2nd Gen Non-Engine/Transmission Rear Brake/Hub Seal Questions

[MAYoung]

Brake System Bleed Procedures

Reference Information



For others bleeding their brakes the Dodge Service Manual recommends a few points:



1) Use brake fluid meeting SAE J1703-F or DOT 3. Fresh, clean fluid from a sealed container only.



2) Do not pump the brake pedal at any time while bleeding. Air in the system will be compressed into small bubbles that are distributed throughout the hydraulic system. This will make additional bleeding necessary.



3) Do not allow the master cylinder to run out of fluid.



4) If calipers or wheel cylinders were overhauled, open all caliper and wheel cylinder bleed screws. Close each bleed screw as fluid starts to drip from it. Watch the master cylinder to maintain the fluid level as well. (I did not follow this instruction. )



5) Attach one end of a bleed hose to bleed screw and insert other end into a glass container partially filled with brake fluid. Keep end of bleed hose is immersed in the fluid.



6) Open the bleeder screw at the wheel you are working on and have a helper press down the brake pedal. Once the pedal is down, close the bleeder screw. Repeat bleeding unit fluid stream is clear and free of bubbles. Move on to next wheel in this order: Right rear, left rear, right front and left front.



These instructions are contained on page "Brakes 5-15" of the 1998 Dodge Service Manual.



Regards,



M. Young



P. S. Mr. HHuntitall: When you announced that you had a fleet of similar Dodge trucks, I have to pay attention to your suggestions. Thank you for checking out your trucks and the differences present. The devil is always in the details with these trucks since manufacturers tend to change perfectly good systems for no apparent reason--at least to me.

 

[WilsonF]

I agree

If in doubt I'd give the old gravity bleed a try. Open everything up and let her drain, but be sure to keep the master cylinder topped off. This should accomplish 2 things. One you'll definitely get all the old fluid out and you won't have to pump and pump and pump and pump til your leg falls off. This method will usually get you very very close to a good, firm pedal. Then maybe just go over each wheel to be sure. But let gravity do the majority of the work for you.

I did it this way when I changed to GM wheel cylinders and purged the system. I used clear hose and could see the old fluid changing to clean clear fluid, I could also see the air bubbles in the hose. Takes longer but I was not rushed and it just meant more beer.



Floyd

 

[HHhuntitall]

P. S. Mr. HHuntitall: When you announced that you had a fleet of similar Dodge trucks, I have to pay attention to your suggestions. Thank you for checking out your trucks and the differences present. The devil is always in the details with these trucks since manufacturers tend to change perfectly good systems for no apparent reason--at least to me.

Well, sometimes, that doesn't mean much. But I do wrench on all my own trucks, which doesn't make me intelligent, but I do have the experience. Most times, I can tell you how NOT to do something... . There are a lot of us on here that can help you, so just wade through the forums and keep asking questions. Most times I can find the answer just by reading some forums.



Also, you seem to have excellent writing skills, so it shouldn't take long for you to catch up on wrenching for yourself. Have fun, that's the biggest thing for me.



God bless,

Casey

 

[MAYoung]

Rear Drum Brake/Hub Maintenance

Update: Saturday, February 19, 2011, 10:10 PM PST



Gentlemen:



I think that I am getting closer to bleeding the brakes lines free of air. I went around the truck one more time and bled the brakes per the Dodge FSM procedures (outlined above) and there was a marked improvement in the brake pedal feel. I would guess that I am about 80% there so I will bleed the brakes again tomorrow to see if I can improve it further--which I believe that I can.



Before I do that, I am going over to Kragan or Sears and find a long handle bleed screw/nut wrench (the kind that has a "dog-leg" at the very end to aid in clearing the bolts that hold the wheel cylinders to the brake plate). Using a little 5/16 inch wrench about 5 inches long is too awkward to guarantee a good opening and closing of the bleed screw.



I took the truck for a test drive. There is a short hill with a 5-6% grade that I can use to test the brakes. They seem to work fine--no grabbing, no noises, good stopping response. Just a hint of "sponginess" and a little bit of fade (I think). We are starting to move into the realm of subjectivity but I think most mechanics would agree that another round of bleeding is in order.



Thank you again for all the good suggestions. I remain amazed at the level of experience and skill sets that responders have with these Dodge trucks. They all demonstrate a great deal of real world experience.



I have learned a great deal about these brakes through this forum. I learn about automatic adjusters that don't adjust or limited slip differentials that are just that--limited in their performance (I don't even know if the limited slip feature on my truck ever worked right).



It would be an extremely painful and frustrating process without your suggestions. Once the rear brakes are done, I am moving up to the fronts. Just think of all the fun surprises that are in store for me there!



Regards,



M. Young

 

[MAYoung]

Rear Drum Brake/Hub Maintenance

Update: Sunday, February 20, 2011 11:04 PM PST



Gentlemen:



I bled the brakes one last time tonight. Although I found no obvious signs of air in the system, the brakes are now pretty firm. No fade or sponginess.



I took the truck for a test drive. The brakes are different in that I can feel the rear brakes operating to stop the truck. I am still not sure what the truck should feel like but the difference is both subtle and obvious at the same time--much like having trailer brakes on a truck.



After stopping the truck tonight, I checked the rear wheels. No burning smells, I could touch the drums without burning my fingers and the heat was relatively even from side to side.



I am going to check the wheel spin tomorrow one last time to make sure the wheel are spinning freely but I think that the rears are ready to go.



Although I saw no evidence of an hub oil leak, I am planning to change the seal on the right rear side. I also have to add the second 4 oz. of friction modifier to the differential.



Tomorrow I am going to put the spring that FASS sent to me for my Direct Dodge Replacement Pump. It should take me about a hour and I will report on that post the outcome of the spring change.



I am planning to go after the front calipers next. Don't be surprised if you see a new thread posting. Thanks for all your help.



M. Young

Fair Oaks, CA



P. S. This project started a week ago this past Friday and "Mr. Hotshot" here planned on doing it all in one day. A shop would only need a few hours so why would it take me a whole day? Admittedly, I could not work on the project as a straight-thru effort but I have much more than eight hours into the effort--probably about 16-18 hours total. I also try to clean up years of rust and grease along with fixing small items when in the area. Still, I learned a great deal.

 

[fest3er]

... Still, I learned a great deal.

And that is what TDR is all about!

 

[MAYoung]

Rear Drum Brake/Hub Maintenance

Update: Monday, February 21, 2011 7:02 PM PST



Gentlemen:



I drove the truck while towing a trailer today (less than 5,000#) for a total distance of about 50 miles. Some modest hills were involved. Stopping was smooth and non-grabbing. The rears feel like they actually part of the process. I am glad that I made the effort. Now I know what to look out for while caring for the brakes.



M. Young

Fair Oaks, CA