Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) NV4500 5spd problems

[K5IP]

Hi all,

I just came limping back from Alaska (fishing was great) with a very noisy NV 4500. It is still quiet in 4th gear, but all gears involving the countershaft are getting very noisy. I am glad I made it back to New Mexico but now it is time to pull the transmission and find out what is wrong.

The 95 has 100k on it now but has only pulled a light (4800lb) trailer. I have changed the fluid (Syntorque) at about 60K and I have been very gentle with this rig. (no power upgrades)

I have always known I might have a 5th gear problem, but never expected a major failure this quickly.

I might add that this problem first started out as a loud grinding noise when using the PackBrake (decelerating) in 2nd gear, but 5K miles later, the noise is now present in both loaded and unloaded conditions using all counter shaft involved gears. I wonder if the engine brake may have had something to do with it.

I am thinking of doing the clutch at the same time. Any thoughts?

Rog

 

[SRadke]

I would do the clutch at the same time. I've recently completed the rebuild of my third NV4500 and it's really not that difficult. Thus far half of the trucks I've put clutches have needed new bearings in the trans. It seems changing the fluid is a necessity and probably more than every 60K. These poor little tapered roller bearings just get eaten up by the Cummins torque load. If I were you, I'd call Standard Transmission and order a bearing/seal/syncro set along with a band aid fix for the fifth gear thing and tear into it. An owners manual will do a pretty good job walking you through the process.



-Scott

 

[HCanales]

SRadke which manual would I need to get for my nv4500? Also do you know if a 01 transmission comes 5th gear modification? Thanks for the help HC.

 

[JGheen]

Didn't they start putting the NV5600s in by '01?? Can't remember when those were introduced into the late model Rams.

 

[ndurbin]

As early as 1999 if I remember right but those are extremely rare. '01 I believe is when they went full-time into the production line.

 

[SRadke]

They started the NV5600's late in 99 but as stated above, they're rare. The NV4500's ran up into 2004 before they were fazed out totally. I have one in my 03.



I did my first rebuild on a trans out of a 96 using a copy of the 97 service manual. It was enough to get me through the job. If you don't have access to a service manual ask Standard Transmission if they have any literature on it. They have always been helpfull in answering my questions. If you can't come up with anything send me a PM with your email, I can borrow the 97 maunal I used again and copy some pages for you. Should be very similar.



-Scott

 

[Turbo Thom]

The first thing I would do is remove the input shaft and see if you have any bearing. While you have the input in your hands see if any teeth are left. Then remove the pto covers and count how many pieces are in the bottom. You can't put um back but you will know where they went.



. . Preston. .

 

[K5IP]

Scott,

Thanks for the info, I do have the Dodge service manual for my truck and the transmission looks like it is easy to work on. I may go ahead and tackel it myself. Are the bearings you speak of on the main shaft, counter shaft or both? Have you converted to any to a fully splined mainshaft?

I am also looking at a web sight which offers a conversion to a nv5600 which might also be an option if I open this one up and it is junk.

Anyhow I'll also check with standard transmission.

Thanks

Rog

 

[SRadke]

The main bearing are on each end of the main shaft and countershaft. The kit also has the roller bearing that sits inside the imput shaft (to support the front of the mainshaft) and the thrust bearing. Their kit does not have the needle bearing in it but they are usually salvageable. I did convert one to a fully splined shaft and it wasn't a big deal. Just be sire to stack all the pieces as they come off the shaft so you get them back on in the right order. I didn't mention this upgrade earlier because you mentioned you rarely tow and are still at stock hp levels. The NV 5600 conversion is cost prohibitive to most but is another option to consider.



-Scott

 

[K5IP]

Scott,

Thanks again. One more thing, it looks like they use a special tool to remove the shifter from the tower. I cant see from the book exactly how this is done. Do I needc the tool or can I make do?

Rog

 

[SRadke]

Scott,

Thanks again. One more thing, it looks like they use a special tool to remove the shifter from the tower. I cant see from the book exactly how this is done. Do I needc the tool or can I make do?

Rog

On an 01? There is a rectangular plate that the shifter goes through and the pivot ball is in. One bolt in each corner and it lifts right of the trans. I've never had the shifter/pivot ball assemby apart and I see no reason why you'd need to. Where you may need a apecial tool is for the mainshaft nut. It takes a special socket or a spanner wrench.



