Pyrometer Mounting???

[buttugly]

What's the best and easiest way to mount pyrometer? Ispro instuctions say to mount probe in exhaust pipe just below exhaust manifold. Has anyone done this?

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2001 2500quad4X4 auto KN Black Leather loaded STOCK "SO FAR"

[This message has been edited by buttugly (edited 02-27-2001). ]

 

[Vaman]

I mounted mine post turbo... there are pros and cons for mounting pre or post turbo. To tell you the truth, I would like to have both. The numbers I've generally seen to be concerned about are 1300 max pre-turbo and less than 300 degrees post turbo prior to shutdown. The following is reply I got from Cummins concerning pyros. Hope it helps.

The pyrometer measures exhaust temperature and the probe is usually mounted
about 2 to 6 inches from the turbo outlet (after the turbo) and in that
area the exhaust temperature under 'full load' conditions should be in the
700 to 900 degF range. The pyrometer probe could be installed ahead of the
turbo for maximum exhaust temperature out of the cylinders (900 to 1100
degF), however, if the probe ever fails it goes directly into the
turbocharger and will likely cause a catastrophic failure of the
turbocharger.

Now, you will probably not see 'full load' conditions in a Dodge truck,
especially if you have an automatic transmission. You might be able to
simulate full load conditions with a manual transmission on a hard pull. We
would consider full load if the engine was on a chassis dynamometer and
pulled down to peak torque at full throttle. If you had a manual
transmission and could fully load the truck or pull a loaded trailer up a
grade, so the engine would pull down to peak torque (1600 rpm) with the
accelerator to the floor, you might get maximum exhaust temperature.

Usually the temperature out of the cylinders, again under full load, will
run around 1300 degF, but by the time it goes through the manifold and
turbocharger, etc. it cools down to the 700 to 900 range. With less than '
full load' you will not likely see these temperatures, unless your pyro is
not reading accurately.



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98. 5 2500, 24v, QC, 4x4, 4. 10 LSD, short bed, tow package, camper suspension, Westin nerfs, camper shell, TST PowerMax3, 275 RVs, EGT/Boost pillar gauges... Love my Cummins, no love for Dodge

 

[Mopar-muscle]

Originally posted by buttugly:
What's the best and easiest way to mount pyrometer?

thats a pretty vauge question , are you asking for probe mounting help or gauge in the cab mounting help ???

 

[Koa Man]

BUT on a BOMBED CTD, 1300 degrees pre turbo can be reached very easily. I have an auto and IF I was to WOT my truck empty up a 3% or better hill with O/D on, it will exceed 1400 degrees if I hold WOT more than 2 seconds. Good thing is 1/4 WOT is usually more than adequate to keep up with traffic no matter what the grade.

BTW, Has anybody out there ever lost a EGT probe mounted pre or post turbo??? If so, what was the result?


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1996 3500 Clubcab SLT, auto, 4. 10 limited-slip, TST #5, 370s, AFC spring kit, Psychotty, Dunrite converter, Trans-Go, DiPricol EGT, boost & trans temp. gauges, 9 ft. aluminum flatbed and tool boxes with Venco dump. Custom front bumper, Hadley air horn, PowerVision mirrors & 4" Stack Exhaust.

 

[buttugly]

Originally posted by Mopar-muscle:
thats a pretty vauge question , are you asking for probe mounting help or gauge in the cab mounting help ???

PROBE MOUNT


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2001 2500quad4X4 auto KN Black Leather loaded STOCK "SO FAR"

 

[ARARAR]

Ditto! Besides besdes a difference of 200-500 deg. post turbo is too wide a range.

