P0336

[onagadale]

Good Afternoon Forum members,

My 2004 Dodge Ram 3500 has been giving me a Check engine light with code P0336. And of course when I went and put on a NEW crankshaft position sensor, 365K miles on her, it DID NOT fix the problem. Now, for the things about this that are throwing me for a loop. First off, when I get in the truck when it's cold the thing usually triggers the CEL almost immediately, and sometimes it misses and chugs along horribly but once it gets up to operating temp it seems to run fine. I have looked at the wiring harness for the crank sensor and nothing looks bad at all, I've thought about replacing the connector for the sensor but it seems like it is in great shape too. I will admit that the Harmonic balancer is an aftermarket Fluiddamper unit that I just replaced a few months back because of a different issue, but it has the integrated tone ring on this one and I can't beleive it would give me a problem. The crank sensor is very close to the tone ring but NOT touching it, is it too close ?

I have already ran into a small issue before with me having a BullyDog tuner installed but that never was a performance issue. I have tried to uninstall the BullyDog software for the time being just to see if that might be the cause but it doesn't seem to be.

Lastly, and this may or may not be related to this issue but I thought I would ask. I am in the process of building a 1978 Dodge Crew cab pickup that I am going to install a 12 valve engine into. I was cleaning up a 1990's fuel tank that I got for this build and noticed how much slime/black goop came out of the fuel tank when I was rinsing it out. My question: Have others noticed any buildup of this crap in todays newer trucks ? Or was all that goop just from the tank sitting for so many years before I cleaned it out. I've NEVER ran bio-diesel in my truck and they say that stuff can contribute to that stuff in your tank. I have a secondary filter on my truck besides the main one and I think it only has 10K miles on them , BUT, when this thing runs bad when it's cold it almost seems like it is short of fuel.

I know I probably haven't covered everything people might want to know about this so feel free to ask me any questions and I'll try to respond ASAP. Thanks

 

[Ozymandias]

If you still have it around, replace your camshaft sensor with the old crank one.
It needs both and they are interchangeable and can throw the same code.

 

[Darkbloodmon]

The Crank position sensor is the same sensor as the Cam position sensor on the 3rd gen 5.9.

The cam position sensor abbreviated CMP in the FSM is the primary timing sensor used on start up, after the engine is started it becomes the backup sensor after the Crank position sensor abbreviated CKP in the FSM.

"The CMP (Fig. 10) provides a signal to the Engine Control Module (ECM) at all times when the engine is running. The ECM uses the CMP information primarily on engine start-up. Once the engine is running, the ECM uses the CMP as a backup sensor for engine speed. The Crankshaft Position Sensor (CKP) is the primary engine speed indicator for the engine after the engine is running"

You can swap either sensor for a known good, and clean off the sensor surface aswell. But this is starting to sound like a cold start issue in my opinion. From what you've described thus far you have issues until the engine gets up to temperature. If the sensors don't solve your running issue the next place to look is the fuel delivery/fuel injection system.

More often than not on these trucks the running condition issues usually fall within the range of the fuel system and associated systems/sensors.

I don't think the Fluid Damper is apart of the issue. I'm running one and replaced both my Crank and Cam sensor with NTK units.

What sensor brand did you use to replace the Crank? Cheap auto parts store stuff is pretty crappy, I only use NTK and WVE branded sensors if I can't get or choose otherwise than OEM.

 

[Darkbloodmon]

If you still have it around, replace your camshaft sensor with the old crank one.
It needs both and they are interchangeable and can throw the same code.

I was writing a reply as yours came up in the thread. I was looking to see if they threw the same code but I wasn't able to find a code list in the FSM or diag information about either sensor to say for sure.

If you need any sensor it needs to be the Cam, as it is the primary sensor used for start up and the backup when the Crank sensor fails. This is indicative by its placement underneath the CP3 unit on the timing cover. The crank being easier to access.

 

[sag2]

At times our trucks will set a crank code when its really the cam, or cam when its the crank. First pull the ECM connector and check for any green corrosion. Use electrical contact cleaner and reinstall. If that does not work I would replace the cam sensor, which isn't quite as easy as the crank. Also confirm you have 5v to the crank sensor with key on.

 

[onagadale]

Thanks for the information so far. I have replaced the cam sensor and YES that sensor is a PITA to get changed out. Drove the truck some more and changing that sensor seemed to help but I was still getting the Check engine light to come on with same code and as I mentioned before you can "feel" the truck/engine misfire or hiccup as it happens. Next, I disconnected the batteries and took off the ECM connectors and cleaned them with electrical cleaner, dried them off with compressed air and hooked things back up. The next morning I drove it 30 miles for work and it didn't miss a beat and no check engine light. WooHoo !! Then BAM, I drove it back home yesterday afternoon and it threw the check engine light again and ran poorly most of the way home even though it was @ operating temperature. Last night I changed out my secondary "Severe Duty" filter that I added to the truck several years ago just to see if that might be the issue, although I doubt it since it definitely seems like a computer/sensor issue making it run bad and the filter only had 15K miles on it. Lastly, the strange part about this is that it only hiccups and does these things when it's running between 1200 rpm and 2000 rpm !! If your cruising along and hit the accelerator and it downshifts and revs over 2000, it doesn't seem to miss at all. Heck, I've even turnt off the overdrive at times and it seems to run better. VERY confusing !! I'm taking it on another 30 mile trip for work later this morning and I'll see if changing that filter made a difference. Thanks again everyone for your input !!

 

[Ozymandias]

Would be cool to see the freeze frame data associated with that fault code.

 

[onagadale]

Good Morning Everyone, hope everyone enjoyed your Labor Day weekend. I did enjoy my weekend as my truck was back to running correctly and used it for our usual camping trip this weekend. HOW, did I get it back to running correctly, sadly or thankfully, I have a pretty decent small town Dodge dealer that I've never had too many Bad things to say about soo I chose to have them take a crack at it. AND, as some of you tried to warn me of, the sensors from the "cheap" auto parts stores were the PROBLEM. I've usually had pretty good success with O'Reilly stuff, but NOT this time. Here is the part # for the crank sensor I got from them: STD PC590. Once the dealer ordered an OEM Cummins part# 68526830AA and installed it, Everything went back to functioning properly, even after putting on over 250 miles this weekend. Even the dealer service manager mentioned how they have seen "non" Cummins parts cause problems with the sensitive electrical stuff. Here's to hoping the NAPA camshaft sensor I bought doesn't crap out anytime soon. Thanks again for the help even though I wasn't smart enough to listen.

 

[petersonj]

Appreciate the update. Please, be sure to post back after a couple of months of driving to confirm your fix - very important to TDR readers.

- John