-Scott

 

[SteveMiller]

On pre 98s its a ball type pivot and not the square plate. You can use 2 screw drivers and push down on the round metal ring looking thing just inside the casing and then turn it counter clockwise and it will come out.



I'm doing the exact same thing at the moment. Its kinda tricky but not hard. I had the same problem. I do alot of mountain driving and use lower gears on the down hills plenty. I wonder if this problem arises from back pressure on the transmission?



Steve

 

[Turbo Thom]

Remember the shift lever screws onto the shifter section that goes through the tower. When you take the tower cover off the plate has 4 bolts and sleeves. Don't misplace them. The transmission is not that bad is you have a transmission jack and truck in the air. On the floor is rough.

. . Preston. .

 

[SteveMiller]

If you keep looking and don't know what they are talking about with the 4bolts and the lever screwing on its cause they are talking about a 98 or later. I have both types sitting on my garage floor at the moment. Standard Transmission also had a hard time distinguishing between the two models as they sent me the wrong one.



The top of your transmission should come up and have a cylinder type section that the shift lever goes into. There is is a cover over the ball that has some slots in it that goes down and turns that holds the shifter on. there won't be any bolts or sleeves or plate. If you push down with two screwdrivers and turn on that cover you should be able to get it off. Once it turns some the whole shift lever assembly should just pull right out.

 

[Turbo Thom]

Sorry Steve, I just caught on the what I said. A 95. OK . When I called ST, I ordered the newer model and replaced the 96 with it. A good choice, too. For just a few $'s more you get a everthing you need for the swap.



. . Preston. .

 

[DDoctorian]

I join TDR last night because I am have an intermittant noise problem with my 96's 5spd. Will a 6spd out of an 01 fit right in? Any pointers, where to buy, how much, what it takes, etc. would be appreciated. Thanks

david

 

[K5IP]

Scott,

After looking at a 6spd and various costs associated with it, crossmember, clutch, shafts, transportation etc. I was looking at about $4500. I decided it was just not worth it for an older truck. I talked with the folks from Standard Transmission and have decided to go with the kit you recommended if the insides look ok. I will go ahead with the fully splined main shaft as I like to tow my small 5th wheel in 5th gear.

I came back from Alaska in 4th gear and got aboout 2mpg less in 4th gear than I did going up there in 5th gear. With the margin of the splined shaft I will go ahead and bump up the power a bit so I will change the clutch at the same time. Probably a tst #10, or perhaps just moving the standard plate forward a bit will suffice.

You mentioned changing clutches. What have you been putting it? Recomendations?

(Application for about 250 hp and 525 ft lb of torque. Right now I am looking at South Bend.

Thanks

Rog

 

[WDaniels]

K5IP,

I didn't get your rig signature but I did read where you want to separate the shifter. Under no way should you do that, like Steve Miller says, just get 2 screw drivers and push down the ring and twist. Easy as eating pie. I just finished doing my xmission and it's not hard.

WD

 

[SRadke]

K5IP,

I didn't get your rig signature but I did read where you want to separate the shifter. Under no way should you do that, like Steve Miller says, just get 2 screw drivers and push down the ring and twist. Easy as eating pie. I just finished doing my xmission and it's not hard.

WD

For the record, this is only applicable for 94-97 trucks. I thought your's was newer



Clutches. If you want to go South Bend, call Peter and ask some questions. My guess is for you application he'll steer you to the MU0090 Ralley. I've but in two of them and both were smooth to engage, held fine up to about 280hp (that's all the trucks had, the clutch may have held more) and had as good or better pedal feel than stock. Standard Trans is also a dealer for them.



-Scott

 

[SRadke]

I join TDR last night because I am have an intermittant noise problem with my 96's 5spd. Will a 6spd out of an 01 fit right in? Any pointers, where to buy, how much, what it takes, etc. would be appreciated.

The 6-speed (NV5600) is a much larger transmission than the 5-speed (NV4500). To do a conversion as Rog mentioned requires a diffrent (or modified) crossmember, extention housing, changing the length of both drivelines to accomodate the extra length, as well as a few other things. The 5-speeds can be made to trake a lot of torque but they are light for the application so you'll have to take care of them.



-Scott