NV5600 & Spec MS-9224

[DPKetchum]

Well heres my 02 worth if it matters. I worked for years in a Datsun dealer,then it changed to Nissan. Had techs and not just one or two that could tear a manual trans down like shucking corn and put it back togather almost as fast. You could put front wheel/rear wheel and the differant trans models in a pile with some of these teschs(check balls and the works)and get them all rebuilt with no extra parts or issues on how they worked. All (not many)of the NV5600s I've driven all felt the same. They were factory units that had not been taken apart. Then I read posts about these reman/rebuilt ones with issues. The issue is with the builder! With factory new the biggest variable is drivers.

 

[Cattletrkr]

https://www.turbodieselregister.com...s-2003-2007/189627-rebuilt-nv5600-issues.html

I have the same truck, same driver, same fluid, different transmission. Maybe new/rebuilt transmissions don't like Amsoil I dunno. My old unit was fine with it.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Well heres my 02 worth if it matters. I worked for years in a Datsun dealer,then it changed to Nissan. Had techs and not just one or two that could tear a manual trans down like shucking corn and put it back togather almost as fast. You could put front wheel/rear wheel and the differant trans models in a pile with some of these teschs(check balls and the works)and get them all rebuilt with no extra parts or issues on how they worked. All (not many)of the NV5600s I've driven all felt the same. They were factory units that had not been taken apart. Then I read posts about these reman/rebuilt ones with issues. The issue is with the builder! With factory new the biggest variable is drivers.

HMMmmmm - I read the above quoted post - THEN I go back a read THIS post from the same member in another related thread:

I swapped to the Amsoil MTL 5w30 at 15k. Differance of night and day in shift quality for the better from the jump street over factory fliud. Don't mistake its still a nosy,clunky transmission but much better with the A stuff in it.

SO, if fluids, and transmission tolerances DON'T make any difference - and it's primarily the DRIVER - how do you explain your OWN "night and day" difference all from a simple lube swap - was it REAL - or perhaps just your imagination? :-laf:-laf:-laf

 

[JHardwick]

You are comparing apples to oranges. There is no machine work necessary in the assembly of a simple standard truck transmission. You can mix and match transmission parts from several trannys and make one.





"NICK"

Somebody who looks at a yardstick, can't see a micrometer!

 

[JHardwick]

To bad... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ..... I already did!

Wayne

Me personally, I'm tired of seeing your strong arm sales tactics ... ... ... ... go sell Avon or something.

This is a USER board ... ... ... ... find something to sell that sells itself a little better and save us the bull!

 

[JHardwick]

Gary, what I am and have been trying to say, is that standard transmissions are simple, syncros are simple and that all parts are machined simple, they will all mix and match and make one. They are not individually machined to only fit one application as in the usual term of machine fit.

"NICK"

Now your learning!



Unless every part is custom fit, there has to be a tolerance in the manufacturing process.



No two transmission's are EVER the same!

 

[JHardwick]

You are comparing apples to oranges. There is no machine work necessary in the assembly of a simple standard truck transmission. You can mix and match transmission parts from several trannys and make one.





"NICK"

The case is machined, the shafts with shoulder lengths are machined, the gears with thickness are machined ,,,,,,, etc





I'll give you that they are supposed to be interchangeable ... ... ... ... . but man what a difference 0. 010" makes!



Do you even KNOW what 0. 010" is?

 

[steved]

The case is machined, the shafts with shoulder lengths are machined, the gears with thickness are machined ,,,,,,, etc





I'll give you that they are supposed to be interchangeable ... ... ... ... . but man what a difference 0. 010" makes!



Do you even KNOW what 0. 010" is?

Does anyone know if there is any shimming done in the NV5600? I'm sure there has to be to make out-of-spec cases/shafts fit together... I'm not talking shims for preload, but shims for end play.



steved

 

[DPKetchum]

Fliuds do make a differance. They did on ones we rebuilt. Spent years trying to figure out the fliud in the Datsun/Nissan stuff. Book said 75w90. But thats NOT what came out of them. Finally got a answer. It was straight 75w and what a diiferance in below 50 degrees it made on cold shifting. Like factory new. What I meant was I keep reading posts about what these NV5600 like for fliud and their differant. It seems ONLY the reman/rebuilt ones are the ones that may or may not like Amsoil or Redline etc. Yes Amsoil made a day and night differance in shifting but I would assume that any of the higher dollar designer lubes would. Drivers are the biggest varible in tires,brakes,clutchs and manual trans life. I have not seen a post from a real gearhead that can build and KNOWS a NV5600 in and out. Any one posting ever spread one out and reasembled it them selves?

 

[NIsaacs]

The case is machined, the shafts with shoulder lengths are machined, the gears with thickness are machined ,,,,,,, etc





I'll give you that they are supposed to be interchangeable ... ... ... ... . but man what a difference 0. 010" makes!



Do you even KNOW what 0. 010" is?

Not supposed to be, they will! So that means on the pieces and parts that matter, such as inner and outer bearing surfaces, will vary less then 0. 001" or they wouldn't be interchangeable. Since the syncros and rings are tapered, a couple of thousands either way is no big deal.



