PDR Cam and HE351

[AH64ID]

Looking for people with experience with a PDR cam and the HE351 in a stock or close to stock application. Looking for likes/dislikes/etc.



Also anyone running DP gauge?

 

[JaredH]

I assume you are hoping to see what the true merits of the cam swap can be for a somewhat stock engine/turbo?

I have been getting ready to install a Hamilton Cam for a while now. Should complete the swap the weekend of Aug 15th. Not sure how the two will compare I think maybe the Hamilton keeps the exhaust valves closed a little longer than most in order to use as much of the combustion pressure as possible. They, like PDR I believe, offer custom grinds. Here are the SPECs on the HD Big Stick I will be installing:


Intake: 181° . 280”
Exhaust: 210° . 305”

Send me a PM after my install and I will let you know what I saw (I know... not a PDR).

 

[JaredH]

Factory SPECs:
Intake: 159 deg T . 050" . 235" lift
Exhaust: 191 deg at . 050" . 298" lift

 

[CKelley1]

i have three 06's with the pdr cam and he351 turbo. it works very well. we tow heavy and are after mpg at tow speed and load. the cam experts tell us the pdr cam gave more low rpm torque and other parameters we were looking for than the helix 2. we changed the oem out to the pdr to do away with the in cylinder egr and the pdr restores the exhaust cam lobe timing to the best spot for efficiency. change the injector nozzles to ddp 50 hp at the same time as cam you have the injectors exposed at this point and eliminates the labor cost. the smarty jr restores the injection timing, the pdr restores the exhaust timing the pdr shortens the injection duration. the combination will give 4. 5 mpg increase. and about 300-400 ft lb increase in low end torque the turbo works very well in this application. the only time the turbo was a little small i had a gross weight of 36,000 lbs pulling a 6% grade 15 miles long and ended at 9,000 feet elevation i could see the exhaust in the mirror and i had some black smoke i just backed off of it just a little to where there was no sine

 

[PWirth]

CKelley1, What mileage do you get? You have done everything that I would like to do on my pickup, but I try to make sure that I actually get a ROI on the changes that I make for mileage. I know what the marketing hype is, what kind of a difference did all of the changes make for you. What were the changes that made the biggest noticeable difference in mileage?

 

[yunk]

It would be interesting to see the cam specs for a 2003/04 posted and how far off it is from a PDR cam or others. My understanding is the 2003/early 04 are non EGR motors so it stands to reason the cam would be and probably are setup more favorably for fuel economy, a good comparison for those of us who don't know

 

[AH64ID]

It would be interesting to see the cam specs for a 2003/04 posted and how far off it is from a PDR cam or others. My understanding is the 2003/early 04 are non EGR motors so it stands to reason the cam would be and probably are setup more favorably for fuel economy, a good comparison for those of us who don't know

Yeah I have wondered that too. I have heard they share the same PN.



I am also wondering about the 6. 7 cam.

 

[CKelley1]

the smarty jr, pdr cam and ddp 50 hp nozzles combo gave the most mpg improvement for the money and pay back is quick . there was some expensive things that we tried that did nothing or made it worse some things worked but not cost effective. example the dynatrac free spin hubs was very disappointing in the mpg increase and with the dulles i needed the arrow craft spacers for a cost of about $2,200 the increase was about 0. 2-0. 3 mpg but the new 2wd low reverse is nice. over all the mods i made increased my mpg 42%. the replacement cams from dodge for any cr is the same part # and is the bad cam. as they depleted the cam stock on the 03 in intisipation of mid year change the early 04's has the bad cam

 

[RKerner]

So, the pdr cam comes in two flavors - the reground version and the one from the new blank. Will the regrind go 200k without causing geometry wear issues on rocker arms or pivots? I'd like to save the money and get the regrind but not at the expense of downstream issues.

 

[AH64ID]

So, the pdr cam comes in two flavors - the reground version and the one from the new blank. Will the regrind go 200k without causing geometry wear issues on rocker arms or pivots? I'd like to save the money and get the regrind but not at the expense of downstream issues.

They are currently out of the new blanks, I guess they don't sell many and don't know when they will get any more.

