Rear Axle/Brake Combos

[Kiohio]

Are all Cummins equipped first gens rear brakes the same?

I know some had 2. 5" and some 3" anything else?



The 89 in my sig supposedly had the rear brakes completely went thru not long ago.

EXCEPT the drums weren't replaced, the reason was that the drums were not available.

I just stopped in the same parts place (picking up something else), they noticed the truck and said "don't come here for drums on that thing they aren't available anywhere".

Now the parts place isn't a typical parts place, it's also a pretty good sized truck garage that sells parts.

I need the truck everyday and want to get all the parts then do the whole rearend brake system this weekend.

Is it possible this truck has something unusual, being that it's an '89.

I'm thinking they weren't looking under diesel in their books and were getting the 11" drums and they weren't fitting.



Also I can get 12x3 Drums from Rockauto for 40 somthing each, Advanceauto wants 75 for the cheapest ones.

Has anyone had bad experiences with the cheaper drums?



Thanks, KO

 

[BHiggins]

I've had two first gens, my last was a 1990 W250 and the one I have now is a 1992 W350. I never had a problem getting drums for either. If you do go with the "cheap" drums, just have them cut before you put them on. I know, I know, "if they're new they shouldn't need to be cut"... Cheap insurance against a pulsating pedal.

 

[1stgen4evr]

I think that if you get to the right place you can get the drums. The 89 did use a narrow shoe but if you remove the ridge, you can go with the wide shoe and you can also use one size larger wheel cylinder. You might get more rear braking (lock up) than you need if you do both to a truck that is only a commuter, but if you are always loaded a bit, the effect is better braking.



James

 

[Kiohio]

Thats what I was thinking on the shoes/drums.

I don't know why they couldn't find the drums before.

I have had no trouble anywhere I have looked.

I am going to go with the 1 ton wheel cyls, 12x3 brakes and the new drums.

I just put the flatbed on and I know it's heavier than the factory bed so that may very well be enough co copunteract the extra braking while not towing.

I will use it for a 50/50 combo of towing/commuter wehicle.

I have never seen drums that look as bad as the ones I have on the truck now.



KO

 

[tugboatphil]

KO,



I was just up to Ashland to do my rear brakes. Greenleaf had checked with NAPA about drum availablity, and they said they could get them. I did end up needing one drum. However, I had put my old 3:07 axle in back for ballast, in case it snowed on me while I was up there. It was from a 90 D250. We removed the lugs and switched them out with no problem. Don't know if the 89 was different from the 90, but this swap worked out fine.



I was very surprised how bad the little hardware parts were. We replaced all but the curved cable guide that attaches to the shoes. I did my best to reassemble things incorrectly, but Scott would smack me in the head with a 3/4" breaker bar and I would see better after that. :-laf



We also replaced the Ebrake cables, as mine were pretty well frozen. Big difference with new ones!!

 

[Kiohio]

E-Brake..... What is this E-Brake you speak of????

I don't think I've ever had a working one LOL

Well except on the 03.

If I'd known you were goin' Ashland I'd have let you 2 do mine.

"The Big Rearend Party" OK maybe that wouldn't be a good name for it.

I LOVE the smell of Gear Oil in the morning MMMMMM---MMMMMM

I saw the pics!

I thought it looked like Scott had wacked you a time or twelve.

:-laf :-laf :-laf :-laf



I think I'll go ahead and order all of the stuff so I can have it for the weekend.

Brake hardware included, not sure about the ebake cables, will have to see if advance can get them.

Honestly I've been too afraid to try my ebake, afraid it would be stuck in the "on" position.



Thanks, KO

 

[JLEONARD]

KO. . I highly suggest that you do a good inspection of the new parts and compare to the ones in there now before you get all pumped up to rip things apart. Make sure the parts are indeed the correct ones.

I say this because of my experience when I did mine... . Oh yes, the parts store had no problems finding the right parts according to the info in the door stickers... problem is the stickers didn't reflect what was really in the truck.

The solution was to have the parts store order every possible combination of Dodge 3/4 thru 1 ton they could find.

The largest of all of them was what I needed, including drums with an extruded cebnter section (don't know what else to call it). It turns out my truck has a 1 ton axle (with 3/4 ton springs)... who'd a thunk??

 

[Kiohio]

JLEONARD- By extruded do you mean basically that the wheel mount surface was out away from the brakes instead of it being basically flat and close to the brakes?

If so it would be easy to tell just by looking at it right?



KO

 

[JLEONARD]

Yes that is what I meant. The drum is very different. Pull a wheel off and take a look ahead of time. It may save you a trip to the parts store.

 

[Kiohio]

I did last night and it is made like yours was.

Which means the 3" SHoes should be no problem.





Thanks, KO

 

[tugboatphil]

KO,



These are the part numbers we used on my D350. They were all purchased at NAPA:



2 ea Rear Axle Seal - 30033 (SKF)

1 ea Wheel Cylinder - 36057 (NAPA Brakes)

1 ea Wheel Cylinder - 36058 (NAPA Brakes)

1 ea Brake Hardware Kit - 2243 (NAPA Brakes)

2 ea Adjuster Cable - 80808 (NAPA Brakes)

1 ea EBrake Cable Short - 93587 (NAPA United Brake Parts)

1 ea EBrake Cable Long - 93876 (NAPA United Brake Parts)

1 ea Brake Shoe Set - SS- 358



EDIT *** I found my receipt. Per Scott's reply below, there are indeed different wheel cylinders. Also, the hardware kit comes with all the goodies for both sides. The shoes are the 3 inch ones.



Just for the record, the front axle seal is 22835.

 

[Greenleaf]

Hummm... ... ... ..... Brake parts. Fun.



FYI:

There are LEFT side and there are RIGHT side rear brake cylinders. You gotta do it all or it's just a patch job.

 

[Kiohio]

Wow TBP

Thanks for the list.

You didn't have to do that but I do appreciate it.

I'll put a little GO on my pants just for you guys :-laf



KO

 

[dpuckett]

EDIT *** I found my receipt. Per Scott's reply below, there are indeed different wheel cylinders.

And there are different sizes (internal bore) of wheel cylinders, to boot. I believe, 7/8, 1, and 1-1/8 inch. I have read here that the 1in actualy gave a better bite than the 1-1/8, or so one member thought.



DP

 

[Niki]

I have read here that the 1in actualy gave a better bite than the 1-1/8, or so one member thought.



DP

That could very well be possible if the master cylinder isn't pushing the required volume required for the larger cylinders.

 

[cerberusiam]

That could very well be possible if the master cylinder isn't pushing the required volume required for the larger cylinders.

MC's are the same for 1" or 1 1/8" wheel cylinders 250/350 trucks. Unless there is a difference in the proportioning valve the larger cylinder should give more braking force. Works great on mine.

 

[1stgen4evr]

If your system is otherwise in good condition, the abs will/can kill the effectivness of your rear brakes. Read Daniels post 'I have numbers' and my post on abs problems in the archives. Others have comments as well.



James

 

[JLEONARD]

I had the 1 1/8 cylinders. I replaced what was there so I can't comment on the difference.

Personally I don't care too much for the Dodge braking system, but then again I haven't hit anything yet so they must be ok.

 

[Kiohio]

I bought the 1 1/8 cyls.

The ABS has been disconnected on mine too.



KO

 

[dpuckett]

But you also MAY need to bypass the RWAL valve in the rear to truly bypass it. Sometimes you dont. I am doing fine with the valve still in my 92. But I have slightly larger than stock brakes which may make some of the difference.



DP