Engine/Transmission (1994 - 1998) Pulling injection pump

[KMott]

Ive run out of ideas and am going to get the injection pump tested, along with the injectors. It will be a lot cheaper if i can pull the pump myself. Is this a real hard job that requires a lot of special tools? From what i understand i need to diconnect all lines, turn the motor over and lock the pump at tdc (do i need a barring tool?). Then pull the timing cover off, and pull the gear (special puller or can mine work?) then unbolt the pump.



I am going to tab the KDP and time the valves at the same time.



Any info would be appreciated. I want to get all the right tool and parts and go at it next week.

 

[bmoeller]

Won't be that bad. Yes, the pump needs to be pinned at TDC. You will want a barring to when timing the pump, when reinstalling it.



The front cover doesn't have to come to just time the pump. It is a tapered shaft, and it can't fall out and drop. But since you will be taking care of the KDP, then you can do it then. There is a puller that is used to loosen up the pump gear. Will need it when pulling the pump as well.



http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item...&group_ID=2964&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog



http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?item_ID=56074&group_ID=1294

 

[WaynesWorld]

KMott,



I just pulled & reinstalled my pump. :-laf



If you have a manual, its best to follow it the first time.



The Biggest problem is that darn washer!!!!!!!!! :{



USE THE MAGNET APPLIED DIRECTLY TO THE SHAFT & ANOTHER TO PULL THE LOCK WASHER OFF !!!

If you drop this , it goes directly into the oil pan--BUMMER ! :{ :{ :{



Then make sure you buy a new one to replace the old one for a good torque on the gear.



This is a good time to increase the timing. Oo.



But first , mark the TDC on the wheel !!!!!

Use the drop a valve method. Rotate the engine both directions. Marking each time you GENTLY bump the valve. I marked the bolt with white paint as a reference point. Then take the distance between the marks, split the space, & mark it for TDC.



The rest is just R & R the parts. Its a good time to change the fuel filter now since its easy to get at.

If you have any problems, don't hesitate to ask for help.



WAYNES WORLD

 

[Jim Fulmer]

Talk to the person that has had more pump He!! than anyone... ... . from the word go..... 45 min it will be on the bench.



When you get it down it's not hard.



Jim

 

[KMott]

Thanks for the info. I got looking in my manual and it doesn't look like it will be too bad to do.

I got thinking about how much it is going to cost. Just to test the pump will be 250 dollars and if it needs rebuild will likely cost another $1200 or more. I think i am going to try replacing the injectors first, and see what happens. I am going to be changing them anyways, so i may as well do it now just to make sure its not the problem before i get too carried away.

Also, if the injectors don't do it, and the pump is the problem, would it be possible to just buy a 215 hp pump off ebay and put it on. It will be cheaper than having my 160 pump rebuilt, and is a big gain in hp.

Or can my 160 pump be rebuilt to the 215hp specs?



Im just thinking it will be cheaper to just replace the pump than have it tested and then rebuilt, and obviously the 55hp gain is nice as well.

I cant believe how much this thing has cost, but hopefully one day it pays off... .

thanks again

 

[Jim Fulmer]

Be aware that the Ebay knuckle heads know about 215 pumps and everything there selling is a 215 pump... ... . in there eyes. I've been getting PM's and Emails on this.



Before you buy a pump call Industrial Injection and see what a used 911 pump calibrated on the stand would cost. I have one as a spare but it hasn't been to the stand yet so I can't tell you the cc's it will put out!



Jim

 

[WDimig]

i have to pull my pump due to a leaking lifter cover gasket, i belive that it crakced a bit when i blew the head gasket in my truck about 2 months ago, and it's been leaking oil since, i put some red rtv on the cracked arear, and its slowed it down a lot, but i still got to replace the gasket, ive got the timing kit from snapon, soo now i just need a weekend to so this project.



wes

 

[Howard Durand]

There is a 215 pump listed in the classified ads under "parts and accessories - all categories" first page. Listing #10

 

[KMott]

That pump in the classifieds is looking pretty good. I called industrial injection, and they said they cant take a 160 pump as a core, and there is a 1000 dollar core charge, so that doesnt look so good. I think it was 1900 to buildup a 215 core if i send it to them.

What does '909' mean?

If i buy this pump, what injectors should be run and whats this going to do for power. I just dont want to get too carried away and ruin the transmission. I wanted to stop around 250hp, which would be a good gain because i cant see it having more than 140 right now the way its running.

Thanks again

 

[zstroken]

If you are retiming the pump then you can pull it off in what ever position you want. Once the pump is off it is very easy to find TDC using the locking pin. Then you can have your injection shop time the pump and lock it down of you. THen you just bolt it on and make sure nothing turns when you bolt it on and presto your done.

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

zstroken is right, especially if you're taking the timing cover off. Engine & pump position aren't critical when you pull the pump, just have the motor at TDC when you put the pump back in.



