Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Question about Dyed Diesel

[C.Solomon]

A friend of mines dad had a VP go out on his 98, but his LP was also out. He asked me what caused his VP to go and I told him if his LP was out then that is what caused it.



So he takes it to a local diesel shop and they tell him that his VP went out due to him running dyed fuel.



His truck had 140k+ on it and it has run on dyed for years.



I have had numerous people tell me this theory about running dyed in the VP44 trucks is bad.



I have also been told by a local that he notices less fuel pressure when he runs it.



This makes no sense to me, dyed fuel is the same with just a few drops of dye. You can put dyed in a clear container and in a months time it will be clear.

If this is true why can you run dyed in new tractors or anything for that matter with no effects?

 

[nps]

It's the old dyed fuel urban legend. Plus its easier to blame the fuel rather than acknowledge the known weakness in the LP and VP44.

 

[steved]

It's the old dyed fuel urban legend. Plus its easier to blame the fuel rather than acknowledge the known weakness in the LP and VP44.

Exactly... but...



Usually dyed fuel is in tanks for farm equipment, usually not as well maintained... could have gotten a few tankfuls of "junk" fuel.



steved

 

[nps]

Exactly... but...



Usually dyed fuel is in tanks for farm equipment, usually not as well maintained... could have gotten a few tankfuls of "junk" fuel.



steved

True (and agreed) but farm equipment is more $$$ to repair (and a whole lot harder to tow ) so you'd think that the other equipment being fueled from a bad tank would be seeing some problems too. John Deere uses the VP44 IIRC.

 

[Msilbernagel]

Recently, dyed fuel has had an exemption regarding low-sulfur requirements with the EPA, so it could be a higher-sulfur product as well.



This will generally be a good thing, until you hit the 2007 vehicles where the sulfur content will mess with the EGR, CAT, etc. .



Mark

---

True (and agreed) but farm equipment is more $$$ to repair (and a whole lot harder to tow ) so you'd think that the other equipment being fueled from a bad tank would be seeing some problems too. John Deere uses the VP44 IIRC.

 

[steved]

True (and agreed) but farm equipment is more $$$ to repair (and a whole lot harder to tow ) so you'd think that the other equipment being fueled from a bad tank would be seeing some problems too. John Deere uses the VP44 IIRC.

Usually this type of equipment has a MUCH better filtration system than you POS dodge filter... most are very similar to a FASS, fuel separator/screen and a really good filter. Think about what they designed that system to deal with... mud on a construction site in the fuel, very dusty conditions, etc...



steved

 

[Highfinance97]

My father has a 6. 5 and he wanted to run RED, and autowurks diesel said its ok for our trucks but not good for the 6. 5 because of some kind of optic eye. also they said there is not as much lubricity so its not good for the power strokes ????????



Michael

 

[testraub]

From what I hear... Nothing is good for the 6. 5 powerjokes :-laf

My father has a 6. 5 and he wanted to run RED, and autowurks diesel said its ok for our trucks but not good for the 6. 5 because of some kind of optic eye. also they said there is not as much lubricity so its not good for the power strokes ????????



Michael

 

[C.Solomon]

My father has a 6. 5 and he wanted to run RED, and autowurks diesel said its ok for our trucks but not good for the 6. 5 because of some kind of optic eye. also they said there is not as much lubricity so its not good for the power strokes ????????



Michael

But it should be the same fuel.

 

[Highfinance97]

It might be the same fuel but maybe our engines are tougher (ok not maybe,they are tougher) but has any heard anything about an optic eye in the 6. 5's??





Michael

 

[steved]

The only difference between non-dyed fuel and dyed fuel is the dye... at one time they had different sulfur contents... now it is only used to differentiate between taxed and non-taxed fuel. I mixed fuel at a pennzoil refinery, it was the same fuel.



I cannot give any reason that present day dyed fuel couldn't be ran in any diesel that runs non-dyed fuel. I wouldn't run dyed fuel just because of the fines... I have been dipped several times on the road.



steved

 

[johncameron]

I've heard the fines are redicelously expensive! Does anyone know how much it actually is?

