Questions about heavy gauge wire (battery & jumper cable stuff)

[TomGolden]

Hi all,



After reading a few threads on various battery cable, jumper cable, winch cable issues, I am quite interested in finding a source for heavy gauge cables to make my own batter and jumper cables. And, when I finally get a winch, to use them also to make really heavy duty winch connections.



I know that at least one source for the cable, battery connectors, jumper cable clamps, etc. is Waytek Wire Are there any better places to check?



Next question. Since you can get both battery cable and welding cable in the same gauges, which would be better? I know that welding cable has finer wire, therefore more strands than battery cable wire, which leads me to believe that welding cable can carry more current with less resistance, thereby getting more of the juice to the end component... but would this really be of any tremendous benefit in our applications? I'm thinking at least for winch cables it would be better?



Now, which gauge(s) would you all recommend for battery cables? Winch cables? Jumper cables?



As to attaching the various connectors to the cables - are soldered ends or crimped ends better, or something else?



Thanks all



Tom

 

[Thomas]

Wrangler NW Power Products is a source you can look at for high-amperage connectors, etc.

 

[rholcom2]

Well Tom,

My grandparents own a lumber yard, and hardware store. I made my own jumper cables out of welding wire, and bought some heavy duty ends to go on it. I think they are about 25-30 ft long, I jump tractors and stuff in the winter when its cold. They seem to work just fine. I wish I could remember the size of the wire, I am not close to them, (me in TX, and them in IN) but when I get back I will try to remember to check them out.

 

[TomGolden]

Originally posted by Thomas

Wrangler NW Power Products is a source you can look at for high-amperage connectors, etc.

Thanks Thomas. I remember going to their site before, but hadn't bookmarked it, so I didn't remember the URL. I'll check them out as well.

 

[klenger]

Check out Arizona Wind And Sun



http://www.solar-electric.com/batteries-cables.html

 

[Dr.Kayak]

Tom: If you want some place local try West Marine @ 50 and Bradshaw. They have some big wire. Probable up to 4 gauge. It's high quality marine grade so it's a bit pricey.



I bought 8 gauge and connectors for connecting my camper battery into the truck's battery. I crimped the connectors. Hard to solder that big of wire without melting the plastic insulation.



There are charts that show the wire gauge/length/amps. I will try and find my chart. I know for my application I was right at the length limit for 8 gauge.

 

[HillCountrykid]

For any given size, which ever has more strands can carry more current. Not enough to make any difference when used in this application though.



Crimped ends are the best connection if done properly. At work we use hydraulic crimpers that work great, but most people don't have access to anything like this.



As for sizes, I'm not too sure. My Warn 15,000 lb winch was supplied with 2 AWG wire. This thing is rated @ 460 amps at 15,000 lb pull. As long as you don't carry that many amps for too long you're fine with smaller wire. For 460 amps continuous, you'd need 600 kcmil wire. That stuff is close to 1" in diameter.



Brian

 

[illflem]

The main advantage of finer strands such as welding cable is greater flexability.

 

[BTanzini]

When I made a set I used 2/0 welding cable with heavy duty clamps and never had a problem jumping any battery operated equipment. They are about 8' long should have made a little longer.

 

[SRadke]

It's easy to make really heavy jumpercables. The difficult part is getting a clamp that will be able to carry the current. I've melted quite a few of them.

 

[rrausch]

Another odd thing I read somewhere and stored away in my noggin is that electricity travels on the outside surface of each strand of copper, so the more strands that are in the cable, the more surface area you have, and the easier the electrons flow therefore there is less resistance.

 

[TomGolden]

Originally posted by rrausch

Another odd thing I read somewhere and stored away in my noggin is that electricity travels on the outside surface of each strand of copper, so the more strands that are in the cable, the more surface area you have, and the easier the electrons flow therefore there is less resistance.

Yep, I learned that myself in college Physics class. Charge "flows" on the outside surface of any conductor. Thats the true reason that being in a [metal] vehicle during a lightning storm is relatively safe. It actually has nothing to do with the rubber tires, which is the reason most people assume, who don't know of this particular principle of physics/electricity. That's why I was thinking seriously about using welding cable instead of battery cable.



Ok, so now as to the question of soldering vs crimping. On sych large scale cables (1/0 or larger), either method is going to be difficult for a do it yerselfer. Which do you all recommend? I would tend to think soldering would be a better connection, electrically, but as someone already mentioned I think, melting the insulation is gonna be a problem.



Thanks

 

[Thomas]

All soldered—2/0 and smaller.

 

[TomGolden]

Thanks Thomas. I have printed out your PM about how you soldered your connectors on, and that gives me some hope that I should be able to do the same myself. I was a plumber in my previous life - before finishing college and falling into the black hole of computer system administration, so I am fairly familiar with soldering.



For various reasons, I have always preferred soldered electrical connections if at all possible, so that's the way I'm leaning here as well.

 

[JWhitcomb]

Its worth getting the Waytek catalog, as they have a lot of stuff. They carry a crimper that looks like a very small punch press. You bang it with a hammer and it does a good job of crimping. Welding cable is the way to go. There is a line in Das Boot that says Thank god for large wire, ditto.

 

[Philip]

Don't forget your local NAPA store. They handle a good supply of bulk cable and hardware for these type of apps.

 

[GWHaley]

crimper

Tom, I've always done both. First crimp, then solder. You definetly need to get quality cable ends that fit properly. I use welding cable when I can because of the flexibility. I'd check welding supplies for cable, but there is a place in Rancho Cordova called Fastenal Co. that sells nuts and bolts and other stuff and I think they have good cable ends. I also know the local Hi-Line dist. and I'll ask him what he has and let you know.

 

[illflem]

I've always thought that soldering was the best way to go but read an article recently that stated unless the solder joint is sealed airtight or cleaned that commonly used soldering flux will cause the copper wire to start corroding at the joint.

Many of you have probably witnessed this when a wire easily breaks off right at the solder joint. In most electronic soldering nowadays solder joints are either chemically cleaned before the part leaves the plant or new high tech solders with noncorroding fluxes are used.

 

[HillCountrykid]

I've made alot of terminations, including quite a few 4160 and 12,500 volts. They have all been compression terminals. I'm not talking about the above stated hammer kind. I'm talking about a hydraulic crimper that puts thousands of psi onto the terminal. My uncle worked for GE and said that all of the military contracts for submarines specified compression connections.



Current runs along the outdside of a conductor. This is called the skin effect.

 

[GWHaley]

One other thing I forgot to mention is that I always use shrink tubing over any connection (compression, solder or a combination). The kind that has the sealant in it is the best.