When you reinstall the pump and begin to time it, don't tighten the nut very tight until you nail the timing you want. I do 30-40 ft/lbs. Makes it easier to pop the gear loose again when you're resetting it to dial in the timing you want. Also be sure to pull the pump pin out before you tighten the nut initially. . . leave it in until you snug up the nut a bit, but you don't want to risk actually turning the pump and breaking the pin.



Lastly a barring tool is nice, but not necessary. I use a ratchet on the alternator to keep the engine from spinning reverse rotation, and one on a crank damper bolt to keep it from going the other way. It takes a friend holding your ratchets when you break the pump nut, and when you torque it down to 144 ft/lbs when you're done.



One last tip to install the bottom mount nut between the pump and the engine block: I use a long extension with a swivel piece and then a short extension. I wrap a little teftlon tape on the nut so it fits snug in the socket and won't fall out. Then I put a zip tie on the short extension but don't tighten it. I use the long pigtail of the ziptie to help maneuver the extension into position. With the nut stuck in the socket I can fairly easily line it up and get it started. Once I figured this trick out it worked very well to get the nut in there and started both times I've R&R'd pumps.



Vaughn

 

[Extreme1]

What's wrong with your truck that you think it needs a pump or injectors?

 

[KMott]

My truck has no pull power at all and i have fixed everything else. Fuel supply is good, turbo system was pressure tested etc etc. Ive been trying to figure this thing out since i got it three months ago, and have done every test possible. I have found many things that have been wrong with it, but fixing them has had no effect. there is a larger problem that is overruling all the little things that i have been fixing; and i think its the pump. I even tried moving my stock fuel plate ahead and it didnt change it one bit. Is starts and runs decent, but it sputters when taking off and at the lower rpm's (or maybe shutter is the word).

I had it down at the injection shop and they its the pump too. I am not getting more than 12psi boost, and its because im not getting enough fuel. (otherwise i would be getting some black smoke as 12 psi is enough to fully open afc)



Thanks again for the advice. I called up miller and am going to order up their timing set once they get em back in stock. I have been printing all info on this off to help me through it, I really appreciate it! For now im going to pickup a set of injectors and see what happens (of course i wont install them until i have the gauges setup) I am going to call PDR today and see what they think is a good way to go for injectors, and how their prices are. Im thinking 215's should be enough flow for what i will be doing. Or is there a better route than bosch? Not sure if ebay injectors are a good idea after hearing about the pumps...

I dont want to sacrifice too much mileage, but i suspect once it is running right, it will be better than it is now (which is only maybe 15-16 mpg all highway)

Kevin

 

[Signal73]

where you gettin your pump?

 

[Kawi600]

Barring tool

That 53$ snap-on tool looks an awful lot like a torx driver with a shoulder to ride on. Anyone got the barring tool and a torx driver set around that they could compare?

 

[Vaughn MacKenzie]

My truck has no pull power at all and i have fixed everything else. Fuel supply is good, turbo system was pressure tested etc etc.

AMink have you:

• Made sure the shutdown solenoid is coming all the way to the full run position? A friend had a '96 that was super weak and that's what it was.

• checked the plastic fuel lines coming out of the tank pickup? Mine almost collapsed on my '96.

• Have you dropped the tank to make sure the prefilter screen on the pickup assembly isn't covered with crud? I've seen them almost completely scummed over.

• Have you tested your AFC diaphram to make sure it's moving? If it's not working then your pump will really limit fuel.



Just throwing these ideas out incase you hadn't thought of them.

 

[WDimig]

it's not anywhere close to a torx socket, yes it's worth the money, trust me it makes barring the engine over soo much easier, most people get by with the altenator pulley, but if you belt is not in the best condition, then it just sits there and spins.



wes

 

[KMott]

AMink have you:

• Made sure the shutdown solenoid is coming all the way to the full run position? A friend had a '96 that was super weak and that's what it was.

• checked the plastic fuel lines coming out of the tank pickup? Mine almost collapsed on my '96.

• Have you dropped the tank to make sure the prefilter screen on the pickup assembly isn't covered with crud? I've seen them almost completely scummed over.

• Have you tested your AFC diaphram to make sure it's moving? If it's not working then your pump will really limit fuel. QUOTE]



Thanks for the ideas, but i have replaced the solenoid, had the tank off and apart, and i pulled the AFC system off and it ran the same with the throttle stop removed. Ive tried everyting anyone has ever suggested!



I ordered a set of 215 injectors and a number 10 plate from Piers and im going to reset the governor arm in the pump. Right now, my governor arm is contacting my stock plate in the middle and not where it should be at the botttom corner. The guy at Piers Diesel said that this will cause it to defuel early. So maybe that could be my problem right now. Either way its not getting enough fuel to create boost (12psi boost full load, and no black smoke)

I was already going to change injectors and fuel plate anyways so i may as well rule it out before i pull the pump off.

Isspro gauges showed up today, so i can get them on and ready for the new injectors and plate!

kevin