Oxy Acetalene

[Slingblade]

I figure I will pick up a victor torch kit here soon. Just wondering how much to figure on for tank rental and gas fill. Also, how big of tanks should I go with. I dont do a lot of welding, but there have been times when it would be very handy to have.

 

[E7mack96]

if you buy the little tote kit, it won't last long... i started there, and moved up to mid-sized tanks and cutting torch within 6 months. . the little tote tanks run out in like 15-20 min. The mid sized ones will last a long time, and the fill costs are more, but it is alot more gas and alot more convenient than swapping tanks out mid-job.

 

[GHarman]

I bought a 130 Cu Ft Acetylene Tank and a 250 Cu. Ft Oxygen tank. Demurrage(rental) will kill your budget if you keep paying over a few years. If you get your regulators(dont skimp, get two stage regs. ), hoses and torch setup, make sure you use flashback arrestors at the regulators. I have them on my torch, also. Are you going to get a "rosebud" heating tip? That uses a very high volume of gas. Small tanks are not recommended for this application. Acetylene is in a suspension, dissolved in acetone inside a cementatious filler in the tank. The heating tip as well as large orifice welding tips will consume acetylene at a greater rate than the acetone will free release the acetylene. Consequently, you can also consume acetone. A very dangerous situation. Safety rule to be cognizant of; never use more than 1/7 of the volume of a tank of acetylene/ per hour. Be aware that the volume changes as you use it(obvious) But the volume of a 300 cu ft tank(as an example) of useable gas that is really available when it is partially full may be inadequate for your job. Some things to think about. GregH

 

[Slingblade]

Thanks for the info.

 

[GHarman]

Feel free to ask questions. I am a retired welder and am glad to pass on any information that may help. The only stupid question is the one not asked. There are also many fine folks here that have plenty of expertise, in areas that I do not. They will chime in also! GregH

 

[mwilson]

Demurrage on my last contract was $165. 00 for a 3 year period for the medium size Oxygen and Actelyne and I had to pitch a small fit to even get a 3 year, all they wanted to do was a 1 year contract.



Used to be $150. 00 for 5 years but the place got bought out and the rules changed. I have had that contract for 20+ years.



Just bought a set of flashback protectors last year, don't know why I put it off for so long.



I don't use the torch set very often but some kind of handy to have when they are needed. Well worth the investment.

 

[TBartlett1]

Years ago when I decided I needed torches I bought a small set with a 55 cu/ft OX and a 7. 5lb map tank.

For me that was perfect and would last 2~3 years with no rental fees.

Recently I rented larger tanks. The rental fee here is $55 per tank regardless of the tank size.

However as the size of the tank goes up the contents become more economical.

This past week I caved in and rented a 70lb Map tank to go along with my 255cu/ft Ox.

The Ox should last me 1 year and the map should last 5 or more.

For me it is cheaper to rent the tanks for $110 per year because filling the small tanks 2~3 times per year exceeded the cost of the rental.

I have been told by my supplier that Mapp will no longer be available when the current inventory is exhausted.

Regardless of which gas you use be aware that the cutting tips are different for Acetylene, Mapp and propane.

Tractor supply sells Ox/Accet tanks which when empty you bring back there to exchange however the upfront cost is huge but they are yours to keep, no rentals.

Check out the options and see which one suits you best.

When you are in a pickle there is no substitution for the liquid wrench!

 

[Slingblade]

I sure do appreciate the advise on this. When I retired from the Navy I took welding at the community college with the intent to complete it and get certified. That didn't work out as I got hired on full time with a place here in town doing what I did before. I only completed one quarter of school. I did learn how to weld with oxy/acetalyne. The way I was taught growing up wasn't welding, more like brazing. I got no better than fair at stick. The vertical and overhead was the most difficult. It takes a good deal of time to get good from what I understand. One that I really loved was dual shield MIG welding. Anyway, I bought a Lincoln 180C MIG over a year ago and haven't used it yet. I still have a strong desire to get into welding and fabricating, but something else usually takes my time from me.