 

[Mag]

I mounted mine in the cast elbow behind the turbo. I figured that until I did some major BOMBing, shutdown temps would be more of a concern than top end temps. After having the gauge in for a week now I've never had to wait more than 15 seconds for the EGT's to get below 300 degrees post-turbo so I don't know if shut-down temps are that big of a concern. The highest I've seen is 800 degrees post-turbo pulling a 7% hill running 25lbs of boost with approx 5000lbs in tow. To be honest I think a guy needs two pyro's to be sure what's going on under the hood. JMHO

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2001 3500 4x4 Q. C 6spd H. O Patriot Blue 3. 54 L. S. D U. S Gear exhaust brake Isspro EGT and boost on A-pillar
Greig

 

[TowPro]

I went through this same thing a year ago. I did not find anybody who had ever seen a probe break (that was properly installed, meaning not installed so deep it hit the other side of the manafold)

So I Mounted mine in the exhaust manafold. My thought are "the reason we are watching the EGT is to keep the temp below 1400 or what ever alunimum pistons melt at. So why would I want to see what the temp was after the exhaust went through the turbo where it got cooled off"?

Originally posted by buttugly:
What's the best and easiest way to mount pyrometer?

 

[Bigsaint]

buttugly, I think you have to ask yourself if you plan on bombing that rig in the near future. If you do, mount the thermocouple pre-turbo in the exhaust manifold, this way you can monitor the saftey of your engine while at WOT and monitor the saftey of your turbo at idle before shut down. If you do not plan on any fuel enhancement devices, then post turbo will be fine. I don't recall reading about a single thermocouple failure causing a loss to a turbo, more likely to crack that manifold if you install that thermocouple incorrectly. The "simple" math of adding numbers to your post turbo reading is not that simple, boost also comes into play and has to be considered for an accurate reading. Not much of a concern if your stock but a big concern if your bombed.
Hope this helps !!!

Scott W.

White 2001. 5 3500 ETH/DEE 4X4 Quad cab SLT,tow package and camper prep,Husky liners front and rear,DiPricol pyro,boost and oil temp gauges,Edge EZ,Psychotty air,Bully Dog stage III injectors,ATS 3 piece manifold,HX40 turbo,4" BD exhaust,4" BD E-brake,McLeod clutch,Mallory 4150 lift pump,Mag-Hytec rear,Mopar tonneau,Lund bug shield,PM tractor utility back up lights,Penda bed mat and blow by bottle is bye bye !!! I love the smell of diesel in the morning, it reminds me of... . VICTORY !!!
<A HREF="http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=1231655&a=9089608" TARGET=_blank><font color=red>My Truck</font></A>
<A HREF="http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=1231655&a=9089604" TARGET=_blank><font color=red>THE SAINTS</font></A>

 

[RAPID RICK]

I feel like a broken record. If the proper
placement of the thermocouple was pre-turbo,
Cat,Detroit & Cummins would install them in
the exhaust manifold. THEY DON'T. They install
them after the turbo in every big truck I've
ever seen. Rick

 

[buttugly]

Originally posted by Bigsaint:
buttugly, I think you have to ask yourself if you plan on bombing that rig in the near future. If you do, mount the thermocouple pre-turbo in the exhaust manifold, this way you can monitor the saftey of your engine while at WOT and monitor the saftey of your turbo at idle before shut down. If you do not plan on any fuel enhancement devices, then post turbo will be fine. I don't recall reading about a single thermocouple failure causing a loss to a turbo, more likely to crack that manifold if you install that thermocouple incorrectly. The "simple" math of adding numbers to your post turbo reading is not that simple, boost also comes into play and has to be considered for an accurate reading. Not much of a concern if your stock but a big concern if your bombed.
Hope this helps !!!

Scott W.

White 2001. 5 3500 ETH/DEE 4X4 Quad cab SLT,tow package and camper prep,Husky liners front and rear,DiPricol pyro,boost and oil temp gauges,Edge EZ,Psychotty air,Bully Dog stage III injectors,ATS 3 piece manifold,HX40 turbo,4" BD exhaust,4" BD E-brake,McLeod clutch,Mallory 4150 lift pump,Mag-Hytec rear,Mopar tonneau,Lund bug shield,PM tractor utility back up lights,Penda bed mat and blow by bottle is bye bye !!! I love the smell of diesel in the morning, it reminds me of... . VICTORY !!!
<A HREF="http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=1231655&a=9089608" TARGET=_blank><font color=red>My Truck</font></A>
<A HREF="http://albums.photopoint.com/j/AlbumIndex?u=1231655&a=9089604" TARGET=_blank><font color=red>THE SAINTS</font></A>

THANKS. . now to find the best place to drill & tap manifold? Any suggestions! I WIIL do more BOMBING!