Yup, I can use my yard stick to measure 0. 010", however I usually use my dial indicator (with magnetic base) when I set the back lash on the rear axle ring and pinion fit. Or when I change out a VE fuel pump on a 1st gen, I use my specialized "timing" dial indicator, or when I build an engine, I use my micrometer on the crank shaft. Then when I hand load my ammunition, my inner/outer sliding caliper (with dial in thousands) comes in handy.





"NICK"

 

[DPKetchum]

This tread is almost as bad as the auto trans threads. Since I hve not nor any thats been through a NV5600 I just catch up on this thread in a moth give or take. Heading to hospital for another episode lets see how much chemo it takes to make me sick. Chat much later. DP

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

This tread is almost as bad as the auto trans threads. Since I hve not nor any thats been through a NV5600 I just catch up on this thread in a moth give or take. Heading to hospital for another episode lets see how much chemo it takes to make me sick. Chat much later. DP

Sounds like it might be serious DP - hope your treatment all works out well, and hope to see you back and in good health SOON!

 

[Cattletrkr]

I did a little digging around this afternoon trying to find Texaco 1874 MTX. Thru emails I have found out a few things.

1. Texaco discontinued the product, but Shell picked it up.
2. Shell doesn't have any info online about it. I found it on a listing, but the link was dead.
3. It (the Texaco product) is only available thru Dodge dealers.

#1 and #3 really don't work well together so I'm really not sure what's going on.

In case you're wondering, the NV5600 on my "old" '01 had a sticker on it from the factory that had "Texaco 1874" on it. I would assume that means that 1874 was the factory fill.

 

[Cattletrkr]

The G56 transmission has paper synchros, like an automatic, so it uses ATF.

I'm feeling a little left out on this particular inside joke. Please clue me in to what you mean.

 

[JHardwick]

Not supposed to be, they will! So that means on the pieces and parts that matter, such as inner and outer bearing surfaces, will vary less then 0. 001" or they wouldn't be interchangeable. Since the syncros and rings are tapered, a couple of thousands either way is no big deal.

Actually, a tapered part will vary in assembly way more than an "X"-"Y" part. And even if you accumulate a few thousands in an assembly, you have 2 entirely different trannys once everything is stacked up.



Lets assume that all the parts in an assembly are on the + side of tolerance instead of a mix of +/- parts ... ... ..... you have a very tight transmission!

Yup, I can use my yard stick to measure 0. 010", however I usually use my dial indicator (with magnetic base) when I set the back lash on the rear axle ring and pinion fit. Or when I change out a VE fuel pump on a 1st gen, I use my specialized "timing" dial indicator, or when I build an engine, I use my micrometer on the crank shaft. Then when I hand load my ammunition, my inner/outer sliding caliper (with dial in thousands) comes in handy.





"NICK"

While impressive, it has no bearing on an assembly with accumulated tolerances. No two trannys are ever identical, except by pure chance.

 

[opjohnny]

The shifting "feel" of my transmission is temp dependent thats for sure. I wish there was a good way to heat it up a little in the winter. I plug in the truck with the timer and the engine is ready to go but the syrup in the 6speed is not! Pulling a trailer all day in the heat at high speeds tends to make it feel rough. Most days (spring, summer & fall) it shifts smooth and I would not trade it for anything.

 

[betterthanstock]

I'm feeling a little left out on this particular inside joke. Please clue me in to what you mean.

Unlike the "plastic gears", the paper synchros is no joke.

Synchros can be brass, stainless (dodge viper), carbon fiber (plastic, haha), or paper lined. It's like a clutch friction material (the bands in auto transmissions, which are really a thick paper). Of course paper is rougher than brass, and makes for a faster shifting synchronizer, and that's why they use ATF, to match the paper characteristics.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Unlike the "plastic gears", the paper synchros is no joke.

Synchros can be brass, stainless (dodge viper), carbon fiber (plastic, haha), or paper lined. It's like a clutch friction material (the bands in auto transmissions, which are really a thick paper). Of course paper is rougher than brass, and makes for a faster shifting synchronizer, and that's why they use ATF, to match the paper characteristics.

Several illustrations of transmission design/materials that force the use of lubes primarily for best shifting, rather than best lubrication for gears and bearings!



Back in the "good old days", a transmission required no drain/refill, and usually lasted the life of the vehicle, unless abused. My dad drove a 2 1/2 ton Chevy truck in his cattle hauling business - and had well over a million miles on the cab and running gear when he finally retired and sold it - the transmission was NEVER a problem in all those miles.

 

[NIsaacs]

I agree, good ol' 90 wt. That, mostly 4spd direct trannys and gas power.



Pickups didn't have transmission problems, until the Cummins was introduced.





"NICK"

 

[RVTRKN]

All this debate about the NV5600 being a hard shifting trany is because it is and I had the calouses to prove it, but now that I drive the G56 more than the NV5600 they have gone away. The only thing I dont like about the two differences between the trany's is I have to drive one and then drive the other on the same day. The NV5600 is by far a better trany but the G56 although lighter duty is more comfortable to drive and still can get the work done reliably



Knowing that the NV5600 is no longer available, I will only use OEM oil, regardless of what people claim and if it shifts tight as it was when it was new so be it. I'm not willing to take a chance on a major repair & cost and installing an inferior trany replacing it.