 

[seafish]

Can someone please post here the basic regulator pressure settings for oxygen and for acytelene for cutting and/or heating operations. I rarely use my tanks and have only taken a basic 1 day workshop, so I am continually forgetting the settings when I do need to use the torch. TIA

 

[GHarman]

seafish, Most welding torch tips are equal pressure, Oxy and acetylene. Lower pressure for the small orifices and higher for the larger orifices. Smith equipment is different from Victor, etc. However, you can get a card from your welding gas supplier that Victor publishes, that gives all the information you need. You can tweek your pressures to make the flame an oxidizing, neutral or carburizing. Just dont use to much oxygen when you weld. I welded small diameter natural gas distribution piping with Smith Equipment. A #7 tip was set at around 5-7# equal pressure with a carburizing flame. We welded outside and the more the wind blew the more acetylene we had to use to compensate for the wind. Then the gas company went to P. E. pipe and the oxy acetylene rigs were used only for maintainence of older systems and cutting. I know this is round about but the card (correct for the manufacturer) pressures are published and available, with some good safety information. I will post the product number in a few days. I'll have to locate it. GregH

 

[seafish]

Greg, thanks for the info... all very useful... so a would a cutting or heating flame with a larger tip still use more or less equal pressures??

 

[Simplysmn]

If your just going to be useing it for cutting you might want to also look into a Oxy/Propane set/up My dad use to do a lot of cutting and the propane was a very nice choice we could get 1 tank of propane to 2 of the large oxygen bottles Just a thought ? the only change he did was get a propane tip

 

[GHarman]

Heating tip pressures increase as your orifice size increases. A heating tip really consumes the gas! Cutting tip pressures are NOT equal. You will use many times more oxygen than you will use acetylene. However, I am being purposely vague because you do not have your equipment, yet? Get your torch kit and then we can be specific, one of those pressure cards should be included in the kit. If you are buying a Victor, which one? There are several sizes. GregH

 

[Dieselnut59]

I have the largest tanks you can purchase, both at my personal shop and at my company. I later bought an extra set for each shop because often one gas runs out before the other, usually during a job. This way you can swap to the full tank, then take the empty back for exchange at your convenience.

 

[Dan_69GTX]

I recommend that if you have the $ purchase your tanks. In the long run you will save a lot of $$. I have 7 tanks of various sizes with different types of gases. Purchasing used is the best but the riskiest. Make sure they are CUSTOMER OWNED tanks and they have proof or that the local welding store where they filled them has proof. Depending on your supplier you may still be responsible for hydro testing of the cylinders ($25 was my last time - 2 years ago).

The larger the tank the cheaper the contents (per volume) - but harder to move around.

I use propane or Acetylene - depending on what I want to do. Propane is very cheap compared to Acetylene but doesn't burn near as hot. I mostly use my torch for cutting/heating so propane is fine - unless I have thick metal - then I need Acetylene.

Note on customer owned - some suppliers will only fill your tank and return it to you (time delay on getting your tank filled). Others will swap out tanks. My local supplier will swap tanks and take care of the hydro as long as I don't return an "expired" tank.

GHarman has EXCELLENT advice. I'll also add - NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER use the acetylene tank that is on it's side - it must always sit upright (remember the acetone ?). If it's been on it's side wait about 1 hour before using (GHarman - is that right - a little foggy here - since I always store/transport upright).

Hope this helps and doesn't confuse too much.

 

[GHarman]

Dan_69gtx, EXACTLY!!! Do not store or use the acetylene tank in a horizontal position! Seperation of the acetone from the acetylene does not occur in the proper position in the tank. You will consume acetone and create a bomb for yourself or the one who has to fill it.

General heating and some cutting can be accomplished with Oxy-fuel (propane and natural gas), however, neither fuel gas can approach Oxy-Acetylene in temperature, ~6200*F. . It is how and what kind of work you plan to do, with cost reduction vs volume of work that will determine the best course of action.

I own some of my tanks and rent an Argon bottle. I could have bought the argon bottle and a couple of refills for what I have paid in demurrage. Just some thoughts. GregH

 

[Ol'TrailDog]

I had the opportunity to purchase the tanks with hooded smiths a number of years ago for $400 from an acquaintance. They swap tanks where I do business.



Hadn't heard about the "expired" clause. I may be SOL. My welder and tanks are in Bozeman where I don't get to much nowadays.

 

[Grumpy John 4x4]

cutting

Plasma cutter only way to go!

 

[Dl5treez]

Check your local pawn shops. A lot of times they have tanks for much less money than they cost from the gas store.

Just make sure they are selling you owner bottles, not rentals. It is easy to tell by stampings, or by calling the phone number of the name on the bottle and asking them what to look for.

I picked up a set of owner bottles, sizes T for O2 and #5wk for HC2H, which are the big full size bottles, for 450 bucks complete with regulators, cart, hose, and a Victor head with 2 tips.

Just got lucky, right place right time. But I see them a lot in various sizes.

 

[TBartlett1]

Has anyone else used Mapp gas or am I the only one ?