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2001 2500quad4X4 auto KN Black Leather loaded STOCK "SO FAR"

 

[Koa Man]

Originally posted by RAPID RICK:
I feel like a broken record. If the proper
placement of the thermocouple was pre-turbo,
Cat,Detroit & Cummins would install them in
the exhaust manifold. THEY DON'T. They install
them after the turbo in every big truck I've
ever seen. Rick

I disagree. Often times manufacturers will do something because it is easier and hence cheaper. Maybe they stuck it there for turbo cooldown more than monitoring EGTs. They do not plan on having crazies like us bombing their engines, since most people would be satisfied with it stock.

 

[azcummins]

buttugly-
I put mine POST turbo b/c I want to make sure my turbo is cool before I shut down the truck. Pre-turbo would tell me how hot the exhaust is going to the turbo, but not how hot my turbo acutally is.
I was also uncomfortable with a thermocouple that could break and get ingested by the turbo. I'd rather have it go out the tail pipe and then state @ my gauge and go , " what the F&*^!!!????".

 

[Bigsaint]

#ad
This is from the TST instructions, should help. Here's the link
http://www.tstproducts.com/gauge_install.html


Scott W.

 

[buttugly]

Originally posted by Bigsaint:

#ad
This is from the TST instructions, should help. Here's the link
http://www.tstproducts.com/gauge_install.html


Scott W.

Scott:JUST WHAT I NEEDED!!THANKS BUTTUGLY


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2001 2500quad4X4 auto KN Black Leather loaded STOCK "SO FAR"

 

[Royal]

In the early 1970's there were a lot of naturally aspirated engines on the road,our company sold & installed hundreds of turbo kits. The new manifolds in the kits all came drilled,taped & pluged for pyro probes for pre turbo temp. indications. Thats where we installed them and I never saw any fail. If one breaks/fails it most probably was caused by some object coming out of the engine. The odds of a probe failure is about the same as
the driver being struck by lightning.

 

[Vaman]

I started this mess by posting that reply from the Cummions guy where he mentioned probe failure. I worked in nuclear instrumentation for 17 years and the odds of a quality thermocouple failing are about slim to none. I mounted mine post turbo mainly because I didn't want any shavings from the drilling or tapping to fall into my turbo. I DEFINITELY would like to have both a pre and a post turbo pyro. Anywho, my apologies for starting that mess... #ad

 

[illflem]

Just to add to what Royal said,I asked Banks about this and they told me they didn't know of even one sender failure causing turbo damage. Their advertising says over 10,000 kits have been installed on CTD Dodges,that's a bit of experience to draw on,and doesn't count the kits they have on have on PSDs and motorhomes. I think the odds might be more like getting hit by lighting twice.

 

[C1B1DIESEL]

front half or rear half of the exhaust temp are you checking, what if # 1 cylinder raise temp and probe is in back section. will pre probe see raise in exh, temp like post probe would. . 02$

 

[Neal Cassady]

Most guys tap the rear passage, theoretically it would be warmer since they are furthest from the intake charge. If you have one cylinder or three cylinders that is/are running much hotter than the rest I would think that would be a major concern.

I have seen large Cummins and CAT engines at a big truck uprate shop with pyrometers installed in each exhaust manifold runner. The EGT temps are usually pretty uniform across all six.

Dave D

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2001. 5 QC, LB, 4x4, Auto, 3. 54, Everything but Leather, Bright Silver Metallic, ARE K Series, Diprocal EGT, Boost and transmission Temp in an Autometer Dash Pod, Westin CPS Platinum Step Bars - Black on Stainless