transmission. I don't hotrod either truck, but I don't grow no grass either. The '01 is agonizingly slow in this light to light use.

Out on the open road they become more even, with a slight edge still going to the new truck. I always use cruise or the dang thing is always going over the speed limit. It is so willing, smooth and quiet, you don't realize it.

A set of 3.90's would be killer

 

[AH64ID]

Since we are referring to SRW and GVW is limited I think the thought on going to 3.42 is, The 10 speed has something like a 4.xx 1st gear ratio to help get the load moving.Even 3rd gear is lower than 2 in the 68rfe and the Aisin.

Not just SRW. 3.42 is the only option from GM for diesel trucks. SRW or DRW.

The 1st gear ratio is very low for an automatic.

Hasn't that been around for some time now? Close to 10 years?
Seems like Ram has been meeting the criteria prior to the change unless something in 2807 changed.

Yes, and Ram has used it since day one. Now that Furd/GM have ultra low 1st gears and the that helps the test Ram has to do something to test better. 3.73’s over 3.42’s as the standard gearing is the easiest answer. It provides better testing in forward and reverse without a transmission change.

A set of 3.90's would be killer

I’ve also thought that for a long time!