 

[ZBrooks]

How much moolah are we talking here?

 

[CKelley1]

i went the new route on all three of our trucks pdr claims the regrind is ok. i can not find my ticket i think it was $500 us, they are in canada they have a shiping u. s. address in washington

 

[JExum]

CKelly my truck set up is similar to yours except i have the regular smarty question what kind of mpgs are you getting and how much is pdr cam helping on mpgs and power in your estimate? I run mine on #9 time advance to get between 17-18 mpg on highway.

 

[Bill Weber]

Had a PDR cam and DPP 50 HP injectors installed last year. Power went up but no change in fuel economy.



Bill

 

[CKelley1]

i used the smarty jr to restore timing the cam to restore exhaust valve timing and the ddp 50's to restore duration and minimize the 3rd injection pulse. the combination gave 4. 5 mpg increase and my oil is no longer solid black after 10 minutes. all of the mod's were to increase mpg. we tow and i can tell you this, these mods give a huge torque gain. it is a trailer pullers dream. as far as horse power goes i do not think i have ever had it over 2700 rpm under load and the dyno testing was done at 2025 rpm and 100 hp jexum on the first truck i changed the cam and dynode then changed the nozzles and tested again but this was at the 100 hp or towing equivalent load at 65 mph most of our long trips are pulling 5th wheel or gooseneck on some 400 mile round trips empty, no trailer to albuquerque i was at 14 to 15 mpg stock now at about 23 mpg if the dyno results follow the same ratio i would say that the cam ddp and smarty was nearly equal. and probably more than the 4. 5 that i stated. the intake side of turbo mods was very hard to estimate empty and the wind made the towing figures fly all over the place at first then we discovered we could test some items like the tag on the dyno. the cool hose with a thermometer and by blocking the tube on the psm i could compare by thermometer. also the air tabs, 1500 tail gate spoiler, tonneau cover could not be tested on dyno. the truck set up for the 5th wheel has the taylor wing instead of cover and spoiler. 95% of its miles is hooked to the trailer. i tried a ats a 3000 turbo on it with disastrous results. lost about half of my low end torque lost mpg threw p0299 codes smoked and ats no help. i am at 18 lbs boost and 850* egt average towing with the he351 and i think this truck could improve a little in mpg so i am trying one more time. i just installed a htt 62 65 13 ss with ss manifold and both the manifold and exhaust turbo housing wrapped in a insulated blanket. to keep the exhaust from contracting. but i have not been able to test it yet. the he351 on the other truck is perfect for it

 

[wcjp]

What Smarty settings are you running?

 

[Matt400]

and the ddp 50's to restore duration and minimize the 3rd injection pulse.

I know we had this conversation once before but it must have not stuck... how agian is it the injector size can minimize the 3rd event?

 

[cerberusiam]

as far as horse power goes i do not think i have ever had it over 2700 rpm under load

Thats how to minimize the 3rd event's impact.



All the testing and monitoring I have done indicates the emissions event is prevalent at higher rpm's and higher load. This tracks with where you get NOX emissions under advanced timing and higher cylinder pressures.



By advancing the timing and using the bigger tips to restore the amount of fuel injected it moves the power generation into the lower rpm's therefore one doesn't need to spin the motro as fast to accelerate and move the load. The ECU doesn't see the preprogrammed paramters that indicate it needs to fire the 3rd event for emissions so it doesn't.



There is some good evidence the 3rd event is present all the time as ore of an extension to the main event but it's impact is generally felt and seen in higher rpm's. Minimize the rpm's and you minimize its impact.



Thats my theory from observed phenomena but would really like Ckelly's take on it as he has done even more extensive mods and testing.

 

[CKelley1]

i use the tow setting. cerberusiam i came to the same conclusion. i did forget to mention the only drawback the 06 has a dual mass flywheel and needed to be replaced anyway but the torque band is very smooth and flat from 1,000 rpm and up. taking off with a trailer the clutch would slip at 1400 rpm and not even full throttle. the south bend kit fixed this

 

[Matt400]

I guess that would mean the ECM looks at RPM & APPS to determine the duration of the 3rd event. If so I can see that but sounds like speculation.