Question about a fuel pump slipping a tooth?

[bgilbert]

I did not like being addressed as "4BT man" because I am not some idiot or an amateur mechanic and I don't like being talked to like I'm sort idiot, because of my post count or because I am not a Bosch VE pump expert.

Sorry to stray off topic, but I meant no offense with referring you as 4bt man. When I reply I like to address the member, (GL, Alan, DP, Philip etc) be it by name, abbreviation, initials or nickname, but I don't know your name and didn't see it in your thread. I didn't feel like typing out 'dieselcruiserhead', so it was either gonna be 'dch' or '4BT man', which I hold in the highest regard. I think its awesome that you shoehorned a 4bt in a Landcruiser. I've have a ton of respect for you because of that. I'm no expert. I've just learned a few things from being a TDR member now for a few years. I owe all my tidbits of information or knowledge :-laf to guys like Paychk, GL, DP, Philip, and KTA-Cummins etc.



Now that all thats out of the way, I've read you can try to spray pb blaster or wd down in the afc bore to try to free up the afc pin. While picking at it from inside the afc bore with a pic. Pic, and pb, back and forth.



Greenleaf must not want to type, but he can explain the R&R of the fuel pin. I probly could but it would be so vague that I'd probly loose respect from some of the newer members that think I know something :-laf .

 

[JLEONARD]

I'm glad we all decided to get along. This is more like the first gen family I have grown to love.

 Pic, and pb,

Bill I like this expression :-laf hope you don't mind if I use it from time to time...



Jay

 

[Greenleaf]

Sory

I have been having some family issues at the moment. (Brother's family) So I have been wearing my fingers to the bone on that subject. Say, anyone know Dr Phil's e-mail?. . no?





Paychk,



Ahhhhhh... What is that picture of that you posted, hummmm?











What's so funny?



GL

 

[dieselcruiserhead]

Thanks guys and sorry I put a harsh tone on the ealier part of the thread... Anyway, thanks again gilbert... By accident I retracted the pin all the way and the truck was quite gutless of course but I have felt it "pop out" as much as possible in these last couple miles and its back to where it was before. I have to heard down to Salt Lake City later today so I'll try to free it up before I head out. Thanks again guys... I did also spray it quite a bit with WD40 yesterday and had it sitting in it for a while but hasn't done much yet. Again does anyone know what pushes it out, fuel pressure?

 

[BushWakr - RIP]

See... . I thought if I left this alone for a bit it would "self level" and come out ok... ...



All the guys in here work as hard or even harder to get someone else's truck fixed/up and running as they do on their own vehicle... .

The computer make's it nearly impossible to tell what was really intended by a typed comment so we MUST take it as no inuslt intended as the starting point... .



The fuel pin, BTW is often a culprit because over time the small o-ring that seals it off begins to harden and loose it's ability to seal... . often resulting in fuel leaking into the AFC bore... other times the guide pin itself will not function at all... .

You can tell most of the time by removing the AFC top and looking at the "ramp" on the cone... if there is a good clean "witness mark" you have a good chance that your pin is working properly.



On my truck, I run a valet switch... most of the time I do not use/need any AFC fueling... when I turn on the AFC fueling and go WOT... I will often get a delay in that pin travel cause it's kinda sat too long... then, suddenly the thing just pops out fully and the truck will just hammer forward hard telling me it "popped out"... . it can surprise you a bit too..... wacky thing.



On the Bosch issue... . they are extremely unlikely to do ANY mod that is not "in the book".

They have a Bosch certification they have to protect. If they start doing things that result in a bunch of unhappy customers and Bosch gets brought into it, they could loose that certification... plus they can't warranty that kind of stuff cause it's well outside the "spec" so to speak.



pb...

 

[Greenleaf]

The force of the levers/spring(s) and the governor mechanism puts a good bit of force on that pin/lever assy. If you look at the pic of the pump, you'd see how it all reacts, working together. Well, most of it.



That little pin has some pressure (force) on it as evidenced by the scribe mark/witness mark it leaves on the fuel control cone ramp.



To get one that is "in there", OUT, I have removed the cone and started the engine. The force of the pump in operation, against the lever that pushes on this pin will push it out. It can however, push the pin out so fast, that the pin will travel on past the O ring. Cause a leak. You know the drill. In modifying the cone and allowing for further travel, the lever will not push the pin "too" far as the lever has an internal stop, the inner pump top.



With the cone out and the engine running, I have inserted a small screw drivewr in place of the cone to push the pin in while the pump pushes the pin out. With some light oil in the bore.



One could also remove the throttle lever and access that same bore by removal of the plug behind the lever.



-S



I could go on, but I think you guys get the gist of it all

 

[dieselcruiserhead]

My shop is 20 miles in the opposite direction of where I need to go today so I'm going to try to free it up using the rudimentary tools I have now and hopefdully that will do the trick. Problem is of course is when the cone is removed it pushes the pin back in. I do have some of those scribe marks in the cone but I believe from when it was last working, some time ago... Otherwise I guess I'll have to wait and will remove the plug and get to it that way. It definetely seems pretty jammed up in there but I imagine freeing it won't be too tough... bgilvert and others I am currently doing a long awaited buildup thread of my truck which I never did. If you guys want to read about mostly body work but there is some 4BT tech in there as well... Fitting the 4BT wasn't too tough but required the spring over axle conversion, about a 4-5" lift because the engine is so deep. Believe it or not a 6BT will fit too but just barely. It requires major modification of the front clip to get an intercooler in though so most run early non intercooled Dodge versions. Weight is not an issue because the cruiser frames (especially FJ55 models) are super strong and it is a leaf sprung suspension that is very easy to beef up. The 4BT probably pushes about 900 lbs by itself I figure and is actually well suited to the weight of the cruiser IMO... Wheels very very well too...

Best, Andre

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=410514

 

[JLEONARD]

Andre,

Try putting a very thin coating of grease on the cone and the pin will leave fresh tracks if it's working

 

[Paychk]

Paychk,



Ahhhhhh... What is that picture of that you posted, hummmm?











What's so funny?



GL

That thing is... now that I look at it... er... a... hmm... well I thought it was a side view of the VE pump for our trucks, But I'm guessing it is a 4 cylinder VE pump maybe of a VW? I got it from a Bosch paper that details the different styles of the VE pump. I guess I fouled that up.

 

[Greenleaf]

Jay,,



After I left the shop to go vote, I remembered that I for got to mention the grease trick. Thank-you.

-S

 

[dieselcruiserhead]

Guys thanks a TON... I tried to get the pin out via the pry method and ended up having to pull the thottle lever to get to that backside plug. . One thing is that I definetely was right, the pin is controlled by fuel pressure. . I WD40'd the inside and used a couple allen keys (screwdriver/etc will work fine) to get the pin slidiing back and fourth easily... It now comes out very quickly and easily with a little throttle... And the truck is now very responsive and responsive to fueling settings, including from the rotating the fueling pin. The truck is back to where I remember it! With this 4BT, it runs great and very powerfully at about 3/4 fueling with the full power screw about 1 turn in from max, but smokes badly. . At about 6/10th to full fueling, not much visible smoke (but it is night) and it still has good power, with the full power screw about 2 full turns from max. I am going to dink around with it a little more and find optimum power without smoke... I'm also pushing 20 psi easily with this WH1C so that is pretty sweet too. . I really with a had a good 4" exhaust, I'm currently working on a good cold air intake. But the power is addictive! Thanks again guys... ! Andre