 

[dmhollister]

The only difference between non-dyed fuel and dyed fuel is the dye... at one time they had different sulfur contents... now it is only used to differentiate between taxed and non-taxed fuel. I mixed fuel at a pennzoil refinery, it was the same fuel.



I cannot give any reason that present day dyed fuel couldn't be ran in any diesel that runs non-dyed fuel. I wouldn't run dyed fuel just because of the fines... I have been dipped several times on the road.



steved

I work for a Government Municipality and we are tax exempt. They fleet parts guys have started ordering dyed fuel for all our diesels because we are tax exempt. I was told by the delivery person that the fuel is the same, just has the dye added during the loading of the fuel truck.



I also have a friend who son is a fuel delivery person and he confirmed this. I also know that dyed fuel used to be different, but even the construction equipment are dealing with stricter emissions standards and cannot burn higher sulfur fuels.

 

[blacksheep4x4]

A friend of mines dad had a VP go out on his 98, but his LP was also out. He asked me what caused his VP to go and I told him if his LP was out then that is what caused it.



So he takes it to a local diesel shop and they tell him that his VP went out due to him running dyed fuel.



His truck had 140k+ on it and it has run on dyed for years.



I have had numerous people tell me this theory about running dyed in the VP44 trucks is bad.



I have also been told by a local that he notices less fuel pressure when he runs it.



This makes no sense to me, dyed fuel is the same with just a few drops of dye. You can put dyed in a clear container and in a months time it will be clear.

If this is true why can you run dyed in new tractors or anything for that matter with no effects?

Doesn't really take a month. In some cases minutes. A friend of mine who is a D. O. T. officer said they caught a guy running dyed fuel in his truck. They took a sample and set it on the window sill in a clear bottle. Went to fine him and about 15 mins later grabbed the evidence in the bottle only to see it had turned clear. They don't leave it in the window sill anymore. :-laf :-laf

 

[EGaskamp]

Red and green fuels are exactly the same fuel they're just dyed different colors. Be careful running that red fuel! They'll throw the book at you in some cases!



Eric

 

[DonS]

I've heard the fines are redicelously expensive! Does anyone know how much it actually is?

For the first offense, the IRS can get you for $1,000 or $10 per gallon, whichever is greater (26 USC 6715). Get caught again, and the fine is multiplied by the number of offenses.



Some states will get you, as well.

 

[JEastbourn]

I don't know how they know how many days you have been running dyed but the fine around NW Missouri is 10,000 a day per machine using it. A coulpe of guys have been caught in the last few years and they all got the min 10,000 fine for one day of use. Makes me never want to save a few pennies!!

 

[steved]

Also makes you not want to run anything in your fuel that might even look red... like Marvel Mystery Oil... or (GACK!) ATF...



steved

 

[SKneeland]

same fuel, just dyed. the only problem i could possibly see is that it sometimes can sit around for a long time in less than perfect tanks/conditions.



last i heard, fines around here were $1500



ive also heard that the dye is light sensitive. people putting fuel in those semi transparent tanks in the sun for a couple days , then running it on the highway



around here its sold as "off road use only"(certain amount of tax exempt), the only way you can even purchase it is with a special license. we use it for construction equipment, farm equipment, generators, boilers, etc.



and ive never been checked for it in my life on the hwy, nor remember hearing any friends having that experience.

 

[BillGotthelf]

The fuel in Port Everglades (Ft. Lauderdale) is kept in the same tanks and the dye is added when the trucks are filled. The fines here are $5,000 and $10 per gallon of fuel missing ( tank capacity minus fuel still in it) from your storage tanks. Freightliner had a memo go out about "Red Fuel" and warranties. If you have red fuel in your tank you have no warranty. Kind of made it hard around here when diesel fuel stations were getting red fuel after the hurricanes because our govenor made the decision to allow it in an effort to get fuel back out. It is kind of funny to see red fuel coming out of the nozzle into your truck. Oh I have a 550 gal skid tank next to my shop/house full of red fuel for our equipment and generators and I have a few friends here that got nailed for red fuel in there equipment.