Engine/Transmission (1998.5 - 2002) Relocating the stock LP - Report

[SnoKing]

I sat on the fence over the years regarding the relocation of you lift pump. I had installed the improved bango bolts, a fuel pressure gauge and such.



So this week I bit the bullet and relocated the pump.



I did the Geno's Vulcan kit, as I had taped improved bango on the output of the filter for my fuel pressure gauge and I had drilled out the VP input one to retain the schrader valve for checking with my screw on gauge, if I questioned the in cab gauge. So I did not want to mess with the plumbing past the filter.



I removed the snap on bango fitting at the LP input and pushed a little air back into a 5/8 tank of fuel. Had very little fuel drop on me when I cut the line with mini tube cutter. Bleed it good before restarting. Results of first road test.



Pressure Before After

Idle... ... . 14. 5... . 15. 5

Cruising. . 12-13. . 14. 5

WOT... ... 6-8..... 11. 5



Also this is at 43205 Miles on the Original LP. Really use the truck, right! Thinking about installing the new spare to make sure that it is a good pump.



Also I may order a extra set of the barbed fittings for the spare pump. That would make swapping in a new pump easier and faster, with less spilled fuel. I do not think my DW would want to lay under the truck on the side of the road holding her finger on the fuel line while I swap over the fittings.



ON my STD CAB 2001. 5 the pump is inside the frame rail just ahead of the tank, as the box section ends at the rear of the cross member, just ahead of it. So it is well protected and should stay clean in that area.



I am retiring the end of June and we have some longer trips planned with the 5th wheel, that is what got me off top dead center on this issue. Sure wise DW understood these small project costs better!!! Because I really want a PDR35 Turbo next.



SNOKING

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I had considered use of a pair of ball valves to shut off the fuel flow before and after the pump(s)...



Then I got smarter, and used vice grips to simply pinch the rubber line closed on either side - works great, ZERO leakage, expense or added fittings... :-laf

 

[SnoKing]

Well after about a week, I can say that you do hear the pump running more with it on the frame. Fuel Pressure is good as reported above. SNOKING

 

[DPike]

We just did the same on both trucks with the Geno's kit, and see a lot less pressure drop at WOT. Nice kits, and I can hear them more too. Saved replacing the lift pump on the 2001, for now.

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I relocated my LP to the frame a few weeks back too - up on the frame about 2 feet after the pusher I've had since the truck was new. In addition to the rubber motor-to-bracket bushings, I also use about a half inch of proper sized rubber hose between the bracket and truck frame - no noticeable pump noise or vibration, at least with the motor running.



With the enlarged banjo fittings and larger hoses I installed at the same time, great and stable PSI - about 15 at cruise towing our 5er in the flats at 60 MPH, never below 12 PSI in the hills.

 

[SnoKing]

Well, I re-did the mount with rubber isolators. Will see if that helps the noise. SNOKING

 

[keimmmo]

I have my relocated pump mounted in rubber. I can still hear it, but it is MUCH quieter than when it was mounted metal to metal!!!



The biggest restriction in the fuel system is the fuel LINE from the filter to the VP. It is only 1/4 inch ID!!! I home brewed my LP relocation and did things in steps... doing the system up to the fuel filter first. I had drilled out the banjo bolts on the whole system when I first bought the truck. The BIGGEST IMPROVEMENT in fuel pressure was when I replaced the line from the filter to the VP!!!



Steve Keim

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

I have my relocated pump mounted in rubber. I can still hear it, but it is MUCH quieter than when it was mounted metal to metal!!!



The biggest restriction in the fuel system is the fuel LINE from the filter to the VP. It is only 1/4 inch ID!!! I home brewed my LP relocation and did things in steps... doing the system up to the fuel filter first. I had drilled out the banjo bolts on the whole system when I first bought the truck. The BIGGEST IMPROVEMENT in fuel pressure was when I replaced the line from the filter to the VP!!!



Steve Keim

YUP, I replaced ALL lines, including the stock steel ones with diesel rated 3/8 inside diameter rubber hose - the only remaining restriction that's less than 3/8 is whatever runs from inside the tank down to the frame into the added Carter pusher pump.

 

[Alphacowboy]

well, I didnt have such good luck with the relocated pump... seems the new LP I installed when I did it has now took a crap, it still puts out good FP, and stays above 11 at WOT... BUT, it ocassionally at Idle will jump up and down from 15psi to 10psi. I got under the truck when it was idling and I could here it every once and a while sound like it was cavitating. I shut the truck off, then turned the key, and usually is kicks it on and it purs for a while... now it just makes a weird noise, and maybe hits 10psi then quits. It use to hit 15 right quick, and it would slowly fade out to maybe 5-10PSI before I started it up. Now it drops really fast to maybe 3. Some times I wish I would have just bought a different system such as a FASS... but I guess I am lucky for the fact I have 3 lift pumps in my garage and in a mater of a few minutes I can have a new pump on it. :{

 

[GKarpen]

Get rid of all the bango's and it will improve even more.

