New 68RFE into 2nd Gen?

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

I wonder if any of our transmission vendors are looking into swapping the new 6-speed automatic into a 2nd gen truck? Someday I'm going to put a decent auto in my '98 2wd shorty but if I knew something like this was on the horizon (if it's reasonably doable) I would rather save my money and put it towards this kind of conversion. More gears and overdrive are appealing. The 47 & 48 series 4-speeds just have too big of gap between Drive and OD to work nicely for towing, plus first gear is too tall to get rolling and have good spoolup if you got a load on behind.

I know Suncoast is doing Allison 6-speed conversions but my hopes are that in the next year there will be enough of the 68RFEs around to become somewhat more affordable. Also I'm thinking since it was designed to go in front of a Cummins in the first place it oughta live pretty well in front of a 12-valve that I'm not planning to push past 350 horsepower, and I'd have to do little or nothing to it before swapping it in.

The ultimate deciding factor is its physical size. . . hopefully it's not too hefty and could be installed without any interference with the floorpan, frame, exhaust, etc.

Vaughn

 

[amsoilman]

I wonder if any of our transmission vendors are looking into swapping the new 6-speed automatic into a 2nd gen truck? Someday I'm going to put a decent auto in my '98 2wd shorty but if I knew something like this was on the horizon (if it's reasonably doable) I would rather save my money and put it towards this kind of conversion. More gears and overdrive are appealing. The 47 & 48 series 4-speeds just have too big of gap between Drive and OD to work nicely for towing, plus first gear is too tall to get rolling and have good spoolup if you got a load on behind.



I know Suncoast is doing Allison 6-speed conversions but my hopes are that in the next year there will be enough of the 68RFEs around to become somewhat more affordable. Also I'm thinking since it was designed to go in front of a Cummins in the first place it oughta live pretty well in front of a 12-valve that I'm not planning to push past 350 horsepower, and I'd have to do little or nothing to it before swapping it in.



The ultimate deciding factor is its physical size. . . hopefully it's not too hefty and could be installed without any interference with the floorpan, frame, exhaust, etc.



Vaughn

Vaughn,



One of the concerns you'd have would be the fact you would need a "Stand-alone" computer to operate it!



Wayne

amsoilman

 

[mattymac]

It seems like there is a bunch of interest on this subject so maybe the aftermarket may find this doable?

 

[Philip]

I would like to see a stand alone controller for the 68RFE or the Aisin. I would like to have a 6spd auto.

 

[y-knot]

You know that would be a very nice and most likely cheaper option then a built 47 or 48 (at over $5,000. 00 a piece). They already have a kit that allows you to install a GMC 6-speed Automatic Transmission in the Dodge Ram trucks, That would be a perfect combo, they have proven to be much, much better then the 47-48RE transmissions.

 

[raychem]

You know that would be a very nice and most likely cheaper option then a built 47 or 48 (at over $5,000. 00 a piece). They already have a kit that allows you to install a GMC 6-speed Automatic Transmission in the Dodge Ram trucks, That would be a perfect combo, they have proven to be much, much better then the 47-48RE transmissions.

Well the 68rfe is $3500-$4000 at the dealer new. Plus adapter and stand alone computer with the ability to by-pass the stock ecm or trick it. Either way it will still be a sizable investment, I would venture to say some were between 6-8k by the time everything is done including install labor and programming. I would love to see it done but then come the upgrades to the 68rfe.



Richard

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

One thing that scares me about the Allison is someone locally put one in their '02 and it did not go well. Went and looked at it Saturday. $10k into it and still not shifting right. It wasn't exactly a polished kit though.

If a new 68RFE is $3500-$4k from the dealer that is encouraging. I think in time the electronics can be nailed down. I think all the PCM is involved with is watching the TPS and executing OD shifting and lockup so I don't think that would be too challenging to someone who knows what they're doing (and that's no me, LOL). What I'm wondering is how many inputs the 68RFE would need to see. . . would need throttle position and vehicle speed at minimum.

I posted another thread about 68RFE function but I see no one has commented yet. . . was wondering how lockup functions (what gears, at WOT, etc. ).
Vaughn

 

[TAbbott]

Wouldn't need near as much computer control if it was a manual shift only. Just use the paddles to shift it up and down or a manual shifter with detents from 1-6,N,R,P.

