Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Please Help – clutch will not disengage

[Lazy-Boy]

Symptoms:

If the truck is off, I can pump the clutch a few times, start the truck and for a few seconds have enough clutch action to get it into first and go. Then I have to drive clutchless.



Friday night I lost my clutch all the sudden. At the time, the symptoms seem to point to the master & slave cylinder assembly. So yesterday I replaced both with a new one from the dealer. (The OEM master and slave are now sold together for the 2001 6spd. You can’t buy them separately. )

But after replacing the entire OEM assembly with a bran new one, I still have the same symptoms.

Maybe the new one is also bad? One very interesting thing that happened after I installed the new assembly - I could hear a squeaking noise coming from inside the clutch-transmission area. It sounded like a kid on a swing-set as my wife pressed and then released the clutch pedal. That was before I ever started the truck, just after the new installation. After I started the truck the squeaking went away a little but it’s still there. But I don’t see how I could have installed that slave cylinder wrong. There are not optional ways to install the thing?



I don’t know enough about the rest of the clutch system to take much of it apart.



Truck just turned 49,000 miles and is 3 years old now. I've replaced the 6sp fluid twice over the last few years. The last time I replaced the fluid was about 3 months ago.



If any of you got any ideas they would be greatly appreciated.

 

[SMorneau]

Sounds like the pilot bearing. Do a search on pilot bearings there should be some good posts.

 

[Lazy-Boy]

How difficult is it to replace a pilot bearing?

The master & slave cylinder was easy – except for getting up under the dash.

Most of you guys that have replaced your pilot bearing, did you have it done at a shop? Or were you able to do it yourself pretty easily? I’ve never messed with one before. I’ve got the shop manual and looks like I would have to take a lot off.



I hate to have to take this thing in somewhere but it looks like I may have to.

 

[Lsfarm]

Pilot Bearing:

This is a pretty big job. The trans is very heavy, and requires a good transmission jack or else it can be dangerous.



A clutch allignment tool is almost mandatory, and air tools will save hours.



I would recommend having a shop do the work. And since you have the original clutch still, I would take this opportunity to change out to a South Bend clutch.



The other option is to get help from someone with experience doing this job on our trucks. Not from someone who claims to be a mechanic.



Good Luck. Greg L. The Noise Nazi

 

[Lazy-Boy]

Truck at shop now

Well, I took your advice lsfarm. Some folks at my church highly recommended an individual they had dealt with in Denton TX. Called him up and he was actually gonna be at his shop for a few hours, and asked me to bring it on in (It’s Sunday!)

As I drove up I saw his CTD which needless to say, made me feel much better about all this. He’s gonna call me tomorrow and let me know what he finds.



I’ll post back with what he finds. I hope this bearing thing isn’t going to be something that everyone has to experience. I found to many post on the TDR about it. Seems like something DC would have updated by now – so nobody else would have to deal with it.



P. S. Thanks for all the folks in the 911 forum who helped me get home Friday night. When all this happened I had coasted into a bad part of town. I worried about leaving my truck there so I was having my wife post to the 911 forum via my cell phone. It was raining and getting colder real fast too. Wcjp and Rob Thomas got me out of there.

I really appreciated that.

 

[illflem]

I would seriously consider replacing the clutch while it's apart, labor's going to be your big cost anyways.

 

[Lazy-Boy]

Pressure plate collapsed.

Well, got a call from the shop this morning. They said the clutch was stuck in an engaged state.

He had not gone deep into it yet. Just letting me know it wasn't one of the cylinders. He was calling to give me some rough estimates and to get permission to continue deeper into the clutch. Called me a bit later and said the pressure plate had collapsed.



I need the truck back quick so he offered to put in another OEM or one made by Sax (Not sure if that's how you spell Sax).

He recommended the Sax.



Anybody of hear of a Sax clutch? Bad or good?

 

[Lsfarm]

Clutch

I would highly recommend a South Bend Clutch. I'm sure Peter can get one to your installer in record time.



I don't know about using a Sachs clutch in our trucks, I'm sure someone does.



The factory clutch is barely adequate for even stock HP. If you add any HP, you will have a clutch problem with a stock clutch.



I'm not sure what your installer means by the 'pressure plate collapsed'. My experience with pressure plates is that they usually get weak and slip. Maybe the cover itself broke and the release arms couldn't pivot to pull the plate away from the disc???



The pilot bearing is a common problem with our trucks, make sure he inspects it and/or replaces it.



Anyway, I'm glad you didn't try to do this by yourself and end up with that trans falling over on you.



You might try giving Peter a call: www.southbendclutch.com 1-800-988-4345



Greg L The Noise Nazi

 

[scotmartin]

It is actually quite common for the pressure plate (spring) to get weak and not disengage. I have seen several cars do this. The release bearing pushes on the teeth, which are the edge of the spring, and they bend without lifting the machined surface off of the clutch disk. That is what he meant when he siad that it got weak.



Scot

 

[Lsfarm]

Depends on type of Pressure plate

Hi Scott, your statement can be true if the pressure plate has a diaphram spring, but if it has coil springs, if they get weak, then the clutch slips from lack of pressure. The coil spring type have arms on pivots that pull the plate itself away from the disc, and compress the coil springs. On the Diaphram type, the fingers of the diaphram itself are the release levers.



I'm not sure the type of pressure plate is on the 6 speed trucks.



Take care. Greg L NN

 

[rashwor]

I think...

That some of the early Rams (12Vs) came with the Sachs clutch from the factory (factory clutch in my '92 is a 13 inch clutch). I have a '92 Ram 350 with over 240,000 miles and the original clutch, LOTS of towing heavy (30,000# Gross). No slippage or problems to date. The truck has been worked hard, but does not have any power mods.



If the orignal clutch is a Sachs in my '92, then I would not have a problem with a Sach's replacement for my '99 or the '92.

 

[Rob Thomas]

The 6-speeds, do infact have diaphram pressure plates. Sorry that it wasnt the slave cylinder. Is your mechanic sure the throw-out bearing didn't come apart?



Later, Rob

 

[South Bend Clutch]

Just so you don't have more down time then is necessary, make sure your installer knows that the Sachs clutch has a 1 1/4" spline. You need a clutch with a 1 3/8" spline. The Sachs clutch can not to be used in your 2001 HO six speed unless it has been modified.



Good luck.



Peter

 

[Lazy-Boy]

Back on the road now

Well I just wanted to leave you guys with the final outcome of all this. Some of you were probably kind of curious anyway.



I had previously posted that the mechanic had ordered a Sachs clutch to replace the failed OEM. I later found out that his supplier was out and he had already ordered a Luk replacement instead. It’s my understanding that Luk is the manufacturer of the OEM unit that had failed on me.

So now I guess I got another Luk. And I’m worried about it failing down the road, just like the original did. Looking back I wish I had ordered a South Bend unit. The other orders happened so fast I really didn’t have a chance to make that request.

The clutch replacement ended up costing me a little over $1200. I don’t know if that’s a good deal or not. But I’m back on the road.