Here I am

Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) New TC in testing...

Attention: TDR Forum Junkies
To the point: Click this link and check out the Front Page News story(ies) where we are tracking the introduction of the 2025 Ram HD trucks.

Thanks, TDR Staff

Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) EDM Injector GROUP BUY! Any size!

Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Oil Leak

Status
Not open for further replies.
Hey guys, it looks like a DTT stator because it is a DTT stator. We have aftermarket vendors that do buy versions of our stator. We are in business to make money . So sometimes we do sell some of our products to some of our competitors. It is business. We know that DTT has the highest rated parts out there. So some of our competitors will buy parts from us when they have an application that require our knowledge and parts. Do we sell them the same versions that run in our customer application trucks. NO WE DO NOT. DTT runs a complete system, it is a complete transmission system. Most guys look at this dodge transmission like the converter is the weak link and the sole issue faced by the dodge transmission. We have never looked at it like that . The fluid coupling sucks , thats a driveability issue and we deal with it. As far as your converter being a 1400 stall converter , I already know that is not so.

When we sell a stator to any competitor we will let them know what the stall speed is. The stall speed on your truck is over 2700 rpms with the version stator you are showing in the posted in your picture , how to verify this is to turn on your water meth, turn on your power full boar , make sure your truck is up to temp. lock the parking brake and hold the foot brake down as hard as you can on the brake pedal , then get on it hard and heavy. Your stall test should be done at approx. 40 lbs of boost with the power level that you have. By the way ****** when we do R&D on stall speeds we brake a lot of factory shafts so unless you have the proper shafts dont do the true stall test method as described. When you are measuring the stall speed of a converter it is the point of where the engine rpms can no longer climb and you have reached max. boost that your engine is capable of making in fluid coupling. That is the true stall speed of your converter.



We do this type of testing because we are paid by our customers to have this type of data before we sell them components. Do we recommend that our customers do this no, but then again we do not advertise stall speeds as described above becuase we know that is not so. What we do is offer a way customers can safely figure out their tc's efficiency.



Do one dyno pull in fluid coupling , then a second with the TC locked up. The the difference in hp will give you a pretty good indication of the efficiency of your TC.



2nd method / Take your truck down the quarter mile, first time do it with the TC clutch disengaged. 2nd time use your lock up switch.



The difference in the mph between the two passes will give you a pretty good indication. The difference in ET will also give you a pretty good indication. We prefer the method of mph vs rpm but both methods will give you a pretty close idea.



*** again, we DO NOT recommend that general consumers do the true stall test method as it can prove to be very explosive, and expensive . We have a special transbrake equipped transmission we use for testing stall speed . And no we do not sell transbrakes for the Dodges so please dont phone us for one. Havent you guys ever wondered why I could launch T. Berry's truck at 35 lbs of boost in Muncie to put his truck in the 12's (1998. 5 24V, 5" of lift, 37" tires, no drugs), or guys like OPIE that gets 1. 5 60 ft. times launching at close to 40 lbs of boost Its all about the converter holding back the cummins motor under full boost type conditions, the tires planting, the transmission shafts holding ect. it not any one item, its about a systems
 
Last edited:
Yes,



Stefan is right. The sheet metal stator is one from DTT. I got it from a burned up DTT conveter. I do not know what percentage it is. I experimented with a few different setups and personally did not think the stator was very user friendly when trying to back my 6000 lbs boat up my steep driveway, or driving in stop and go traffic. Again, I did like it on the race track.



Stefan, look at my pictures in my profile you will see a broken input shaft from testing this converter. It now sports a billet shaft and hub.



Don't get me wrong, but the converter is only a small part of the 47RE/47RH problems.





[/IMG]#ad




"The fluid coupling sucks , thats a driveability issue and we deal with it. "




With the multi disk converters out there we do not have to sacrifice driveability.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I think we both know that I was refering to oem fluid coupling and drivability so we can just leave that where it belongs.



However, I know you are saying that it is the input shaft in your picture above is the one that you broke during your stall testing.

FYI , input shafts break during the shift cycle or during locked to locked applications .



Output shafts break during stall testing. The input shaft only breaks during stall testing if the converter is welded off center but good job on getting the billet ones anyway.
 
Originally posted by Stefan Kondolay

I think we both know that I was refering to oem fluid coupling and drivability so we can just leave that where it belongs.



However, I know you are saying that it is the input shaft in your picture above is the one that you broke during your stall testing.

FYI , input shafts break during the shift cycle or during locked to locked applications .