 

[SnoKing]

well, I didnt have such good luck with the relocated pump... seems the new LP I installed when I did it has now took a crap, it still puts out good FP, and stays above 11 at WOT... BUT, it ocassionally at Idle will jump up and down from 15psi to 10psi. I got under the truck when it was idling and I could here it every once and a while sound like it was cavitating. I shut the truck off, then turned the key, and usually is kicks it on and it purs for a while... now it just makes a weird noise, and maybe hits 10psi then quits. It use to hit 15 right quick, and it would slowly fade out to maybe 5-10PSI before I started it up. Now it drops really fast to maybe 3. Some times I wish I would have just bought a different system such as a FASS... but I guess I am lucky for the fact I have 3 lift pumps in my garage and in a mater of a few minutes I can have a new pump on it. :{

If you got a software flash (maybe a Smarty) the new software only runs the pump of a second or two at key turnon. If you bump the starter it will run for 28 seconds or so. SNOKING

 

[Alphacowboy]

If you got a software flash (maybe a Smarty) the new software only runs the pump of a second or two at key turnon. If you bump the starter it will run for 28 seconds or so. SNOKING

Nope, no software changes, and yes, it use to run for 20+ seconds when I bumped the starter, not anymore, it just makes a not so friendly noise for a few secs, then shuts off. Pisses me off, sending unit took a crap last week, now this. Need new front axle seals, rear pinion seal now leaks, tail shaft on the t-case is leaking, AGAIN, steering box is shot, engine leaks oil every where, and I cant find the source, oh, did I mention it leaks? :-laf :{ Some times I wonder... .

 

[litespeed]

SNOKING,



Thats it... ... I'm doing it!



Was the install pretty easy? Looks like you have to remove a fitting from the top of the tank? How long did it take you?



Oh yea... ..... Did the bushings help the noise problem? Or have you not driven it enough to know?



We are getting ready to do some travelling too and I like the idea of having it on the frame rail. I took me 2 hours to change the one out under the hood (in the Florida sun). The idea of spending 2 hours under the hood on the side of the road (in the summer heat) is not my idea of fun.



Regards,



AJ

 

[SnoKing]

SNOKING,



Thats it... ... I'm doing it!



Was the install pretty easy? Looks like you have to remove a fitting from the top of the tank? How long did it take you?



Oh yea... ..... Did the bushings help the noise problem? Or have you not driven it enough to know?



We are getting ready to do some travelling too and I like the idea of having it on the frame rail. I took me 2 hours to change the one out under the hood (in the Florida sun). The idea of spending 2 hours under the hood on the side of the road (in the summer heat) is not my idea of fun.



Regards,



AJ

The installation was quite easy. As I said, I used the Geno Vulcan kit which is up to the fuel filter input. Beyond the fuel filter, I have the tapped Geno bango bolt with my fuel pressure gauge attached to the bottom of the filter and I drilled up the bango on the input to the VP to increase that flow and keep the schrader valve.



Back to the installation. I turned the air way down and blew a small amount of air back to the tank via the line removed from the input of the LP on the block. There is a snap out bango fitting that I removed. When I cut the line in front of the tank, I dropped very little diesel. I did NOT touch the connection at the top of the tank. After you cut the line with a mini tube cutter, you just slide the supplied host over the line and clamp it.



I left the old line in place and capped it off and plugged the other end for now.



And yes it is quieter with the rubber mounts. And I stuck a closed cell pad above it, that you see pink in the picture. Also I bought two extra barb fittings for my spare pump.



I have a junk drawer with alot of "stuff" and found a rubber mount with a 1/4 - 20 stud sticking out each end, and for the other bolt I found a large rubber donut and drilled the mounting hole out in the bracket out larger and put a carrage bolt though a plumbing rubber thingy to create the second rubber mount which I cut to fit between the tubes on the frame rail.



Remember, I have a standard cab, so yours may vary.



SNOKING

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

BUT, it ocassionally at Idle will jump up and down from 15psi to 10psi. I got under the truck when it was idling and I could here it every once and a while sound like it was cavitating.

Even with relocating the LP down to the framerail, there's no way I'd do without the added insurance of the pusher ahead of it. I was having severe cavitation issues, that's why I finally relocated my LP - after running down lots of deadends trying other maintenance and "cures"...



I use a Carter 4600 pusher, the 7 PSI unit - not so much added PSI to create system issues or cavitate on it's own, but enough to keep the stock relocated LP primed and fuel flow going.



I also have home-made flow bypass valves installed on both the LP and pusher in case either fails:



-



As soon as I did the LP relocation, the cavitation was GONE, and fuel PSI has been steady within usual load demands, including the just-finished RV trip down to central California.

 

[SnoKing]

One other thing! When removing the three nuts that hold the pump to the original bracket, be sure to use a thin wrench to hold the nuts below the plate. I found this in the junk drawer and it is now in the door pocket. SNOKING

 

[Joe Mc]

I've seen some pictures of folks that relocated their stock LP similar to the one here and have a suggestion - install a shut-off (small ball valve and fittings) so when you have to change the pump you don't have fuel issues. Oh, it's doubles as an additional theft deterrent also.

 

[mikeberry]

Gary k7,

What are your fuel pressures with the Carter 4600 to stock set-up?

Just wondering if it will consistantly be over the 15 p. s. i. on the gauge.

Thanks

 

[Gary - K7GLD]

Gary k7,

What are your fuel pressures with the Carter 4600 to stock set-up?

Just wondering if it will consistantly be over the 15 p. s. i. on the gauge.

Thanks

It's hard to make a meaningful comment as to my specific PSI, because I also use a rather restrictive sub-micron Frantz fuel filter, seen here on the driver side of the engine bay:



#ad




It is installed just ahead of the stock filter, and at the time it was originally installed, reduced overall PSI by about 4 PSI as measured right at the VP-44 inlet.



Since then, I have enlarged all banjo fittings, installed larger fuel lines all the way back to the pusher pump, and relocated the stock LP as mentioned earlier in this thread.



At idle, my PSI is about 22, cruise down the road, empty or towing is about 16 PSI, and never lower than 10 PSI regardless of load or hills.



Sorry I can't offer more.

 

[SnoKing]

Well, I retired last Friday and headed to the Ocean for 5 days. I may be a little goofy, but I think the truck runs and pulls better with the pump down by the tank. Stays around 12. 5 to 13 lbs pulling hard in OD on the hills, like the one coming into Olympia from the West. SNOKING