 

[raychem]

If a new 68RFE is $3500-$4k from the dealer that is encouraging. I think in time the electronics can be nailed down. I think all the PCM is involved with is watching the TPS and executing OD shifting and lockup so I don't think that would be too challenging to someone who knows what they're doing (and that's no me, LOL). What I'm wondering is how many inputs the 68RFE would need to see. . . would need throttle position and vehicle speed at minimum.





Vaughn

From the parts breakdown that I have for the 68rfe... it runs just like the allison, the way the soleniod pack and the VB look but I have yet to see one. And don't forget that the NEW cummins ECM will monitor more transmission and engine prameters. In the end, when it gets done it will be a bit involved and will still be every bit of the above mentioned price. I'll keep the 4 sp for now till new stuff for the 68 comes out. Regardless of what people say or do, the 727 has been around since the 60's and we have them pretty down packed... . wouldn't you say?

 

[mattymac]

I know a guy here that just did a 6spd to auto swap with another 2nd gen right next him who wanted the 6spd, it was pushing 8 grand and he didnt have to buy a transmission. (just all the billet goodies inside)

 

[GMac]

that swap in washington was no where near 10 grand. There are little bugs to be worked out, nothing major. Good luck on making a new aisin work. I think our trucks will be rusted out before they will work right. Do they have the same bolt pattern as the 5. 9. They are a rear gear-train engine ya know.

 

[AKaiser]

Regardless of what people say or do, the 727 has been around since the 60's and we have them pretty down packed... . wouldn't you say?

Don't know about "down packed" but we certainly have them "down pat. "

 

[GMac]

Maybe as far as making them as good as they can be, but they are are by no means comparable to an allison. I am not saying that they are bad, but that transmission has been exhausted. Everything that can be done to them has been done. You can't get any more gears out of them, and you can't just tune it differently by a programmer. I know some people are very partial to the 727, but there are better ones out there.

 

[AKaiser]

Everything that can be done to them has been done.

Famous last words. :-laf

 

[phumblias]

GMac,



sent you a PM yesterday. Could you please get back to me when you get a moment. Thanks and its greatly appreciated.

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

that swap in washington was no where near 10 grand. There are little bugs to be worked out, nothing major. Good luck on making a new aisin work. I think our trucks will be rusted out before they will work right. Do they have the same bolt pattern as the 5. 9. They are a rear gear-train engine ya know.

I was talking about the 68RFE not the Aisin, but the Aisin should be the same bellhousing bolt pattern since the C&C Rams they're used in have the same front-geartrain 6. 7 Cummins the pickup line has.

 

[Dave Ratcliffe]

One thing that scares me about the Allison is someone locally put one in their '02 and it did not go well. Went and looked at it Saturday. $10k into it and still not shifting right.

That's my truck, so I should clarify. The only shifting problem I'm having now is a pretty harsh 1-2 shift. Its a known problem and it has to do with the non-linear voltage signal coming from the Dodge PCM. They have a fix that I should be getting soon. The initial tune I had really bogged the motor, and the one I have now works much better. The other big bug I had was the anti-stall of the manual ECM causing a romping at idle. Marco made me a special ECM program to fix that.



I didn't spend $10k on the conversion. I had a bunch of other stuff done to my truck, like twins and traction bars. I won't quote a number, but you can PM Gabe for that.



I've had some heat issues I've been trying to deal with on my twins and in all fairness, that's really a separate issue from the Allison conversion. Hope this helps.



Dave

 

[DHayden]

Old thread, new progress?

Been off TDR again for a while but was interested in this a long time ago, any progress made on this yet? Anyone done it yet? Was almost sold on the 6 speed allison but thought as long as the knee held up I would wait and see how the 68rfe came along... so to the top

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

Scary I was just thinking about this today and I find someone has kicked up my old thread LOL

Haven't heard of anyone actually doing this swap. I thought one vender had a standalone controller in the works but can't find anything about it.

I found some tech service info on the 68RFE's little brother found in Hemi applications http://hotrodlane.cc/New HEMI Tech/2004 57 hemi trans.pdf