Output shafts break during stall testing. The input shaft only breaks during stall testing if the converter is welded off center but good job on getting the billet ones anyway.



Nope, if you read the post it was broke when I was "testing" the converter. Not a stall test. Yes, it was broke using the lock-up device.



Take a look and I want to know what you think... Have you ever seen an input shaft break off at the hub?
 
Originally posted by ChadHarlan

Isn't 2700 stall speed too high for these diesels?



I am confused about the stall speeds. Please Help.



Put you truck in drive, hold the break as hard as you can, press the accelerater down to the floor and see at what RPM's the motor will go to until it wont go any further on the tach.



The sheet metal stator would make me truck stall at a very low rpm. Low enough to make large amounts of smoke when accelerating. The stator that I am using is geared more towards the daily driver, not a race truck. A lower stall stator can be put in the convertor for whatever you want to use your truck for.
 
Originally posted by justinp20012500

Put you truck in drive, hold the break as hard as you can, press the accelerater down to the floor and see at what RPM's the motor will go to until it wont go any further on the tach.






I would be VERY careful about doing this. One, in two wheel drive you will probably spin the rear tires before it stalls, and two in four wheel drive with a stock ouput shaft you could break it. Because of the amount of torque our engines produce making a stall test is a risky test. IMHO



Paul
 
Big Daddy, back in a land far, far away I was at 250 HP or so and I could stall my stock transmission to 2700 or so with my 2WD, not so anymore.



If all goes well I should be testing with a set of slicks before too long, got the wheels now.....compliments of Fletcher. I need to see or lets say learn that end of the truck too.



Jim
 
Originally posted by Jim Fulmer

Big Daddy, back in a land far, far away I was at 250 HP or so and I could stall my stock transmission to 2700 or so with my 2WD, not so anymore.



If all goes well I should be testing with a set of slicks before too long, got the wheels now.....compliments of Fletcher. I need to see or lets say learn that end of the truck too.



Jim



Stall is a very touchy subject. With the stock power the cummins can make you can push transmission to 2400 RPM. It dosen't mean that the TC is to blame, you could be slipping the clutches internally.



Correct me if I am wrong.
 
Actually we have seen a lot of broken shafts, the one that you have there we refer to as a clean break. Unfortunately that is not the most common type of breakage. We have also seen them rip the splines right out of the hub, we have seen them shatter, and look like dynamite has gotten at the shaft, we have seen them where half of the shaft ends up in the TC and the other takes out the front pump.



As for stall speeds, this i have watched Bill do and in comparison to what I have seen, most people and companies have no concept as to what this Cummins will do to a TC's fluid coupling. One of the things I learned for example is that stall speed on an oem factory type stator on a 400 hp truck with a 355 gear ratio, on a 24 valve truck will go right to 3400 rpms , the only thing holding it back is the VP 44 pump. On a 12 valve you can put it up against the mechanical governor at will. That is why we profile each truck and even though there are 3 listed versions of tc's in actuality there are over 15 versions of each. Only we choose the version based on the profile sheets we use to ensure the correct version ends up in your truck. That is why we do not discuss TC versions and choose accordingly per customer per profile sheet. Unfortunately with todays day and age of product & reverse engineering such measures are necessary.



Looking ahead a bit, with guys adding sfi flex plates, input shafts, output shafts, intermediate shafts, ect. the end user himself will have transmissions similar to the ones we test with and can do their own stall testing. That will mark the end of companies claiming 1400 or 1500 or 1700 rpm type of stall speeds as the customers will be able to verify what they are buying.



For those of you that dont want to dyno, or drag race you can still check your components out using your boost gauge to verify , the company you purchase from should be able to tell you how. Dont ask them for things you cannot verify like the stall speed it makes it to easy to get taken advantage of.
 
It seems stall speed is a rather "inaccurate" way or should I say unreliable way to measure fluid coupling efficiency. Is it not accurate to say that the stall speed of a given TC would vary depending on HP. Or am I missing something. :confused:
 
Originally posted by Chipstien

It seems stall speed is a rather "inaccurate" way or should I say unreliable way to measure fluid coupling efficiency. Is it not accurate to say that the stall speed of a given TC would vary depending on HP. Or am I missing something. :confused:



You couldn't be more correct. With a stock HP motor the stall would be xxxx RPM, but as soon as you you double the stock HP and triple the torque the stall would be xxxx. I helped develop this converter for one reason. The most common thing that fails in the torque converter is the lock up clutch. Input torque exceeds clutch holding capacity. Its a very simple formula. There are ways to get around it, but you sacrifice drivability.
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top